Meditation and Concentration

[nameless]

I believe concentration and meditation are not the same.

Concentration i believe is to limit our thoughts and bring attention to one particular point, there is an involvement of mind in this process.

Meditation is a state of pure consciousness with no content. There is involvement of mind.

Definitely, Concentration is the path to meditation. From concentration we fall into meditation, there is no forced effort in this.

 

[Onkara]

I believe concentration and meditation are not the same.

Concentration i believe is to limit our thoughts and bring attention to one particular point, there is an involvement of mind in this process.

Meditation is a state of pure consciousness with no content. There is involvement of mind.

Definitely, Concentration is the path to meditation. From concentration we fall into meditation, there is no forced effort in this.

Interesting and thought provoking post, Nameless.
I would add that it is not possible to have a state of meditation with no content, assuming by content you include sense data, thoughts. Why would that be required, to what benefit does contentless meditation provide?

 

[zenzero]

Friend nameless,

Meditation and Concentration

That is right.

Meditation is a state when the mind is free of THOUGHTS and in that space when the mind is free the individual energy merges with the universal energy and that YOG happens.
Concentration is when the mind itself is used to bring about the point of no-mind or no-thoughts. It happens but more time consuming if time matters or else just another WAY.
Love & rgds

 

[nameless]

Meditation is a state of pure consciousness with no content. There is involvement of mind.

Correction : There is no involvement of mind.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Meditation and concentration can be regarded as disciplines.
Meditation as a focus and mind as activity.

 

[The Wizard]

> Meditation is a state of pure consciousness with no content.

I definately agree, no doubt about it. As soon as my normal mind or thoughts grab my attention, that reflective consciousness and detachment is interupted.

I guide concentration to a single focused point, then move it inward to become inner awareness, then detach from everything. At that point, I'm usually hit with prana or a form of energy, in which all this I'm still in the midst of understanding. When my awareness level reaches a certain point, it is as if my entire relationship in existence takes a new shape, a better shape.

 

[Dorje]

Concentration is the inner preparation to get to meditation. In the Kadampa Tradition we first do our prayers, then we sit down in the Vajra Position. Then we pick something to concentrate on. Lets say Compassion. So, first you contemplate and analyse what compassion is and why you need it. Then, a feeling will arise from concentrating on this subject. When that feeling arises you drop all thought and abide in that feeling. You can pick anything to concentrate on. Like Life, Rebirth, Emptiness. After concentrating on something for so long, a feeling will manifest in your mind. Abiding in that feeling is the meditation itself. Now, if you lose the feeling you go back to concentration to get the feeling to manifest again. Then when us Kadampa's are done we dedicate our merit's and virture's we have gained to the persuit of Enlightenment.

 

[Mr Cheese]

I believe concentration and meditation are not the same.

Concentration i believe is to limit our thoughts and bring attention to one particular point, there is an involvement of mind in this process.

Meditation is a state of pure consciousness with no content. There is involvement of mind.

Definitely, Concentration is the path to meditation. From concentration we fall into meditation, there is no forced effort in this.

there are many forms....
stating it is one thing, is perhaps a bit dishonest...

In the west for example we practise meditation that involves typically:

• ritual pattern making
• focusing on objects, or symbols
• concentration on concepts, images
• guided meditation which involves narratives that enable us to travel to inner temples.
• Chanting, words, vowels, God names

oops this is Dharmic....my apologies

 

[The Wizard]

I agree with most. If one wants meditation to be more natural then allowing things to happen effortlessly and without struggle is a good way to develope it. Concentration can help one establish the thoughtless awareness required for the benifits of the art. Many times, this can be attained through training one's own mind to focus on a single object or breathing... IMO

 

[Kriya Yogi]

