Mormon Church To US Supreme Court: Ban Gay Marriage

[The Mormonator]

Can you kind folks show me where I can find donate?

What are you donating, Peter?

 

[Watchmen]

Serenity, your posts seem to represent the limited views of only the most narrow-minded members of the Church. You realize the majority of Christianity do not recognize the atonement as having occurred in Gethsamene, right? You know there are well documented instances of abuse against women, right? You understand the Church does not have a monopoly on defining marriage, correct? You know that promoting religion in school is unconstitutional , right?

 

[Peter Hans]

There was a link on Facebook that brought me here to donate.

 

[sojourner]

Yes, I bet it is easy for you to reject the perfect Plan of Salvation as poor theology.

It's not perfect. No theology is "perfect." Every theological construct unravels, if carried out far enough.

I have no idea what Xy is, but you would know that as you have written it to stupefy me. You are not a very nice person are you?

"X" is the first Greek letter in the word, "Christ." Therefore, "Xy" is shorthand for "Christianity." Not subterfuge -- just shorthand.

No, my superior knowledge of Christianity makes you look stupied.

Homosexuals are infact misfits and outside of the envelope of what is normal.

No, they're not "in fact" misfits. they are in your opinion misfits. YOU have made that judgment.

That is what you percieve it is not reality

Perhaps that's not what you meant to do. If such is the case, you should make a greater attempt to say what you mean.

When you say "opined" do you mean "conjecture" or simply that you just "said" it. Damn thesaurus.

Opinion. I voiced an opinion.

You want to portray me as someone who has the lack of integrity and probity as to treat a woman in any other manner then respectful geniality and conviviality in your fumbling attempt to discredit me, thus weakening my position here. It is clandestine trickery and sophistry.

Oh, I don't doubt that you believe you treat them that way, and I don't doubt that you intend to treat them that way. I don't think you lack integrity in that area of endeavor. My point is that the institutional violence flies so far under everyone's radar that we don't even recognize when we're objectifying minorities. But your allusion to gold dust (a desirable possession we like to control and not share) is very, very telling in that regard. It ain't just you; we ALL do it without meaning to. That's why it's systemic -- it's part of our social system in which we're steeped. We treat "lesser" human beings as objects to be owned and controlled.

 

[JoStories]

Thank you for sharing this with me. Would you mind sharing an actual link? I want to know how they measured these things and what they focused on. I would also like to know if they continued the studies into the adulthood of those children.

Needless to say, there are many studies that would contradict what you shared and neither side has truly “proven” anything.

It is not as “patently false” as you would assume

First off, thank you for the incredibly polite and civil response. Its somewhat rare here. Here is that link.

Manning, W. D., Fettro, M. N., & Lamidi, E. (2014). Child well-being in same-sex parent families: Review of research prepared for American Sociological Association Amicus Brief. Population research and policy review, 33(4), 485-502.

 

[JoStories]

Would you mind sharing your opinion on this?


Since some people like to use the argument in defense of “same-sex marriage” that they are two consenting adults, so there is no issue, would you personally believe this logic could also apply to incestuous relationships?

My opinion is that if they are adults, they have the right to do as they wish, however, as a survivor of childhood incest and rape, by my grandfather, I find the idea repulsive. I also have two cousins who are first cousins who married. I don't see the issue of incest as even remotely comparable to SSM. Completely different issues.

 

[JoStories]

I wonder what you would have said to a heterosexual person if he/she had something akin to this to you back in 1996 when DoMA was first enacted.


“I don’t care about what people like you think. You can complain all you want, it won’t change anything. It’s illegal for you to marry.”


Luckily for me I never took this immature approach. Rather, I tried to best explain why I believed the way that I do.


I think I may have been right. You might not be mature enough to engage in this type of discussion.


For a religious forum website, a lot of people on it sure don’t want to hear what religious people believe.

You are free to forget what I said about a civil post. My opinion on this subject is jaded as in 1998, my wife, (she was not truly my wife as we could not marry of course), died as a result of my not being able to put her on my insurance. You can imagine, if not appreciate that that jaded my views. I do respect your opinion and give it its needed respect and justification. However, that being said, it is still legal now and while I do see your side, it is similar to spitting in the wind if you will, as it is legal now. I fail to see how that is immature but if you wish to think I am, mores the power to you. I assure you, I am not.

 

[Serenity7855]

Serenity, your posts seem to represent the limited views of only the most narrow-minded members of the Church.

My views are indeed in the minority, however, that is the result of having an open mind not a narrow one. It is those who readily accept the interpretations of man rather than get it from the Holy Ghost that have closed minds. So yes, my views are in the minority but Jesus did say that only a handful of his elect would recognise the masters voice.

You realize the majority of Christianity do not recognize the atonement as having occurred in Gethsamene, right?

