Opinion on Wal-Mart to pull of of Washington D.C.

[I.S.L.A.M617]

Its also pre-revolutionary France. If you don't like it, wear steel collars to the guillotine.

That's the wimpy, liberal attitude that got us into this mess in the first place. People feel victimized by their circumstances and are told all the while that they can't help it, so they begin to believe it and get stuck in a rut. The only way to get ahead in this country is to be ambitious and gutsy; anyone that takes the passive route will be left behind in a **** job with nothing to show for it.

 

[tytlyf]

That's the wimpy, liberal attitude that got us into this mess in the first place. People feel victimized by their circumstances and are told all the while that they can't help it, so they begin to believe it and get stuck in a rut. The only way to get ahead in this country is to be ambitious and gutsy; anyone that takes the passive route will be left behind in a **** job with nothing to show for it.

Wow. Assumptions all over the place. Just so you can freshen my perspective of this job world you are affiliated with, what kind of work do you do? What industry? This'll be good.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

Wow. Assumptions all over the place. Just so you can freshen my perspective of this job world you are affiliated with, what kind of work do you do? What industry? This'll be good.

I work in the restaurant industry now, but when I'm done with school I hope to be a lawyer.

 

[dust1n]

Well it certainly wouldn't work with that pessimistic attitude of yours... The only think keeping workers powerless is the fact that they think they're powerless. Whenever I want something from my boss, I go right up to him, demand what I want, and threaten to walk out on the spot if I don't get it (I currently work 4 different positions at my job). I have yet to lose my job, and I work for a good-size corporate chain restaurant. The problem with people today is that they don't have any balls.

You can't just "unionize". You make it sound easy. Its not. The hospital I used to work at would fire anyone who even was associated from anyone with a union. They have had 2 different "purges" where they fired as many as 50 people for just being seen talking to the Union reps that tried to come in.

Have you ever asked your boss about incremental wage increases, benefits, a pension plan, etc.?

 

[Falvlun]

Not with that kind of attitude, they won't... People need to stop playing the victim. This is the land of opportunity, one need only have ambition.

Again, this has nothing to do with attitude, but reality.

As an individual, if you are working at a big corporation doing unskilled labor for minimum wage, your attitude and desire mean jack squat. You either have the option to accept the job at minimum wage, or you can go find some other job.

If you choose to find some other job, that means nothing to the big corporation. You have not harmed them or done anything at all that will have convinced them to change their ways and pay someone like you more.

The only way you can convince a large corporation to pay workers more is if you get a large enough group of people refuse to work for minimum wage, either as a strike or through unionization. Strikes are difficult, since generally the corporation could just find other people willing to do the job. Unionization is becoming increasingly difficult, and many of these corporations strongly oppose the merest whiff of one.

The other way to do it is through political pressure. And by golly, but isn't that just what is happening?

You state that people need to "stop playing the victim" and seize their opportunity... but then complain when they do precisely that with one of the only effective methods left available to them.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

Have you ever asked your boss about incremental wage increases, benefits, a pension plan, etc.?

I already get benefits and a pension plan... And whenever I want a raise I ask for it. I have yet to be denied one.

 

[Falvlun]

I already get benefits and a pension plan... And whenever I want a raise I ask for it. I have yet to be denied one.

I recently went in for my yearly evaluation. The report was glowing. I was literally blushing at the end of the litany of praises heaped on my performance by my boss. I received the standard $0.36 raise. My boss said if it were up to her, she would have given me more, but it wasn't. If it's not up to her, then who is it? Who would I appeal to? Someone who has never seen me work, is completely unfamiliar with what I do, and who has already made the decision that everyone is going to get the same standardized wage increase (as long as they are not deemed grossly incompetant)?

I just think that you guys (by which I mean pro-capitalism, pro-business, pro-workers need to stop whining and just work harder) need to realize that every career, job, company, position, etc, isn't the same. Sure, the standard go-into-your-bosses'-office-and-ask-for-a-raise might work in a small business or a traditional office setting, but I highly doubt that a Walmart employee could do so. And as my experience shows, a lab tech for a hospital in Chicago can't either-- because her boss has no say in raises. Raises are made into a corporate policy rather than an individual opportunity.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

I recently went in for my yearly evaluation. The report was glowing. I was literally blushing at the end of the litany of praises heaped on my performance by my boss. I received the standard $0.36 raise. My boss said if it were up to her, she would have given me more, but it wasn't. If it's not up to her, then who is it? Who would I appeal to? Someone who has never seen me work, is completely unfamiliar with what I do, and who has already made the decision that everyone is going to get the same standardized wage increase (as long as they are not deemed grossly incompetant)?

Anyone above your boss' pay grade. Why not talk to corporate? I've gotten to know my regional corporate manager really well; it's the best way to keep your boss in line.

