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No proof of god.
- Thread starter Egyptianboxer104
- Start date
Worshipper
Active Member
Just because no one can prove God's existence to another doesn't mean that God can't prove his own existence to someone.
No mortal soul has ever been able to prove to me that God exists. But God has proven to me empirically that he exists. That doesn't help me prove to anyone else that he exists, because I can't force him to demonstrate himself to a third party. But it does help me. I'm not taking anyone else's word for there being a God.
I think it's foolish to try to prove to people that God exists. Let God prove himself to people; he's a big boy. Just remember, though, that even though the proof you need can never come from any mortal person, that doesn't mean such proof doesn't exist.
I am a child of my parents. The reproductive process doesn't include god.That said god is an assumption for many, a father to some, a warm blanket on a cold day, the light to bring a wicked man back to beneveolence and the subject of many debates. God is the justification for hateful things as well.
In essence God is all things and nothing.
My friend and I were discussing one of gods statements/promises in the bible... the rightous themselves will posess the earth and they will reside forever upon it... Psalms I believe... If we colonize another planet will the rightous also posess that?
I would think that when we do finally find a new planet there might be a new bible there? A new testament?
Egyptianboxer104
Member
humans probably won't evolve for a very very very long time. It is impossible to know what will happen next. If you know ANYTHING about evolution, you'll know that the enviornmental conditions, shape the evolutionary tract of humans... notice how, now adays, humans control the enviornment.
darkendless
Guardian of Asgaard
Oh of course i do not deny that, i'm simply saying that evidence is a loose term when describing God's affect on us.
If we take you as an example, he has proven himself to you, but how do i know you're telling the truth. How do i know whether you saw what you say you saw, thats more what i was aiming at. (please don't think im calling you a liar for the record)
I think to say its foolish is rather dismissive of a deep issue, in the age of scientific revolution tangible proof is of the essense, the same old excuses just don't cut it anymore.
Then again theres the huge assumption that there is a God. Since we cant prove him we've got 2 choices, wait and see or follow blindly in hope your submission was worth it in the end.
Egyptianboxer104
Member
and we have already seen some progress. more and more people are being born without their appendix, a useless organ. This organ was important maybe 20,000 years ago when we had great amount of tough veggies in our diets such as grass. but now we don't need them anymore.
Right_Path
Member
The sort of 'control' emphasized by religion is a useful one...not the type of control where you feel restrained...being out of control is never good.
ABSURD...these are the foolish acts of people calling themselves religious...religion has nothing to do with those maniacs...'flying planes into buildings' is an old subject really!
Is 'being moral' the only thing you see in that matter(need for God)?...God is alot more greater than that.
39-62
''Allah is the Creator of all things, and He is the Guardian and Disposer of all affairs.''
39-63
''To Him belong the keys of the heavens and the earth: and those who reject the Signs of Allah,- it is they who will be in loss''
I am adamant you don't believe in a single word of that ofcourse, but that is God, he doesn't need us, is not obliged to 'tangibly prove himself' for us...
He just informs us about himself through messengers, then its our duty to follow that line, if after that we are still unable to accept him, then thats our problem.
you need him and one day you will know why you need him.:yes:
Right_Path
Member
Tangible proofs have already been revealed for previous nations , now we have holy books resulting from God's messengers' revelations...
God does not have to show his miracles to every human being in order to make him believe.
There were eras when people knew nothing about God, so they needed tangible proofs, these proofs were then transferred to other generations through holy books, Torah, Bible and Quran.
It is unwise to doubt everyhthing that happend yesterday as long as we cannot see it.
Yes we are not children of God, but we are his own craetion, so he cares for us and therefore he provided us with the necessities of life (food, water, air...etc), then he gave us what we need to know him(messengers' revelations).
Egyptianboxer104
Member
Control is also what hitler was a freak about. He needed to control the world and that's what caused the genoicde and world wars.
And religion does have something to do witht hose maniacs flying into buildings. have you ever heard of an athiest doing a suicide bombing? or killing innocent people for a cause?