Yes, however, if that were true then what would be the point of mentioning His depression, anxiety, intense pain and fear about what was about to happen. Why mention the ministering angel and Jesus' pleading with the father to take this cup from Him. What was the cup that he spoke of? The atonement that caused him to bleed great drops of blood. Do you have any idea what the medical implications are should it be possible to bleed from just one pore. You would probably die yet Jesus bled from every pore. What caused that? The sheer magnitude of the task that he was about to perform for the likes of me and you. If Jesus did not atone for our sins in the Garden of Gethsamene then that whole sinario would have bee pointless having no Gospel Priciple, Precept or Commandment. A complete waste of ink.

You know there are well documented instances of abuse against women, right?

Yes I do, however, in comparison to those who treat their spouses kindly they are very much a minority group.

You understand the Church does not have a monopoly on defining marriage, correct?

They do have a monopoly over defining Holy Matrimony but not necessarily civil marriage,

You know that promoting religion in school is unconstitutional , right?

No, religion is but a lifestyle that promotes all that is needed to create a utopian society. Nothing that it teaches is derogatory in any way. It can only have a positive influence on mankind. To exclude it is possitively ridiculous and only serves Beelzebub.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Nothing that it teaches is derogatory in any way.

I beg to differ:
Exodus 21:21
Leviticus 15:19
Deuteronomy 17:12
Ephesians 6:5
Judges 21:10-24
1 Corinthians 14:33-35
1 Corinthians 11:5
1 Timothy 2:11–14
I could easily go on.

 

[First Baseman]

I beg to differ:
Exodus 21:21
Leviticus 15:19
Deuteronomy 17:12
Ephesians 6:5
Judges 21:10-24
1 Corinthians 14:33-35
1 Corinthians 11:5
1 Timothy 2:11–14
I could easily go on.

It is your opinion that these verses are derogatory, it is not a fact they are. Your opinion is noted though rejected.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

It is your opinion that these verses are derogatory, it is not a fact they are. Your opinion is noted though rejected.

Saying slaves are property, that women are unclean while on their period and should not speak in church, calling for rape, if you see nothing derogatory about that, I don't know what to say. There is nothing moral, right, or just about such things.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

People love to go on about how Islam commands to kill the infidel, but even the Bible says to kill those who don't do what a priest says and those who don't want Christ as their king.

 

[First Baseman]

People love to go on about how Islam commands to kill the infidel, but even the Bible says to kill those who don't do what a priest says and those who don't want Christ as their king.

Well, not in the New Testament will you find any of those things. If you are referring to the book of Revelation it is clearly stated that everyone will have a clear choice in the matter. It also says that those who reject Christ as their king will be gathered together to make war on the Christians, you kind of left that part out.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Well, not in the New Testament will you find any of those things. If you are referring to the book of Revelation it is clearly stated that everyone will have a clear choice in the matter. It also says that those who reject Christ as their king will be gathered together to make war on the Christians, you kind of left that part out.

I was referring to Luke 19:27.

 

[First Baseman]

I was referring to Luke 19:27.

That is just part of the parable.

Luke 19:23 says "Why then gavest not thou my money unto the bank, that at my coming I might have required mine own with interest?"

Of course there is no real bank Jesus is referring to, it is part of the parable.

What the parable means is that this is the judgment for the man who was given a talent and hid it away rather than use it gain more for the Master. It does not refer to those who were given no talents by the Master.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Of course there is no real bank Jesus is referring to, it is part of the parable.

A parable of someone who bears a very strong similarity to Jesus that ends by saying "mine enemies, that would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me."
There is nothing moral or just about that.

 

[Serenity7855]

I beg to differ:
Exodus 21:21
Leviticus 15:19
Deuteronomy 17:12
Ephesians 6:5
Judges 21:10-24
1 Corinthians 14:33-35
1 Corinthians 11:5
1 Timothy 2:11–14
I could easily go on.

A List of Parables that could teach wholesome principles to our children.

All you have listed is the usual atheist diatribe that has been explained to them on these pages many, many times. Atheists do not want to hear that though. It reduces their weaponry. These are just the parables, there are 1500 different simple stories used to illustrate a moral or spiritual lesson. Not bad is it?

