Masking and autism

[VoidCat]

Im tagging @Shadow Wolf cuz she might get it.

Im think about some the worse things regarding hiding autism from folk. And i think one thing is hiding joy. Cuz once you get excited about something once you get happy and you want to tell someone then you know you about to do something "wrong" you'll express that joy in ways that are abnormal. I for one now that I stopped masking will handflap when excited and jump up and down. I've heard from folk that are accepting of autism that it's kinda adorable I don't know if it is. But that sort of thing is seen as pathological by some folk. And sometimes when you talk of a topic you passionate about it gets pathologize. You get told to stop talking about it cuz it's annoying and you get told that it's abnormal to be as passionate about said topic as much as you are. You get your passions downplayed. Another thing is autistic have a hard time controlling tone. And I all the time would get told in the past to stop talking solely because it was too loud or that my voice which can get singsongy (another symptom of autism) is annoying.

I just thought I'd share this. It seems strange how we look at joy in those with autism and say no that don't confirm that is a bad thing.

 

[The Sum of Awe]

I'm sorry that you have dealt with rude people like that. People that shame others for expressing joy, or to criticize them for things outside of their control (like their voice), are heartless and their opinions don't matter.

In fact, nobody's opinion matters, it is best to be who you want to be. But it is also good to be mindful of what behaviors may bother others, if it seems like a reasonable request.

It seems congruent socializing is about an unspoken sort of negotiation at times.

 

[Aštra’el]

You interpret this as “masking”. Isn’t it really just a demonstration of self control? Restraint? Discipline?

These are strengths, you know. Controlling one’s emotions and behavior is not always easy.

 

[VoidCat]

You interpret this as “masking”. Isn’t it really just a demonstration of self control? Restraint? Discipline?

These are strengths, you know.

this is expected coming from you. For other folk reading cuz i know you wouldnt care hiding autism can shorten a person's life span and can make things worse for them.

 

[sun rise]

This thread OP provoked me to try to understand what is meant by masking. I found this: Understanding Autism Masking and Its Consequences

From that, I'm reminded (as a neurotypical) that I've disguised my feelings etc in front of work managers, in social situations etc. But obviously it's MUCH MUCH worse for those with autism.

 

[VoidCat]

This thread OP provoked me to try to understand what is meant by masking. I found this: Understanding Autism Masking and Its Consequences

From that, I'm reminded (as a neurotypical) that I've disguised my feelings etc in front of work managers, in social situations etc. But obviously it's MUCH MUCH worse for those with autism.

it's hard. It's like erasing everything and scrutinizing every little thing you do so to blend it. It takes everything in you and eventually you end up questioning what is and isn't natural for you. What's an act what is real? You end up not feeling real. It's exhausting and when you are in pain due to sensory overload you hide it. That loss of identity and that exhaustion just to be safe to not be judged to not be hurt is rough.

 

[VoidCat]

@sun rise Make eye contact. Yeah it hurts but oh well. How you holding your hands? Cross them. Don't flap. Your tone. Lower it. Add little expression to your face. Not too much you'll look like a freak. That topic you find interesting? Don't talk about it. No one cares. How are you walking? Careful. Be sure it's the correct way. That noise you hearing that's practically killing you? Don't mention it. Dont even cover your ears. Close to a meltdown? Shut it down. Feel nothing. Excuse yourself. Better to have a shutdown and barely able to do anything then have a meltdown. Then they'll think you're aggressive. Folk telling you to speed up because you do things too slowly due to poor prorioceptive sense? Afraid you'll make a mistake you speed up? Doesnt matter. Dont mention the problem. I said keep your hands close to your body. Careful how you move your arms. Find joy in a texture? Some fabric just feels nice? Don't touch it. Dont show your joy. Ah ah ah...no. That face expression you wearing cuz someone said such and such. Too expressive. Blank it. Someone said a joke you dont get cuz you too literal? Laugh anyway.

Watch your every move. Watch everything you do. All the time. That's masking

 

[The Sum of Awe]

@sun rise Make eye contact. Yeah it hurts but oh well. How you holding your hands? Cross them. Don't flap. Your tone. Lower it. Add little expression to your face. Not too much you'll look like a freak. That topic you find interesting? Don't talk about it. No one cares. How are you walking? Careful. Be sure it's the correct way. That noise you hearing that's practically killing you? Don't mention it. Dont even cover your ears. Close to a meltdown? Shut it down. Feel nothing. Excuse yourself. Better to have a shutdown and barely able to do anything then have a meltdown. Then they'll think you're aggressive. Folk telling you to speed up because you do things too slowly due to poor prorioceptive sense? Afraid you'll make a mistake you speed up? Doesnt matter. Dont mention the problem. I said keep your hands close to your body. Careful how you move your arms. Find joy in a texture? Some fabric just feels nice? Don't touch it. Dont show your joy. Ah ah ah...no. That face expression you wearing cuz someone said such and such. Too expressive. Blank it. Someone said a joke you dont get cuz you too literal? Laugh anyway.