And religion does have something to do witht hose maniacs flying into buildings. have you ever heard of an athiest doing a suicide bombing? or killing innocent people for a cause?
darkendless
Guardian of Asgaard
Thats all a matter of opinion, your opinion, no different from mine. The bible is not proof, i don't know how many times i've said it, the bible is as biased as you can get. For all we know, in 500 years, they might think the history of world war two is a holy book, describing the messenger Adolf Hitler who had nations under him. Its entirely possible given Jesus and Mohammed's shakey divinity. Do not attribute God to things easily exaplained by science. God didnt create your air supply, nor does he provide you with water. We evolved, there was no creation. Creation = i cannot think of a reasonable answer.
Him? *snicker* Why does it have to be threat? Some day BalanceFx... some day... you will see.... MWahahahahaha you WILL SEE! HAHAHAHA. *evil laughter*
The Flying Spaghetti Monster does also not have to prove himself to you but you reject him? Why do you not accept Ra? Zeus? Odin?
Why your book? Why your god? What makes you right?
Supersticious mumbo jumbo IMHO.
Right_Path
Member
Hollow comparison...are you saying that the term control MUST be coupled with the likes of Hitler:cover:...so when i want to control my kids than i am a bad guy!
Hitler was a tyrann who gave little and wanted everything from people even if it cost their lives.
God gave everything, and only asked people to worship him in return.
Those who murder innocent people and cause havoc in the name of religion were not ordered to do so by God...so religion is innocent from their shameful acts.
What happened in September 11 is way out of the guidelines of Islam, thats not my opinion btw...any Muslim who is aware of the teachings of the Quran and prophet Mohamed condemn killing people in the name of religion unless it is self-defense.
Tens of verses in the Quran explain clearly when, how, where and why one is allowed to kill.
Thats a huge topic indeed, i promise to open a thread for this one.
Does that mean that if an atheist did that, then you could convert?
We don't judge God by man's actions.
BucephalusBB
ABACABB
Many times, However, the cause was never religious as they had no religion, so mentioning the fact that it is an atheist would be pointless..
Halcyon
Lord of the Badgers
Hmmm, lets see...
Gravity exists, as a fold in spacetime. Spacetime exists independently of normal matter/energy - perhaps you should look up the Big Freeze hypothesis.
How can you know that? The edge of the visible universe is only the distance that the oldest photons have travelled to reach us, it is very possible that the universe continues on indefinitely beyond the edge of the observable universe and may not contain any matter, we cannot know.
If you knew anything about evolution, you would realise that sexual selection plays just as an important role as environment.
The appendix is a lymphatic organ.
Logically, natural selection would select for individuals with larger appendices - since appendicitis can be fatal a larger appendix would be less susceptible to having food trapped within its structure.
Rolling_Stone
Well-Known Member
I appreciate your response and sympathize with it. As God's children, we need three things to receive his guidance:
- A willingness to let go of our own ego-response,
- A desire to be led, and
- Tools adequate to the task.
Egyptianboxer104
Member
Physics book:
The Universe is defined as everything that physically exists: the entirety of space and time, all forms of matter, energy and momentum, and the physical laws and constants that govern them.
The appendix serves no purpose in our bodies. It was useful only a long long time ago. The appendix just becomes inflamed sometimes due to infection and then we need it removed. That's all. It's NOT more effective larger.
And so you say there is no evidence for the edge of the universe (Even though there is) and therefore you don't believe it ends. Yet you have no evidence for god and yet you believe he exists.
and yes, sexual selection is the result of envionrmental factors.
I am still not convinced god exists.
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Right_Path
Member
:areyoucra
Why my God?
59-22 ''Allah is He, than Whom there is no other god;- Who knows (all things) both secret and open; He, Most Gracious, Most Merciful''
59-23 ''Allah is He, than Whom there is no other god;- the Sovereign, the Holy One, the Source of Peace (and Perfection), the Guardian of Faith, the Preserver of Safety, the Exalted in Might, the Irresistible, the Supreme: Glory to Allah! (High is He) above the partners they attribute to Him.''
