New scandal:Trump Caught Insulting Women!

[Acim]

That was the progress of the discussion. You were calling me out on "stuff I never heard before" then ignored it when I actually posted something.

Incorrect. You changed the parameters of the discussion, I reckon cause you realized you were nailed on your points. Glad to review the posts as may be desired.

 

[esmith]

If Trump were a Democrat, his allies would be praising him as very "European" (as Bill was lauded for his assaults & trysts).
I say he's a boor.
But there are far more important considerations in electing a presidential candidate from the current crop.

I look at it this way. What Trump said was offensive to some, while others see it as nothing more than two guys "beating their chest". Now I spent more than 20 years in the Navy starting in 1961 and I will admit the talk got raunchy at times. However, it was never (in my experience) done in the company of "nice" women. Sure it got raunchy in bars overseas and some of the dives in the US. Have times changed? Yeah they have. But having read the transcript I've heard considerably worse. I've said I will not give Trump a pass on what he said but what I meant was will not give him a pass on being stupid enough to say something when recording devices are around.
The question one needs to ask is did Trump do any of this? I doubt it. Did Trump have sex with someone not his wife? Probably, haven't most men (got to have a partner now too don't we)?
Given the choices we have in this election, to me the policies not the talk is more important.
We have one person who is more concerned with privacy than national security, and one that talks dirty once in awhile. At least Trump didn't call various women, trailer-trash, narcissistic loony-toon, bimbos. or say that a 12 year old girl was "emotionally unstable with a tendency to seek out older men and engage in fantasizing"
But if you have a problem with what Trump said, I suggest you stop listing to music, going to movies, or reading.

 

[Acim]

Your assertion that all men are misogynist like that of trumps rhetoric is fallacious.

Please quote where I said this assertion. Or is this your usual straw man tactics?

You even admitted "some of his comments were misogynistic". You admitted it case closed. Now back to our scheduled program.

Case closed is so desperate to weasel your way out of the points you got nailed on, it humors even the lurkers of this thread.

 

[idav]

Please quote where I said this assertion. Or is this your usual straw man tactics?



Case closed is so desperate to weasel your way out of the points you got nailed on, it humors even the lurkers of this thread.

Color me unimpressed.

 

[Adramelek]

In the end none of this really matters. Most people mistrust and despise the media and establishment politicians who will latch on to anything they think will bring down Trump for fear of loosing their own power and influence over others. As a result I think Trump's numbers will skyrocket, as he is the anti-establishment candidate.

Btw, President's Roosevelt, Kennedy, Clinton actually did cheat on their wives and objectified women, so it was ok back then... uhuh. This is nothing new in politics.

 

[Acim]

Color me unimpressed.

I'd rather color you as deceptive in this thread. I'm glad the record conveys as much.

 

[idav]

Some of his words are misogynistic, just like some of her words are victim shaming nonsense. The "new scandal" is words of a womanizer. Hence, why if we are going to explore it, it would be from that angle.

Your words.

 

[idav]

I'd rather color you as deceptive in this thread. I'm glad the record conveys as much.

Problem is the words in the scandal are also misogynistic.

 

[idav]

Btw, President's Roosevelt, Kennedy, Clinton actually did cheat on their wives and objectified women, so it was ok back then... uhuh. This is nothing new in politics.

Sure people can say that instead of defending anything Trump does or says.

 

[Acim]

Your words.

....Don't match with your other assertion.

 

[Acim]

Problem is the words in the scandal are also misogynistic.

No they're not. They are in vein of womanizing.

 

[idav]

....Don't match with your other assertion.

Read what I said not what you think I said.

 

[idav]

No they're not. They are in vein of womanizing.

Thats where many in this thread have already pointed in disagreement.

 

[Riders]

I'm saying the talk is okay. I might be the only one saying this. I'm willing to defend it on the grounds of it being private discussion, that many to most guys do, that some women talk like this, that it is mostly talk, that the other type of talk (the puritan approach) has issues (that I'm familiar with) and that it's not vastly different than other so called offensive talk with regards to 'freedom to speak.'

The behavior that follows up that talk, I see as less okay. I'd have to see it play out for me to judge how okay I find it. If Trump gets off that bus, and in effort to back up what he just conveyed to Bush, while standing right in front of Bush, he proceeds to move in on kissing the woman with nothing being said (by Trump or the woman) and then proceeds to grope her P, I would see that as so bold and so contrary to what I see in public life, that it not okay. And would be grounds for her to file some sort of sexual assault charge against him. Because he didn't do this, right after saying he could, I think matters. But seems all the naysayers are assuming he does do this even while we all witnessed to at least one situation (the one right after him saying it) where he did not.