Meditation is a technique of drawing your consciousness in and either focusing it on anything you want to occur in life, or understand more deeply. It can be visualizing with thoughts and focusing on that. In that sense you are using the mind to concentrate and meditate. Their is a difference however when you meditate on God or using it to raise your consciousness. Then you are using a spiritual technique whether it be a mantra, om technique, or kriya yoga(lifting of astral energy in the spine from the base chakra to the brain or spirtual eye), or whatever technique you use to bring upon God's presence. This is where you merge with an aspect of God, whether it be his, Bliss, Joy, Love, Expansiveness until your thoughts are out of your way and you become transfixed on that aspect of God. Its getting past the mind and into oneness with Spirit. So in the beginning of meditation concentration is used until thoughts and concentration become null or dimmed in the background and you just sit and bask in a manifestation or level of God's presence. A yogi then practices this more and more manifesting God's presence even more deeply than the previous meditation. A goal of a yogi is then to become so merged with that manifestation that breath is slowed down and eventually stopped, and that's where superconsciousness or out of body experiences can occur.

 

[Arav]

Kriya Yogi,

Have you heard of Yogiraj Gurunath Siddhanath? Alot of what you are saying goes with his teachings. If you havent heard of him, look him up and he has videos on youtube.

Hare Krsna

 

[Kriya Yogi]

Kriya Yogi,

Have you heard of Yogiraj Gurunath Siddhanath? Alot of what you are saying goes with his teachings. If you havent heard of him, look him up and he has videos on youtube.

Hare Krsna

I'm sure I've heard of him before. He doesn't ring a bell at the moment, but I will check him out. Many of my perspectives are from my teacher Paramahansa Yogananda. He as you might know brought Kriya Yoga and India's ancient teachings to the west from india. Thank you!

 

[Arav]

I'm sure I've heard of him before. He doesn't ring a bell at the moment, but I will check him out. Many of my perspectives are from my teacher Paramahansa Yogananda. He as you might know brought Kriya Yoga and his teachings to the west from india. Thank you!

I used to have a book by Paramahamsa Yogananda, though I cant remember the name. I also owned the Autobiography of a Yogi by Yogananda, there was some very interesting things in that book. I also have a book entitled "Kriya Yoga" by Swami Kriyananda, I believe that is his name. I really enjoy the teachings of Paramahamsa Yogananda.

 

[Kriya Yogi]

I used to have a book by Paramahamsa Yogananda, though I cant remember the name. I also owned the Autobiography of a Yogi by Yogananda, there was some very interesting things in that book. I also have a book entitled "Kriya Yoga" by Swami Kriyananda, I believe that is his name. I really enjoy the teachings of Paramahamsa Yogananda.

That is awesome! So do you follow a certain teachings or Guru? What was the best thing you got out reading some of those books?

 

[The Wizard]

Meditation is a technique of drawing your consciousness in and either focusing it on anything you want to occur in life, or understand more deeply. It can be visualizing with thoughts and focusing on that. In that sense you are using the mind to concentrate and meditate. Their is a difference however when you meditate on God or using it to raise your consciousness. Then you are using a spiritual technique whether it be a mantra, om technique, or kriya yoga(lifting of astral energy in the spine from the base chakra to the brain or spirtual eye), or whatever technique you use to bring upon God's presence. This is where you merge with an aspect of God, whether it be his, Bliss, Joy, Love, Expansiveness until your thoughts are out of your way and you become transfixed on that aspect of God. Its getting past the mind and into oneness with Spirit. So in the beginning of meditation concentration is used until thoughts and concentration become null or dimmed in the background and you just sit and bask in a manifestation or level of God's presence. A yogi then practices this more and more manifesting God's presence even more deeply than the previous meditation. A goal of a yogi is then to become so merged with that manifestation that breath is slowed down and eventually stopped, and that's where superconsciousness or out of body experiences can occur.

That is very interesting. I can relate to alot of that, being self taught. Another aspect I like to think about is the "melting into the Universe" or "oneness" experience. There is nothing like it for which could compare. This particular thing has only happened a few times for me, but isn't to mention all of the other phenominal things that have occurred and continue.

I would like to understand that particular aspect alot more, in specific. I am thinking that there is a specific way of getting there or causing it to happen more often. If ego means a separateness, then I would guess that the dissolving of it or perhaps the persistant program of busily thinking and reacting is what does it... IMO.

 

[Arav]

That is awesome! So do you follow a certain teachings or Guru? What was the best thing you got out reading some of those books?