59-24 ''He is Allah, the Creator, the Evolver, the Bestower of Forms (or Colours). To Him belong the Most Beautiful Names: whatever is in the heavens and on earth, doth declare His Praises and Glory: and He is the Exalted in Might, the Wise''
I do not accept any of what you mentioned because no one dared to describe himself like you see above...NO ONE.
Right_Path
Member
You are speaking as if you are fully aware of everything in Physics and Biology...
The problem is that you are looking for scientific evidence to deny God's existence, perhaps you should try the opposite, look for scientific evidence that can convince you God does exist.
You are still unconvinced...this is NOT because of the scarcity of evidence regarding God's existence.
This is because you are following the wrong direction, you are going after evidence that is incompatible with your case, or at least that will make it more difficult for you to get convinced.
If You are looking for proof of God's existence, it will be easier for you to listen to what messengers said about him...rather than following people like einstein, even though his life and works were not focused on God...you just he think he is the smartest guy ever born.
Sui
Member
You're 100% positive that the appendix is a useless organ?
Darwin had a theory that it was used to digest plants when our bodies had the ability to digest cellulose. Okay, so it isn't quite used for that particular purpose anymore. As of last year, biologists/immunologists were onto the theory that the appendix restores our intestines' health (through the production of useful bacteria) after it has been overcome with harmful bacteria from things such as diarrhea, cholera, etc. Such things aren't really a problem here, so when our appendices get taken out and there are no negative effects, it's no big deal. However, what about those in third world countries? Even something like diarrhea can be fatal, so the appendix to them isn't just simply a disposable organ.
Though perhaps these words are not proof to you, I find them a source of valuable reminder:
"In the creation of the heavens and the earth, and the alternation of night and day, and the ships that run in the sea with that which profits men, and the water that Allah sends down from the sky, then gives life therewith to the earth after its death and spreads in it all (kinds of) animals, and the changing of the winds and the clouds made subservient between heaven and earth, there are surely Signs for a people who understand." [Quran 2:164]
I've never paid much detailed attention to physics due to the fact that I abhor math, hehe. But I ask this: since this universe depends on matter and energy, where did said matter and energy come from? Okay, the fundamental particles theoretically formed due to the Big Bang, which I agree with. But where did all the factors for this "big bang" come from? Thin air? Faith is not something that can be wrapped up and handed over in a pretty package to take away all possible doubt. I mean...the signs of God are things you have to see for yourself. By exploring and looking with an open-mind, countless people see them. Countless others don't. It's just a matter of perspective and opinion, that's all.
Darwin had a theory that it was used to digest plants when our bodies had the ability to digest cellulose. Okay, so it isn't quite used for that particular purpose anymore. As of last year, biologists/immunologists were onto the theory that the appendix restores our intestines' health (through the production of useful bacteria) after it has been overcome with harmful bacteria from things such as diarrhea, cholera, etc. Such things aren't really a problem here, so when our appendices get taken out and there are no negative effects, it's no big deal. However, what about those in third world countries? Even something like diarrhea can be fatal, so the appendix to them isn't just simply a disposable organ.
Though perhaps these words are not proof to you, I find them a source of valuable reminder:
"In the creation of the heavens and the earth, and the alternation of night and day, and the ships that run in the sea with that which profits men, and the water that Allah sends down from the sky, then gives life therewith to the earth after its death and spreads in it all (kinds of) animals, and the changing of the winds and the clouds made subservient between heaven and earth, there are surely Signs for a people who understand." [Quran 2:164]
I've never paid much detailed attention to physics due to the fact that I abhor math, hehe. But I ask this: since this universe depends on matter and energy, where did said matter and energy come from? Okay, the fundamental particles theoretically formed due to the Big Bang, which I agree with. But where did all the factors for this "big bang" come from? Thin air? Faith is not something that can be wrapped up and handed over in a pretty package to take away all possible doubt. I mean...the signs of God are things you have to see for yourself. By exploring and looking with an open-mind, countless people see them. Countless others don't. It's just a matter of perspective and opinion, that's all.