Its normal for men? Most men have thousands of women making complaints against them that are borderline sexual harrassement, most men have thousands of women coming out of the woodwork making complaints about degrading fat shaming comments to them and about vulgarity, most men have thousands of people coming out of the wood work to complain about sexual objectifying rude vulgar comments to them, most men have thousands of peopek stepping up to keep them from them from get a political job because they are sick and perverse,most men have thousands of women complaining about their sexual comments who are sickened and disgusted by them is that what you meant? I got it that makes perfect sense,I have never met any man with so many women who claim to victimized by their abusive talk in my life.

Your saying thousands of women are wrong. Jst because your a star and have money and power doesn't give any man the right to walka round saying he can have sex with any woman.


Sense he was married when that went on BTW, he said had an affair, uh so 100 percent of men have affairs? gotcha. He had an affair with the woman in the furniture, store and he admitted it was an unwanted sexual pass he pinned her down and she didn't want it, that's a description of sexual assault and its an affair, we impeached Clinton for the same thing, we should homd Trump to the same standards as Clinton.

 

[Acim]

Your assertion that all men are misogynist like that of trumps rhetoric is fallacious.

Your words. What you said (that I said), that you can't back up with a quote by me. Thus the straw man we are currently dealing with.

You think Trump's words in this scandal are misogynistic.

Thats where many in this thread have already pointed in disagreement.

Please back that assertion up.

The scandal deals with words that are about how Trump feels he can get sexual with a woman.

Definition of misogyny: dislike of, contempt for, or ingrained prejudice against women

So, if one is operating under idea that at some point in last 6 months Trump has expressed some words in that vein, they'd probably be correct, but if they wish to say that is found in the words of this scandal, where Trump is quoted as saying:

"I moved on her like a b****". . . "She's now got the big phony tits.". . ."I moved on her and I failed. I'll admit it. I did try and **** her. She was married. . . And when you're a star they let you do it. You can do anything. Whatever you want. Grab them by the p****. You can do anything."

This is not misogyny. Or if it is for anyone, then yes, many men (but not all of them) have spoken in this manner. I wouldn't call it misogynistic. I would say it is language a womanizer uses, and can imagine if one is a star, some of what is conveyed is accurate. Much of it is bravado type language that a womanizer type uses.

 

[idav]

This is not misogyny. Or if it is for anyone, then yes, many men (but not all of them) have spoken in this manner. I wouldn't call it misogynistic. I would say it is language a womanizer uses, and can imagine if one is a star, some of what is conveyed is accurate. Much of it is bravado type language that a womanizer type uses.

People have been calling that last portion of going around grabbing peoples privates as sexual harassment which is illegal. I have seen your disagreement to that affect but a person being rich doesn't change it.

 

[Acim]

Its normal for men?

Yes. For most men that I've met, yes. For all men, definitely not. Of the men I've met, it is certainly not all of them. I would say it is the norm.

Most men have thousands of women making complaints against them that are borderline sexual harrassement, most men have thousands of women coming out of the woodwork making complaints about degrading fat shaming comments to them and about vulgarity, most men have thousands of people coming out of the wood work to complain about sexual objectifying rude vulgar comments to them, most men have thousands of peopek stepping up to keep them from them from get a political job because they are sick and perverse,most men have thousands of women complaining about their sexual comments who are sickened and disgusted by them is that what you meant?

Nope, not what I meant. But I am aware of a number of male stars that have this occurring. Of all the guys I've met, they certainly do not have thousands of women doing anything in relation to them.

Your saying thousands of women are wrong.

How so?

Jst because your a star and have money and power doesn't give any man the right to walka round saying he can have sex with any woman.

I don't see what the right is that you are trying to reference. The right to speak freely? The right to speak in a way that a womanizer might? The right to say he can have sex with any woman? All those strike me as something that I'm okay with, even while I may dispute it if I'm present, as I have with my own guy friends. Ya know, cause I'm abnormal like that.

Sense he was married when that went on BTW, he said had an affair, uh so 100 percent of men have affairs? gotcha.

You got your straw man? Cool!
I would say, in my estimation, around 5% of men have extra marital affairs. So most men I believe do not. Of those that do not, I would estimate that as much as 70% of them speak in ways that resemble 'things a womanizer might say.'

He had an affair with the woman in the furniture, store and he admitted it was an unwanted sexual pass he pinned her down and she didn't want it, that's a description of sexual assault and its an affair, we impeached Clinton for the same thing, we should homd Trump to the same standards as Clinton.

Agreed, when Trump becomes POTUS, we can impeach him, allow him to stay in office until end of his term, and then consider him a great man for all the charity work he does when he gets out. And if the economy is great (by any standard) when he is POTUS, we can even claim he was a great POTUS, while we all know he was impeached for inappropriate sexual behavior, with a female half his age.