1 The Growing Seed Mark 4:26–29
2 The Two Debtors Luke 7:41–43
3 The Lamp under a Bushel Matthew 5:14–15 Mark 4:21–25 Luke 8:16–18
4 Parable of the Good Samaritan Luke 10:25–37
5 The Friend at Night Luke 11:5–8
6 The Rich Fool Luke 12:16–21
7 The Wise and the Foolish Builders Matthew 7:24–27 Luke 6:46–49
8 New Wine into Old Wineskins Matthew 9:17–17 Mark 2:21–22 Luke 5:37–39
9 Parable of the strong man Matthew 12:29–29 Mark 3:27–27 Luke 11:21–22
10 Parable of the Sower Matthew 13:3–9 Mark 4:3–9 Luke 8:5–8
11 The Tares Matthew 13:24–30
12 The Barren Fig Tree Luke 13:6–9
13 Parable of the Mustard Seed Matthew 13:31–32 Mark 4:30–32 Luke 13:18–19
14 The Leaven Matthew 13:33–33 Luke 13:20–21
15 Parable of the Pearl Matthew 13:45–46
16 Drawing in the Net Matthew 13:47–50
17 The Hidden Treasure Matthew 13:44–44
18 Counting the Cost Luke 14:28–33
19 The Lost Sheep frequently called The Good Shepherd Matthew 18:10–14 Luke 15:4–6
20 The Unforgiving Servant Matthew 18:23–35
21 The Lost Coin Luke 15:8–9
22 Parable of the Prodigal Son Luke 15:11–32
23 The Unjust Steward Luke 16:1–13
24 Rich man and Lazarus Luke 16:19–31
25 The Master and Servant Luke 17:7–10
26 The Unjust Judge Luke 18:1–9
27 Pharisees and the Publican Luke 18:10–14
28 The Workers in the Vineyard Matthew 20:1–16
29 The Two Sons Matthew 21:28–32
30 The Wicked Husbandmen Matthew 21:33–41 Mark 12:1–9 Luke 20:9–16
31 The Great Banquet Matthew 22:1–14 Luke 14:15–24
32 The Budding Fig Tree Matthew 24:32–35 Mark 13:28–31 Luke 21:29–33
33 The Faithful Servant Matthew 24:42–51 Mark 13:34–37 Luke 12:35–48
34 The Ten Virgins Matthew 25:1–13
35 The Talents or Minas Matthew 25:14–30 Luke 19:12–27
36 The Sheep and the Goats Matthew 25:31–46
37 Parable of the Wedding Feast Luke 14:7–14
Parallels outside the canonical gospels[edit]
A number of parables have parallels in non-canonical gospels, the Didache, and the letters of Apostolic Fathers. However, given that the non-canonical gospels generally have no time sequence, this table is not a Gospel harmony.

Number Parable Matthew Mark Luke Other parallels[37][38][39]
1 Parable of the Sower Matthew 13:1–23 Mark 04:1–25 Luke 08:04–18 Thomas 9
1 Clement 24:5
2 Parable of the Tares Matthew 13:24–53 Thomas 57
3 Parable of the Growing Seed Mark 04:26–34 Thomas 21
4 Parable of the Hidden Treasure Matthew 13:44 Thomas 109
5 Parable of the Pearl Matthew 13:45 Thomas 76
6 Parable of Drawing in the Net Matthew 13:47–53 Thomas 8
7 Parable of the Rich Fool Luke 12:16–21 Thomas 63
8 Parable of the Faithful Servant Matthew 24:42–51 Mark 13:33–37 Luke 12:35–48 Thomas 103
Didache 16:1a
9 Parable of the Mustard Seed Matthew 13:31–32 Mark 4:30–32 Luke 13:18–19 Thomas 20
10 Parable of the Leaven Matthew 13:33 Luke 13:20–21 Thomas 96
11 Parable of the Lost Sheep Matthew 18:12–14 Luke 15:01–7 Thomas 107
Gospel of Truth 31–32
12 Parable of the Wicked Husbandmen Matthew 21:33–46 Mark 12:1–12 Luke 20:9–19 Thomas 65
13 Parable of the talents or minas Matthew 25:14–30 Luke 19:13–24 Nazoraeans 18
14 Parable of the great banquet Matthew 22:1–14 Luke 14:15–24 Thomas 64
15 Parable of the strong man Matthew 12:29–29 Mark 3:27–27 Luke 11:21–22 Thomas 35

I could easily go on.

 

[First Baseman]

A parable of someone who bears a very strong similarity to Jesus that ends by saying "mine enemies, that would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me."
There is nothing moral or just about that.

There is nothing moral or just about a person's sin, either, and all have sinned. Sin brings about death and judgement. Judgement isn't about cookies and cream.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

A List of Parables that could teach wholesome principles to our children. All you have listed is the usual atheist diatribe that has been explain on these pages many, many times. Atheists do not want to hear that though. It reduces their weaponry.

Or we could do better and have something that makes no references to owning people as property, having no mentions of women being unclean or expected to remain silent, nothing about killing people for being rebellious children or ignoring what a priest says, or any of the other negative baggage contained in the Bible.

 

[Ingledsva]

That is just part of the parable.

Luke 19:23 says "Why then gavest not thou my money unto the bank, that at my coming I might have required mine own with interest?"

Of course there is no real bank Jesus is referring to, it is part of the parable.

What the parable means is that this is the judgment for the man who was given a talent and hid it away rather than use it gain more for the Master. It does not refer to those who were given no talents by the Master.

LOL! And you leave out pertinent parts of the parable!

Luk 19:12 He said therefore, A certain nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom, and to return.

Luk 19:13 And he called his ten servants, and delivered them ten pounds, and said unto them, Occupy till I come.

Luk 19:14 But his citizens hated him, and sent a message after him, saying, We will not have this man to reign over us.

Luk 19:27 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.

That is very clear. Death for not wanting to be a slave under the reign of Jesus!

That's love for you!

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