Nature of God

[Riverwolf]

I do believe in Spirit.
nothing after death without it.

Except... more life.

and science has requirement of definition in the physical form.
as something more the a simple chem reaction.

I'm pretty sure that at the moment, an exact, universally accepted scientific definition for life remains elusive.

If I had to guess, however, it's not as simple as binary "LIFE/NOT-LIFE". More likely, as with pretty much all other things, it's a scale.

 

[Thief]

Except... more life.



I'm pretty sure that at the moment, an exact, universally accepted scientific definition for life remains elusive.

If I had to guess, however, it's not as simple as binary "LIFE/NOT-LIFE". More likely, as with pretty much all other things, it's a scale.

well, I guess I could find it for you.....
it was decades ago when the science lesson was taught.
something like four distinct qualifications.

any one fails....that item is not alive.

 

[Riverwolf]

well, I guess I could find it for you.....
it was decades ago when the science lesson was taught.
something like four distinct qualifications.

any one fails....that item is not alive.

Pretty sure "decades ago" means it's long outdated, and likely no longer used.

Here's something more modern:

http://phoenix.lpl.arizona.edu/mars141.php

Specifically:

Biologists have identified at least six properties that are shared by all living organisms on Earth:

1. Order: Molecules in living things are arranged in specific structures.
2. Reproduction: Living things have the ability to reproduce their own kind.
   
3. Growth and Development: Living organisms grow and develop in patterns determined by heredity, the traits passed to offspring by parents.
4. Energy Utilization: Living things need to capture and use energy, a process known as metabolism.
5. Response to Stimuli: Living organisms respond to changes in their environment.
6. Evolutionary Adaptation: Living things evolve in such a way that future generations are adapted to unique situations in their surroundings.

It is important to remember that some objects may have some of these properties but still not be a living organism.

It's important to remember that this is NOT a definition. This is a description of traits common to things traditionally accepted to be "life".

 

[Thief]

Pretty sure "decades ago" means it's long outdated, and likely no longer used.

Here's something more modern:

http://phoenix.lpl.arizona.edu/mars141.php

Specifically:



It's important to remember that this is NOT a definition. This is a description of traits common to things traditionally accepted to be "life".

yeah thought so...someone added a couple of notations.

but that was a mistake.
in the note #5....the living item would have to be sensitive to THAT stimulation...
and in #6....the living item won't demonstrate the genetic alteration until the offspring show it.

So I will remain true to the 'traditional' teaching....
first four notations only.

 

[Thief]

As for the nature of God.....He is Spirit.
a different form of life.

 

[Aupmanyav]

The I doesn't know every thing. Who do you believe in?

I believe in unity, one substrate that forms all things in the universe, and that is not a God. Hindus term it as Brahman, of which the universe (Brahma) is constituted. 'I' is just a temporary form.

 

[Robert.Evans]

Okay. Since many people are familiar with the word God, I use that for convenience.

Anyway, in my signature, Shaef says that some Pacific cultures do not have a term for God because God is life itself. To me, God is not a Supreme Being. He is not a force. He is not a concept. He is not an ideal. Even more so, He is not a He. That's my view.

I understand many believe that God is a Creator, some believe He is the universe, and others believe He (or She?) is an personification of something (or a combination of deities) else.

Yet, do these beliefs have anything in common that would define the nature of God?

---
God the Creator can't be God the universe at the same time. A Creator "creates" the universe and life rather than being it itself.

God can't be a Supreme Being because there is nothing outside of life but life itself.

God can't be a He, She, or It (a pronoun) because life has no gender; it is not a person. That is like saying the air you breathe, the heart that beats, the baby that is born, et cetera are people.

On that note, it couldn't be a combination of deities since the above can't be a person, how can it be more than one?
--

Not everyone believes in a Creator, not all believe in a Supreme Being, not all believe that "God" is a person, and not all believe the term God defines a Spirit.

So what is God?

Consciousness separated many times over which becomes all things

 

[AllanV]

I believe in unity, one substrate that forms all things in the universe, and that is not a God. Hindus term it as Brahman, of which the universe (Brahma) is constituted. 'I' is just a temporary form.

The apostle Paul in acts 17: 20, 28 relates that we live move and have our being in God. Therefore God is the energy in the atom and the life in the cell. The Eternal God wears light as with a garment.

Everything seen is made to appear at every instant and the Eternal God is understood by what He creates and manifests.
At 26 years an experience revealed the mind of an immortal as a comparison to my own. God is able to be an observer a little beyond and deeper than the biological form with its own mind that gives everyone life experience. The will as separate from God is used to empower self belief and every one goes their own way. The biology tends to rule the mind and there is an overall inner conflict developed where thoughts and motivation go astray under the pressure of others in the developed social order.

Although a difficult read, from the beginning to the end the so called Christian Bible relates how immortality was lost and a separation occurred from knowing God and it is all in the mind. The Eternal God's request is that we become converted in the mind and then there is an opportunity to be immortal. Those unable to covert will perish, their life will be lived out and that is all.