Watch your every move. Watch everything you do. All the time. That's masking

Maybe you don't have to focus on all the little actions, most of these things (such as how you hold your hands, how much expression you have, what you talk about, how fast you move, etc.) you can figure out by doing what feels comfortable. But I agree it is good to control your emotions and prevent a meltdown, the more often you contain 'meltdowns' and instead choose to vent it through calm words to a trusted person, the easier it becomes to manage.

I'm not sure I'm understanding why you would want to control talking about things you find interesting. I have had it in the past, though, where I would be bringing up topics that people weren't enthused with and I had to learn to gauge that through practice - you can talk about anything you'd like (if it's appropriate for the setting) but if someone is not interested in the conversation they will not enjoy talking about it. Is there a particular thing you're discussing that someone dislikes?

 

[VoidCat]

Maybe you don't have to focus on all the little actions, most of these things (such as how you hold your hands, how much expression you have, what you talk about, how fast you move, etc.) you can figure out by doing what feels comfortable. But I agree it is good to control your emotions and prevent a meltdown, the more often you contain 'meltdowns' and instead choose to vent it through calm words to a trusted person, the easier it becomes to manage.

I'm not sure I'm understanding why you would want to control talking about things you find interesting. I have had it in the past, though, where I would be bringing up topics that people weren't enthused with and I had to learn to gauge that through practice - you can talk about anything you'd like (if it's appropriate for the setting) but if someone is not interested in the conversation they will not enjoy talking about it. Is there a particular thing you're discussing that someone dislikes?

Eh it depends on the people you around. I got heavily bullied by my peers as a kid for finding things too interesting and such. Also heavily punished by my caregivers. I was careful not to mention things more then once.

 

[VoidCat]

prevent a meltdown

Ah but sometimes hiding autism prevents you from being able to prevent a meltdown.

 

[VoidCat]

Maybe you don't have to focus on all the little actions, most of these things (such as how you hold your hands, how much expression you have, what you talk about, how fast you move, etc.) you can figure out by doing what feels comfortable

Why should I hide what body language i fine comfortable just to make others such? My body language when not masking is very much autistic. I have trex arms for instance(look up autism and trex arms). For me to hide my autism i often do have to focus on altering my body language and that alone is exhausting to do all the time.

 

[VoidCat]

Im reminded of this song:

 

[Subduction Zone]

@sun rise Make eye contact. Yeah it hurts but oh well. How you holding your hands? Cross them. Don't flap. Your tone. Lower it. Add little expression to your face. Not too much you'll look like a freak. That topic you find interesting? Don't talk about it. No one cares. How are you walking? Careful. Be sure it's the correct way. That noise you hearing that's practically killing you? Don't mention it. Dont even cover your ears. Close to a meltdown? Shut it down. Feel nothing. Excuse yourself. Better to have a shutdown and barely able to do anything then have a meltdown. Then they'll think you're aggressive. Folk telling you to speed up because you do things too slowly due to poor prorioceptive sense? Afraid you'll make a mistake you speed up? Doesnt matter. Dont mention the problem. I said keep your hands close to your body. Careful how you move your arms. Find joy in a texture? Some fabric just feels nice? Don't touch it. Dont show your joy. Ah ah ah...no. That face expression you wearing cuz someone said such and such. Too expressive. Blank it. Someone said a joke you dont get cuz you too literal? Laugh anyway.

Watch your every move. Watch everything you do. All the time. That's masking

Ow! No thanks. I would hate to feel such pressure from everyone. I have no suggestions because it is beyond my personal experiences. Just remember that you can come here for support.

 

[JustGeorge]

Im tagging @Shadow Wolf cuz she might get it.

Im think about some the worse things regarding hiding autism from folk. And i think one thing is hiding joy. Cuz once you get excited about something once you get happy and you want to tell someone then you know you about to do something "wrong" you'll express that joy in ways that are abnormal. I for one now that I stopped masking will handflap when excited and jump up and down. I've heard from folk that are accepting of autism that it's kinda adorable I don't know if it is. But that sort of thing is seen as pathological by some folk. And sometimes when you talk of a topic you passionate about it gets pathologize. You get told to stop talking about it cuz it's annoying and you get told that it's abnormal to be as passionate about said topic as much as you are. You get your passions downplayed. Another thing is autistic have a hard time controlling tone. And I all the time would get told in the past to stop talking solely because it was too loud or that my voice which can get singsongy (another symptom of autism) is annoying.

I just thought I'd share this. It seems strange how we look at joy in those with autism and say no that don't confirm that is a bad thing.

To anyone that tells you to mask your joy, I have this in response...


I was pushed to repress joy to a point I can't show it anymore. All emotions, really. My face is pretty blank. Strangely enough, if I am comfortable with someone, and want to express that something has made me happy, I imitate my autistic son... I smack my wrists together three times, and bop my head. I know of no other way! If I'm not comfortable with the person, I do nothing. So, its taken an autistic person to show me how to express emotions.

