Nonspecific gender pronouns

[jamaesi]

That's sad. People ought to know better.

And people get even more upset when people want to be a different gender. It makes me sick.

 

[Ardent Listener]

And people get even more upset when people want to be a different gender. It makes me sick.

Do not ever let them make you ill dear one. But on this issue, we can agree.

 

[Unedited]

I like the idea of nonspecific gender pronouns, but I don't like 'sie' and 'hir.' Mainly, because the way I approach the pronunciation of unknown words, leads me to see them as prounounced identically to 'she' and 'her.'

I usually use 'they' and 'their' and 'them' when I'm trying to be nonspecific. It'd be nice to have something that doesn't require me to use bad grammar.

 

[Jaymes]

The other variants (zie, zir, zu, xe) don't (to me, anyway) sound like she or her; to me sie actually reminds me more of he than she Hir's rather feminine, but it looks to me like a splicing of her and his, so I'm content with it.

 

[michel]

I like the idea of nonspecific gender pronouns, but I don't like 'sie' and 'hir.' Mainly, because the way I approach the pronunciation of unknown words, leads me to see them as prounounced identically to 'she' and 'her.'

I usually use 'they' and 'their' and 'them' when I'm trying to be nonspecific. It'd be nice to have something that doesn't require me to use bad grammar.

Actually, that was pretty much my reaction - for some reason, sie and hir sound Germanic, and don't seem to 'fit' in our language; maybe it's just me.........:help:

But if anyone specifically says that they'd rather be addressed that way, it's no big deal to me..............

 

[Unedited]

Actually, that was pretty much my reaction - for some reason, sie and hir sound Germanic, and don't seem to 'fit' in our language; maybe it's just me.........:help:

That's exactly what I thought! Before I clicked on the link, I thought we were discussing German!

 

[Lintu]

I speak Finnish, which is almost entirely gender-neutral. There are words for girl, woman, and mother (and also queen), but the "human" pronoun is completely neutral, as are most of the people-nouns. It's nice that you don't have to deal with the "everyone find his or her coat" annoyance, but it also makes it a little more difficult to distinguish people.

 

[michel]

I speak Finnish, which is almost entirely gender-neutral. There are words for girl, woman, and mother (and also queen), but the "human" pronoun is completely neutral, as are most of the people-nouns. It's nice that you don't have to deal with the "everyone find his or her coat" annoyance, but it also makes it a little more difficult to distinguish people.

As a French and Spanish speaker, I am more used to making distinctions in sexes, gramatically - you would need many new words to define the distinctions if you were to stretch your idea to those laguages.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I think using nutral gender words is dumb. If we did use them, it would be hard to tell who is who in a news article in a paper.
I just thought this up, it would be a man beating his wife.

Sie hit hir, and then hir hit hir back. Sie screamed I am not yours, but Sie strongly replied, yes you are as sie struck hir in the face, breaking hirs nose. Out of a fit of rage, Sie picked up a crowbar and hit hir on the head, collapsing sir's skull. The police arrested sie, and hir's is awaiting trial.
That is why using gender-nuetral pronouns can be dumb. It would be much better just using he and she, him and her, because, like Kreeden said, we all have a gender.

 

[Jaymes]

Lukewolf: I don't think anyone is suggesting replacing current pronouns with nonspecific gender pronouns, just using them for those that request it. And actually, not everyone has a gender. Everyone has a biological sex, but gender is a diverse thing.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Lukewolf: I don't think anyone is suggesting replacing current pronouns with nonspecific gender pronouns, just using them for those that request it.

I'm just giving an example why replacing them wouldn't work.

 

[michel]

I think using nutral gender words is dumb. If we did use them, it would be hard to tell who is who in a news article in a paper.
I just thought this up, it would be a man beating his wife.

Sie hit hir, and then hir hit hir back. Sie screamed I am not yours, but Sie strongly replied, yes you are as sie struck hir in the face, breaking hirs nose. Out of a fit of rage, Sie picked up a crowbar and hit hir on the head, collapsing sir's skull. The police arrested sie, and hir's is awaiting trial.
That is why using gender-nuetral pronouns can be dumb. It would be much better just using he and she, him and her, because, like Kreeden said, we all have a gender.

I think it makes perfect sense Luke..........I think..........:biglaugh:

Lukewolf: I don't think anyone is suggesting replacing current pronouns with nonspecific gender pronouns, just using them for those that request it. And actually, not everyone has a gender. Everyone has a biological sex, but gender is a diverse thing.

I agree Jensa; I hardly think it's a big thing to ask of people if it matters to you.

 

[standing_on_one_foot]

I personally have a lot of trouble using gender neutral pronouns (the exception being "they" and "them" for third person singular, which I do use a fair amount)...not from a "I don't want to use them" standpoint, I just constantly mess them up. Don't come naturally at all, so sometimes I just end up avoiding pronouns altogether (as much as is reasonably possible, anyway). It's odd, because I have no problem switching back and forth between male and female pronouns for people.

Now, for the other gender-neutral pronoun, "it", that's pretty well out. I hate getting called that, personally.

(I just realized that I use parentheses way too much.)

 

[Bennettresearch]

Jensa !!! what a subject!!

Has anyone here ever driven a Cab? The beauty of being a cab driver is that a lot of people will act like you are not there while driving them or not care whether they offend you or not. Because no one doubts that I am a heterosexual male, I received a lot of pre-emtive attacks by gays who assumed that I was bigoted. It was all an interesting experience. What I will say is that the movement to change our society to adapt to and accept homosexuality as "normal" behavior is ludicrous. I am content to leave them alone but I dont need to be forced into accepting their behavior by the PC crowd.

 

[kreeden]

Am I missing something ? { being up here in the back woods like I am } But what does homosexuality have to do with gender neutral words ?

 

[Jaymes]

I'm just giving an example why replacing them wouldn't work.

Again, why? I don't think anyone was suggesting that.

 

[CaptainXeroid]

...it's PC-ness at its worst...

This sums it up for me. I won't use them in this lifetime.

I'm old school, so I say 'Everyone has his own book'. I do not get bent out of shape if someone says 'Everyone has her own book.' I only use his to match a singular pronoun to a singular subject. I'd rather be grammatically correct than politically correct, so you will never hear me say 'Everyone has their own book.'

I do think it's funny when people get so bent out of shape of it and say things like 'You said his! How do you know it isn't a girl's book.:biglaugh: Some folks need to chill.

 

[Aqualung]

This sums it up for me. I won't use them in this lifetime.

I'm old school, so I say 'Everyone has his own book'. I do not get bent out of shape if someone says 'Everyone has her own book.' I only use his to match a singular pronoun to a singular subject. I'd rather be grammatically correct than politically correct, so you will never hear me say 'Everyone has their own book.'

I do think it's funny when people get so bent out of shape of it and say things like 'You said his! How do you know it isn't a girl's book.:biglaugh: Some folks need to chill.

That sums me up pretty nicely

 

[Jaymes]

:bonk:

I don't know about everyone else, but I was referring specifically to people who have either no or both genders. It would be incorrect to call them he or she--if you don't have one (or have both) you aren't male or female.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

Everyone has a gender.
Only hermafrodites have both genders.
They usually take the gender they dress.

If some bloke dresses female I am quite happy to say she.

Terry
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