What is your definition of a God because what you call a unity and substrate is what I understand as the God I know. God is a life giving Spirit and fills and creates everything seen at every instant.

It is easy to see really. With a developed life experience the mind is full of all manner of thoughts and imagination with memories of associations and events constantly there within. These have all been developed from the perspective of a biological form and on a predatory planet with all the possibilities of disease, sickness, accidents and death the final outcome.

 

[Riverwolf]

yeah thought so...someone added a couple of notations.

but that was a mistake.
in the note #5....the living item would have to be sensitive to THAT stimulation...
and in #6....the living item won't demonstrate the genetic alteration until the offspring show it.

So I will remain true to the 'traditional' teaching....
first four notations only.

I'll trust that actual biologists know what they're talking about, regardless of whether it reinforces my "traditional" beliefs.

As for the nature of God.....He is Spirit.
a different form of life.

"Different", how?

What, in your theology, is "spirit", exactly? What are its components? How might it be measured? How does it interact with stuff that's not "spirit"?

The reason why religious matters should be kept entirely separate from scientific matters is because they operate under completely different modes of perception and communication. Hence why I can be religious and believe in the existence of Gods, along with other wights, but not contradict any of the current scientific consensus.

 

[Thief]

I'll trust that actual biologists know what they're talking about, regardless of whether it reinforces my "traditional" beliefs.



"Different", how?

What, in your theology, is "spirit", exactly? What are its components? How might it be measured? How does it interact with stuff that's not "spirit"?

The reason why religious matters should be kept entirely separate from scientific matters is because they operate under completely different modes of perception and communication. Hence why I can be religious and believe in the existence of Gods, along with other wights, but not contradict any of the current scientific consensus.

science has tried to make measure of spirit.....
science has failed so far.

But if the creation is a reflection of it's Creator.....
science is likely using the wrong scale.

 

[Aupmanyav]

What there is not, cannot be measured - God or Spirit.

Everything seen is .. and death the final outcome.

Bible is not difficult to read but it is a promotional literature, edited over many centuries by many people, but (I am told) still contains contradictions and fallacies.

Try to find what is beyond material and biology, why just stop at God. Why conflicts? Let one do one’s duty. At the pragmatic level, we are mortals. Why hanker after immortality? However, what constitutes us (star-dust) is immortal. I am an atheist. My definition of God is human imagination. My definition of the substrate (we term it Brahman) does not equate to God, because it is only what exists. It has no demands on life and does not interfere. It neither creates nor destroys anything. It is not omnipotent and omniscient as theists understand it. ‘.. perspective of a biological form and on a predatory planet ‘’ Do whatever, that is not going to change.

 

[Riverwolf]

science has tried to make measure of spirit.....
science has failed so far.

Uh... no it hasn't. To my knowledge, no scientific field has even touched upon the matter.

But if the creation is a reflection of it's Creator.....
science is likely using the wrong scale.

That's a big "if", and one that is self-contradictory if we're holding to the idea that the "Creator" is "all-good", and that the "creation" is... not. If "creation" is a "reflection" of it's "Creator", then that "creation" should basically have the exact same qualities; if it lacks anything, it's not a reflection at all.


Remember how I earlier said that Death is the Mother of Life? I regard Death as Allmother, and Sole Eternal Being. She, alone, is forever. All other wights, including the Gods, must eventually die.

Her name, rendered from the Old Tongues into Modern English, is Hell: the Covered; the Concealed; the Hidden. She is not a Goddess; She is not invoked, She is not given homage, nor is She desired*. Her children, us, live to fear and flee Her as long as we can, though return to Her we all must someday.

She is not an external "Creator" looking down upon a "creation". She is intrinsic: within all things. In my conception, and traditional conceptions in general, the idea of the universe as being a dead "creation" by some "Creator" that's wholly external to it, is sheer nonsense. It's not reflective whatsoever of what I experience for myself, nor of what I observe in the world.


*By which I mean, in the path I follow, She's not. There are plenty of paths out there that do invoke, homage, and worship Her as a Goddess in some form.

 

[AllanV]

What there is not, cannot be measured - God or Spirit.
Bible is not difficult to read but it is a promotional literature, edited over many centuries by many people, but (I am told) still contains contradictions and fallacies.

Try to find what is beyond material and biology, why just stop at God. Why conflicts? Let one do one’s duty. At the pragmatic level, we are mortals. Why hanker after immortality? However, what constitutes us (star-dust) is immortal. I am an atheist. My definition of God is human imagination. My definition of the substrate (we term it Brahman) does not equate to God, because it is only what exists. It has no demands on life and does not interfere. It neither creates nor destroys anything. It is not omnipotent and omniscient as theists understand it. ‘.. perspective of a biological form and on a predatory planet ‘’ Do whatever, that is not going to change.

I don't know much except an experience opened my mind up to the mind of an immortal as a comparison to mine. This is the nature or spiritual character that brings no conflict and is a requirement. Inner peace and an energy change from within doesn't provoke reactions usually but relating belief does.