@sun rise Make eye contact. Yeah it hurts but oh well. How you holding your hands? Cross them. Don't flap. Your tone. Lower it. Add little expression to your face. Not too much you'll look like a freak. That topic you find interesting? Don't talk about it. No one cares. How are you walking? Careful. Be sure it's the correct way. That noise you hearing that's practically killing you? Don't mention it. Dont even cover your ears. Close to a meltdown? Shut it down. Feel nothing. Excuse yourself. Better to have a shutdown and barely able to do anything then have a meltdown. Then they'll think you're aggressive. Folk telling you to speed up because you do things too slowly due to poor prorioceptive sense? Afraid you'll make a mistake you speed up? Doesnt matter. Dont mention the problem. I said keep your hands close to your body. Careful how you move your arms. Find joy in a texture? Some fabric just feels nice? Don't touch it. Dont show your joy. Ah ah ah...no. That face expression you wearing cuz someone said such and such. Too expressive. Blank it. Someone said a joke you dont get cuz you too literal? Laugh anyway.

Watch your every move. Watch everything you do. All the time. That's masking

Forget this! Don't make eye contact! I did have to explain to my oldest that if he looks down when he's talking, though, no one can hear him. I explained his sound waves go into his lap. I encouraged him to at least face the general direction of the person(especially if they are hard of hearing). You don't have to look at them, I told him, but you want your sound waves to go to them.

Flap! I'm not even autistic(or am I? ) and sometimes I flap. Talk about those interesting topics. If the people around you aren't interested, find someone who is. There is nothing wrong with politely asking someone to turn down the sound(I say "can you turn it down? Its so loud I can't hear it" which people find funny, buts its true for me).

I'm 38 now, and I know no one who masks better than me. Interestingly enough, if you become to good at it, people don't like that, either. "Open up a bit! Smile! Why don't enjoy yourself?"

No matter what a person does, someone isn't happy somewhere... you gotta live the life that brings you joy(and then be free to flap about it!)

 

[VoidCat]

Im reminded of this song:

Anyone else seen this movie? Let me explain: the zombies and the werewolves are both not normal in the culture. Zombies fit in by abandoning what makes them them. Werewolves are new and they are being told by the zombies what to do to be accepted by the humans

 

[VoidCat]

Ow! No thanks. I would hate to feel such pressure from everyone. I have no suggestions because it is beyond my personal experiences. Just remember that you can come here for support.

I try my hardest to stop masking. That's what I do. Problem is I have cptsd. Sometimes unmasking causes flashbacks as does masking.

 

[The Sum of Awe]

To anyone that tells you to mask your joy, I have this in response...

View attachment 69947
I was pushed to repress joy to a point I can't show it anymore. All emotions, really. My face is pretty blank. Strangely enough, if I am comfortable with someone, and want to express that something has made me happy, I imitate my autistic son... I smack my wrists together three times, and bop my head. I know of no other way! If I'm not comfortable with the person, I do nothing. So, its taken an autistic person to show me how to express emotions.



Forget this! Don't make eye contact! I did have to explain to my oldest that if he looks down when he's talking, though, no one can hear him. I explained his sound waves go into his lap. I encouraged him to at least face the general direction of the person(especially if they are hard of hearing). You don't have to look at them, I told him, but you want your sound waves to go to them.

Flap! I'm not even autistic(or am I? ) and sometimes I flap. Talk about those interesting topics. If the people around you aren't interested, find someone who is. There is nothing wrong with politely asking someone to turn down the sound(I say "can you turn it down? Its so loud I can't hear it" which people find funny, buts its true for me).

I would say that eye contact can be beneficial if you can push through the sting and make oneself used to it, as with most social behaviors you see fit. But I agree that being told to not express joy is just cruel, and people like that should be ignored. What kind of monster makes others feel bad for being happy?

I'm 38 now, and I know no one who masks better than me. Interestingly enough, if you become to good at it, people don't like that, either. "Open up a bit! Smile! Why don't enjoy yourself?"

No matter what a person does, someone isn't happy somewhere... you gotta live the life that brings you joy(and then be free to flap about it!)

Well said!

 

[VoidCat]

I would say that eye contact can be beneficial if you can push through the sting and make oneself used to it,

How is it beneficial? For me it just causes pain doesn't help me in the slightest just makes others comfortable

Edited to fix a word

 

[sun rise]

(look up autism and trex arms).

I did Autistic Arms – Autistic Emmalyn

 

[JustGeorge]

I would say that eye contact can be beneficial if you can push through the sting and make oneself used to it, as with most social behaviors you see fit. But I agree that being told to not express joy is just cruel, and people like that should be ignored. What kind of monster makes others feel bad for being happy?



Well said!

I don't know. I can make eye contact. I generally dislike to, unless I'm comfortable with the person, and even then, if I'm talking about something emotional, not so much. I tend to look off, look out the window, towards objects on the floor(keeping my head up, so they can hear me).