I really like the teachings of Vaisnava Gurus like Bhaktivinoda Thakur, Gaurakisora Babaji, Srila Prabhupada and some others.

The best thing I got out of those books was how amazing the life of Paramahamsa Yogananda was! His life was so spiritual and interesting.

 

[Kriya Yogi]

I really like the teachings of Vaisnava Gurus like Bhaktivinoda Thakur, Gaurakisora Babaji, Srila Prabhupada and some others.

The best thing I got out of those books was how amazing the life of Paramahamsa Yogananda was! His life was so spiritual and interesting.

For some reason I forgot you already read that book. So you already had a pretty good idea about Yogananda and his teachings if you already read his Autobiography.

 

[Kriya Yogi]

That is very interesting. I can relate to alot of that, being self taught. Another aspect I like to think about is the "melting into the Universe" or "oneness" experience. There is nothing like it for which could compare. This particular thing has only happened a few times for me, but isn't to mention all of the other phenominal things that have occurred and continue.

I would like to understand that particular aspect alot more, in specific. I am thinking that there is a specific way of getting there or causing it to happen more often. If ego means a separateness, then I would guess that the dissolving of it or perhaps the persistant program of busily thinking and reacting is what does it... IMO.

Ego will no longer be identified to when you experience God as the being behind everything including your ego. We ourselves are apart of the great Self. Bliss will dissolve all desires and thoughts of separteness when Nirvikalpa samadhi is experienced.

 

[The Wizard]

Ego will no longer be identified to when you experience God as the being behind everything including your ego. We ourselves are apart of the great Self. Bliss will dissolve all desires and thoughts of separteness when Nirvikalpa samadhi is experienced.

That makes alot of sense to me KY (what are the fruble things about? I've looked all over the site just to find out how I got mine and why?..lol). Ya, bliss, the ocean turned silver and at one moment I was sure I didn't even exist anymore, I melted completely into everything, strangely. It is the attachments to the material world/Life/program of needing things and reacting emotionally to random thoughts that seems to be a main blocker... IMO. I'm still trying to get a complete understanding of the ego and what it actually is in a nutshell.

I remember another one that has happened quite often.. is the feeling that I am submerged underwater and swimming in some sort of illusion, like the reality I was using was just a fluidic substance waiting for me to lift my head out of it and into another light/world .. very strange experience, but also very enlightening. I always felt like Neo first waking up in that capsle in the movie "Matrix," same exact feeling, in retrospect.

 

[Kriya Yogi]

That makes alot of sense to me KY (what are the fruble things about? I've looked all over the site just to find out how I got mine and why?..lol). Ya, bliss, the ocean turned silver and at one moment I was sure I didn't even exist anymore, I melted completely into everything, strangely. It is the attachments to the material world/Life/program of needing things and reacting emotionally to random thoughts that seems to be a main blocker... IMO. I'm still trying to get a complete understanding of the ego and what it actually is in a nutshell.

I remember another one that has happened quite often.. is the feeling that I am submerged underwater and swimming in some sort of illusion, like the reality I was using was just a fluidic substance waiting for me to lift my head out of it and into another light/world .. very strange experience, but also very enlightening. I always felt like Neo first waking up in that capsle in the movie "Matrix," same exact feeling, in retrospect.

Well you are very blessed to have anything close to a samadhi experience. I honestly can say I have not had a samadhi experience. If I did I probably wouldn't be writing this lol. I would be in samadhi all the time. I've had very blissful meditations and a few superconscious experiences but not the shocking and enlightening experience of God through samadhi. Your whole perception on life would change from a narrow ego to God consciousness.

Yes attachments and everything that keeps you emotionally drawn to this world is what holds you back from expanding from your ego to God. Fortunately if you are close and your body and consciousness is suited to experience this shock it can melt away you ego. This first samadhi is called Savikalpa Samadhi. You can still fall back to ego consciousness until you experience Nirvikalpa samadhi where complete oneness happens.

About the Frubals look at the link called User CP. It will show you who gave the frubals to you and what comment they gave you. Along with any you have given out.