A full realization occurred as to the plight of man because there will be no peace. The consciousness and mind of man is set on being Godless. There is a point in time when the weapons of war will be used to ultimate destruction but in the mean time all manner of nature traits expose themselves in personalities and cause some difficulties.
Man's imagination is limited and technology is a good example. The use of combustion in very low efficiency engines and rockets is only a small step from primitive man's use of an open fire to cook food. It is only necessary to follow along with so called improvements to realize they are motivated by monetary gain and exploitation of natural resources, mostly at the expense of habitat which will affect every one. All are dumbed down, made docile and taken for a ride. The education system was set up to do just that and began most obviously with Hitler's Germany. The leaders read the books and know how it works and manipulate the people.

The scriptures of the Bible are difficult and this is indicated by the number of interpretations and doctrinal differences in the many churches. An overview in my estimate is an exciting commentary especially in view of the experience my mind was opened up to before the Bible was ever read. There is a God taking an active role in drawing a people to Him.

 

[Thief]

Uh... no it hasn't. To my knowledge, no scientific field has even touched upon the matter.



That's a big "if", and one that is self-contradictory if we're holding to the idea that the "Creator" is "all-good", and that the "creation" is... not. If "creation" is a "reflection" of it's "Creator", then that "creation" should basically have the exact same qualities; if it lacks anything, it's not a reflection at all.


Remember how I earlier said that Death is the Mother of Life? I regard Death as Allmother, and Sole Eternal Being. She, alone, is forever. All other wights, including the Gods, must eventually die.

Her name, rendered from the Old Tongues into Modern English, is Hell: the Covered; the Concealed; the Hidden. She is not a Goddess; She is not invoked, She is not given homage, nor is She desired*. Her children, us, live to fear and flee Her as long as we can, though return to Her we all must someday.

She is not an external "Creator" looking down upon a "creation". She is intrinsic: within all things. In my conception, and traditional conceptions in general, the idea of the universe as being a dead "creation" by some "Creator" that's wholly external to it, is sheer nonsense. It's not reflective whatsoever of what I experience for myself, nor of what I observe in the world.


*By which I mean, in the path I follow, She's not. There are plenty of paths out there that do invoke, homage, and worship Her as a Goddess in some form.

My God is the God of the living.....

 

[Thief]

The reason why religious matters should be kept entirely separate from scientific matters is because they operate under completely different modes of perception and communication. Hence why I can be religious and believe in the existence of Gods, along with other wights, but not contradict any of the current scientific consensus.

Science displays how God did all of this.
but science cannot asure beyond the physical experiment.

Science cannot contradict God.

 

[Aupmanyav]

The scriptures of the Bible are difficult and this is indicated by the number of interpretations and doctrinal differences in the many churches. An overview in my estimate is an exciting commentary especially in view of the experience my mind was opened up to before the Bible was ever read. There is a God taking an active role in drawing a people to Him.

Or perhaps that is an indication of contradictions in Bible. Yes, people have many views. You believe in existence of God, many do not, some worship Satan and Devil.

Science cannot contradict God.

I do not know, more and more people are rejecting God as statistics show..

 

[Riverwolf]

My God is the God of the living.....

So are mine. Freya, in my conception, is the May Queen, who is associated with Spring and Life.

Death and Weaver are not Gods; they came before the Gods.

Science displays how God did all of this.
but science cannot asure beyond the physical experiment.

Science cannot contradict God.

Then there should be no problems with following the current scientific consensus on things, as opposed to sticking with older, outdated models like you've done, right?

 

[AllanV]

Or perhaps that is an indication of contradictions in Bible. Yes, people have many views. You believe in existence of God, many do not, some worship Satan and Devil.I do not know, more and more people are rejecting God as statistics show..

I Know God is active and living, manifesting everything seen at every instant. To believe in God from that perspective rather than own self is the ultimate quest. Self belief empowered by the will is potentially dangerous to all life and reflects a rebellious nature opposed to God and is a state of mind and deeper consciousness.

Self belief empowered by the will makes connections and bonds within the subconscious by producing complimentary feelings. All humans are bonded in a familiarity of feeling and responses and this is well known. A look can make a person feel good or bad and everyone learns the skills to do this and human behavior with responses is learned within certain parameters of the natural senses only, but something a little deeper is going on.
It takes some emotional strength to be balanced but an ebb and flow may at some time bring some vulnerability. The human mind and consciousness will home in on what it perceives as weakness. This is why children and the elderly or even those sick or impaired in some way are targeted by what is immoral behavior of predators.

To know God and believe in Him is deep and is in it's completion a transformation from the rebellious nature to one that will bring immortality. The spiritual character, the name of Jesus, is the nature acceptable to God. That same nature must be sought and found.

 

[Thief]

So are mine. Freya, in my conception, is the May Queen, who is associated with Spring and Life.

Death and Weaver are not Gods; they came before the Gods.



Then there should be no problems with following the current scientific consensus on things, as opposed to sticking with older, outdated models like you've done, right?

I'm not traditional...(rogue theologian)

 

[Riverwolf]

I'm not traditional...(rogue theologian)

I was referring to your earlier statement of using only the first four descriptions of life, and discarding the fifth and sixth, thus going against the current scientific consensus.