I just think that you guys (by which I mean pro-capitalism, pro-business, pro-workers need to stop whining and just work harder) need to realize that every career, job, company, position, etc, isn't the same. Sure, the standard go-into-your-bosses'-office-and-ask-for-a-raise might work in a small business or a traditional office setting, but I highly doubt that a Walmart employee could do so. And as my experience shows, a lab tech for a hospital in Chicago can't either-- because her boss has no say in raises. Raises are made into a corporate policy rather than an individual opportunity.

Again, there's always someone you can talk to. It's a matter of balls and ambition. This is America.

 

[Falvlun]

Anyone above your boss' pay grade. Why not talk to corporate? I've gotten to know my regional corporate manager really well; it's the best way to keep your boss in line.


Again, there's always someone you can talk to. It's a matter of balls and ambition. This is America.

AKA "fantasy land" :yes:

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

Because pessimism is always better than taking a shot and seeing what comes of it :sarcastic ...

 

[Brickjectivity]

Woa that's not what this is about. Of course people ought to strike out on their own. They should work for higher paying jobs, but DC/Walmart is a different situation. You can't work for a good paying job there. Where is the upward mobility? Sometimes life throws a curve ball, and you just have to take what work you can get. Not everybody is single and young or male either. Not everybody is even perfectly sane, but everybody matters. Not everybody can jump a train or start a company. Not everybody has 'Balls' as you say, but everybody has the ability to contribute towards a larger economy.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

Woa that's not what this is about. Of course people ought to strike out on their own. They should work for higher paying jobs, but DC/Walmart is a different situation. You can't work for a good paying job there. Where is the upward mobility? Sometimes life throws a curve ball, and you just have to take what work you can get. Not everybody is single and young or male either. Not everybody is even perfectly sane, but everybody matters. Not everybody can jump a train or start a company. Not everybody has 'Balls' as you say, but everybody has the ability to contribute towards a larger economy.

You can demand better pay than you're getting. If that's still not enough, don't work for Walmart.
I disagree with everyone being important. Nobody's important until they make themselves stand out; this country is all about what you're willing to do for yourself.

 

[dust1n]

I already get benefits and a pension plan... And whenever I want a raise I ask for it. I have yet to be denied one.

I see. Thanks.

 

[dust1n]

Because pessimism is always better than taking a shot and seeing what comes of it :sarcastic ...

Of course it isn't... but overt optimism runs contrary to people's real-life experiences... which I imagine is why you are getting contention in the first place.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

Of course it isn't... but overt optimism runs contrary to people's real-life experiences... which I imagine is why you are getting contention in the first place.

I wouldn't call it optimism. It's a desire to get ahead and the drive to back it up, not an expectation of the best result.

 

[Brickjectivity]

this country is all about what you're willing to do for yourself.

Not so. Not so. Its a union of people.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

Not so. Not so. Its a union of people.

You do understand what capitalism is, don't you? This isn't the "People's Republik of Amerika"...

 

[Brickjectivity]

There is Capitalism here, but the country is a union first. The preamble to the US Constitution states that the purpose thereof is to "Form a more perfect union" and does not mention Capitalism although it does refer to Libertarian principles. We once fought a civil war for the union and let the capitalism slide. For a long time now capitalism has been in fashion, but the union is more important. We are a rocking or see-sawing balance of Libertarian and Utilitarian beliefs usually. The Libertarian is similar to what you are talking about, and the Utilitarian is about justice and equal opportunity for all. The Libertarian principles and rhetoric are about freedom from the divine right of kings and mainly come from the reasoning of a man named John Locke. The Utilitarian principles were put into words a little bit later than that, but they are deeply ingrained in US culture and are also partly responsible for its successes so far. Its a young country, obviously. I'm not claiming that we're always right or that we don't occasionally lean too far towards Utilitarian principles, but sometimes we have to do that or the capitalist machine goes crazy, starts grinding people up for gear-lube, burning souls to make electricity etc. We have to swing one way then the other like a waggling ant does to stay on its path.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

The country being a union of states has nothing to do with the fact that you have to make your own fortune here... This isn't a Communist country; everyone does have to fend for him/herself. You can sit around waiting for more money to fall out of the sky, but you'll be sorely disappointed because life in this country just doesn't work that way. If you don't like it, Cuba's nice this time of year...

 

[Brickjectivity]

You can sit around waiting for more money to fall out of the sky, but you'll be sorely disappointed because life in this country just doesn't work that way. If you don't like it, Cuba's nice this time of year...

I don't think that you should assume people would want to do that. Most people are like you and want to deserve what we get. We have pride and brains. I think people in communist countries also would prefer to work and deserve what they get, though I think that inefficient government policies and bad economies have often undermined that pride and those brains. I've only met two people with the attitude you are talking about, and both were homeless and probably not right in the head. Normal people don't think that way. That is absolutely not what I would support, however I do think unions are a necessity as well as occasional government interference. On the other hand I don't think government interference ever solves economic problems permanently.