 

[Acim]

People have been calling that last portion of going around grabbing peoples privates as sexual harassment which is illegal.

Correct, but it is not sexual harassment. If it is, and as you note it is illegal, then let's see the case being made against trump as it specifically relates to this scandal. I would be very interested in how that is prosecuted. It would wake me up to a whole of things, in that I would think normal men, or around 70% of the population ought to be prosecuted in the same manner.

I have seen your disagreement to that affect but a person being rich doesn't change it.

I don't think I've said that. You instead haven't acknowledged points in my disagreement because I observe you being hung up on the notion that it is inherently wrong, inherently offensive, and somehow unique to Trump or something very few men would say.

At this point, if there is anything on video/audio where Trump has expressed respect for any woman, that is seemingly ignored or at best filtered through the idea that he is faking the respect. If the latter, which is debatable in a number of ways, it really is for me then a statement of society. But during the election cycle, let's just be good little hypocrites and scapegoat Trump on this as if he's the only one that does this.

 

[Riders]

AcimRevelation all the time
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Its normal for men?
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Yes. For most men that I've met, yes. For all men, definitely not. Of the men I've met, it is certainly not all of them. I would say it is the norm.
If it was the norm then they would all have the same consequences that Donald has with women complaining against them, having complaints about sexual harrassement and abusive talk is very very serious, abuse is serious, its not normal for men to abuse.

Having fantasies is one thing thing its different to have a fantasy then to make it come true. The difference is that Donald acted upon his thoughts and made women participate and became abusive. We all have dirty nasty thoughts .

That's different, claiming you assaulted or sexually harassed someone isnt the same thing thing as talking locker room talk. But you saying its normal for most men, he said he tried to have an affair and you said its normal for most men, is it normal for most men to say I had multiple affairs.

I don't give sh^t about locker room, talk all men talk nasty about women, I'm not condemning him for that, I'm not talking about that I don't care about that.

I'm not talking about Donald Trump having locker room talk or nasty about women at all this has NOTHING to do with that .Theres only 3 things in that video( that video doesn't even go into his body and fat shaming for beauty contests that's a different situations hes got a lot against him)

1.The fact that he has multiple affairs by grabbing women all the time, the fact that he grabs women off the street grabs them kisses them and grabs their crotch, which by definition is sexual harrassement, Its also called being a flasher , being nude and flashing in public is agaisnt the law ,dont speak on anything else except those 3 things.

Multiple affairs, grabbing women off the street to grab their cotches, and publicly exposing himself by having ex in a furniture store those are the 3 things I want to talk about.
I don't want to know about locker talk.

Now I have a question for you. I know a whole bunch of men who have behavior or had behavior like that a whole bunch. Theyre all members of Sex Addicts Annonymous, and a lot fo them went to prisone for indescent exposure such as the ones Donald described. Really are you gonna tell me that's normal?

Nobody hear gives S& it about locker room nasty talk men have in locker rooms.














Most men have thousands of women making complaints against them that are borderline sexual harrassement, most men have thousands of women coming out of the woodwork making complaints about degrading fat shaming comments to them and about vulgarity, most men have thousands of people coming out of the wood work to complain about sexual objectifying rude vulgar comments to them, most men have thousands of peopek stepping up to keep them from them from get a political job because they are sick and perverse,most men have thousands of women complaining about their sexual comments who are sickened and disgusted by them is that what you meant?
Click to expand...
Nope, not what I meant. But I am aware of a number of male stars that have this occurring. Of all the guys I've met, they certainly do not have thousands of women doing anything in relation to them.

 

[Quetzal]

The only problem I see is that she has to get it through Congress. There are numerous items that seem enticing but no where do I see a plan to pay for all of her "campaign promises".

I agree and would add that I think both candidates would have trouble here. If Trump moves in, I can see many members of Congress refusing to work with him from both sides. Same token if Hillary takes the gold, some of the repubs might do the same. Much to the same tune of Obama 1. As far as funding, I am not sure either. I don't understand the national budget enough to say "Yeah we could afford it" or not.

Now as you well know I have knee jerk reactions when firearms are mentioned and I find that she, as most, do not understand where the problems are in our streets when it comes to firearms.

I'll be honest, any political platform that claims to have a solution here is fooling themselves. You and I both know its complicated and there isn't a silver bullet. I will say that revoking rights from law abiding citizens is not the right way to go about it.

As I said I agree with some items but there are considerable numbers of them that pander to voters,"campaign promises" that politicians never carry through on".

Perfectly fair assessment. The only bummer is we won't really know until we are already knee deep. This goes for any candidate.

It would be interesting to debate each of her platform points but I don't think that is possible in the time remaining.

As a voter, I think this would be 10x more useful than the previous debate format we saw a few weeks ago. I am willing to let the past go if we can focus on what they want to do now.