Original copy of the characters of the "golden plates"

[FFH]

I sincerely thank you for correcting me Jensa.

 

[Jaymes]

You are right I goofed. I had a stupid brain freeze. The kanji for love is spelled with a hirigana "a" and "i". I goofed big time thanks for correcting me. I told you I was rusty. It's been over 15 years.

Ai: 愛
A: あ
I: い

What?

There are several characters that make up the hanzi for 'ai'. Xin (heart/mind) 心 is one of them, along with 友 you (friend). It isn't phonetic no matter how much you try to make it such, though.

 

[FFH]

Hmmm, hirigana "Je" and "n" and "sa". Sounds very Japanese. Maybe there is a Japanese word or name that could give some insight into the meaning of your name. Where did you come up with this name? Is it asian?

 

[Jaymes]

My real name is Jenna, and a friend typoed it as 'Jennsa' when going to hit the a button one day. I dropped the extra n, and it's been my nickname since then.

 

[FFH]

Ai: 愛
A: あ
I: い

What?

There are several characters that make up the hanzi for 'ai'. Xin (heart/mind) 心 is one of them, along with 友 you (friend). It isn't phonetic no matter how much you try to make it such, though.

You are right again. This is not an example of a two or more syllable kanji, but it is made up of two vowels or hirigana "a" and "i" Your name, if it it were spelled in hirigana, would have three seperate hirigana, like i showed you earlier. "Je" "n" "sa" . Three seperate hirigana or simplified symbols. If there was a Kanji equivilant it would read Jensa in one or two more complex symbols.

I will try to post an example of this. Sorry the "ai" symbol is not an example of a two syllable word but it does have the two seperate hirigana symbols "a" and "i". The first two vowels in the Japanese language.

 

[FFH]

here is a link to an example of some very simple two or more syllable words like "dare" which means who. Spelled with a hirigana "da" and "re". "Dare" could be written using a more complex symbol, which could be written in the place of writing the two hirigana symbols. I will look for the Kanji for "dare" or "who". We as missionaries did not use these more complicated symbols. Each kanji would sometimes have a corresponding hirigana notation below it so we could read it. Like at a train station for instance. Do you get the idea?

http://www.polykarbon.com/japan/hirigana/practice.htm

 

[FFH]

Not all words are represented with just one Kanji. For instance "Nihongo" or the word for Japanese is not represented with just one kanji. Love or "ai" is an example of one word in Japanese that is represented with one kanji. Many Japanese names and words are made up of two Kanji or two complex syllables. I am not even sure if "dare" is one complex syllable or two. I cannot remember. I am looking for this kanji so we can both see. We as missionaries were not required to learn these. I have just always remembered the love kanji and had a Japanese woman paint it for me and had it framed.

 

[FFH]

Actually there is no equivilant for the word love in Japanese. The Japanese do not use the word love so there is no direct translation. That is why there would be some other definition of this kanji very similar to love. They do not use the word love but we were told that this is the closest kanji used to represent love (the one that I use in my avatar) in the Japanese cultrue. You have to understand that showing affection for one another, especially in public, was not the norm.

 

[FFH]

My real name is Jenna, and a friend typoed it as 'Jennsa' when going to hit the a button one day. I dropped the extra n, and it's been my nickname since then.

Cool.

 

[Solon]

Its a Fake, and in no sense is a real script. just something put together from other texts. HOAX.

S

 

[john63]

Solon, I like you, but you crack me up. You are so 100% positive that the plates of Nephi are a hoax and a fabrication and consequently the entire LDS Church is a fake. At the same time you believe in the existence of pagan gods. You can believe that Zeus exists, but you can't even acknowledge that there's even a possibility of the plates being real.


Solon, please show me the tangible eveidence that you have of any of your gods' existence. I don't mean ancient writings or statues of them, I mean undeniable proof. If you can I will apologise for this post.

 

[jazzalta]

If these Mormon plates are the foundation of the religion, why aren't they preserved here on earth? As well as the ten commandments. To me it seems kind of important to have tangible evidence to go along with blind faith. There's just too many "it is God's will" to use as excuses.

 

[benjosh]

Hi Jazzalta, you said

If these Mormon plates are the foundation of the religion, why aren't they preserved here on earth? As well as the ten commandments. To me it seems kind of important to have tangible evidence to go along with blind faith. There's just too many "it is God's will" to use as excuses.

You, like all of us can arrive at evidences (leading to conclusions?), in two modes of reasoning.

Inductive or deductive.

Do you work from the abstract/theorum down to the specific or vis/versa?
In deductive reasoning foundations are not laid on the ground of observed phenomena. Evidences are observed because one has ownership in the abstract construct.

With inductive reasoning, in your case, you want some physical evidence to overwhelm what you've induced. In essence you are saying, "give me proof or I won't believe you."

in spiritual matters, it is after you say, "I believe you" that evidences appear in an often surprising manner, in a form of truth that was always near but not accessible to your consciousness because your abstract has always been "I don't believe".

You will never fully know until you suspend what you think you know and open yourself to possibilities.

BenJosh

 

[MdmSzdWhtGuy]

Solon, I like you, but you crack me up. You are so 100% positive that the plates of Nephi are a hoax and a fabrication and consequently the entire LDS Church is a fake. At the same time you believe in the existence of pagan gods. You can believe that Zeus exists, but you can't even acknowledge that there's even a possibility of the plates being real.


Solon, please show me the tangible eveidence that you have of any of your gods' existence. I don't mean ancient writings or statues of them, I mean undeniable proof. If you can I will apologise for this post.

There is absolutely no more, and just as importantly no less evidence for the existence of Zeuss than there is of the God of the Bible. Zero tangible, measurable evidence for the existence of anything supernatural at all.

However, Stone Tablets, Gold Plates, The Ark of the Covenant, Noah's Ark, and the like are claims for divinely inspired tangible physical measurable objects. I think anyone would agree there is no evidence for the existence of supernatural spirits or beings, but when someone is claiming that a sacred object exists, or existed, I don't think it disengenuous to ask for such an object to be produced.

B.

 

[benjosh]

There is absolutely no more, and just as importantly no less evidence for the existence of Zeuss than there is of the God of the Bible. Zero tangible, measurable evidence for the existence of anything supernatural at all.

However, Stone Tablets, Gold Plates, The Ark of the Covenant, Noah's Ark, and the like are claims for divinely inspired tangible physical measurable objects. I think anyone would agree there is no evidence for the existence of supernatural spirits or beings, but when someone is claiming that a sacred object exists, or existed, I don't think it disengenuous to ask for such an object to be produced.

B.

I think you have made my point as I presented it to Jazzalta. People operate from abstracts/theories (like Zeus exists) and they have no physical proof, but then they can turn around and criticize the conclusions of someone who has done the same thing.

That's the blind showing the blind how to drive a car. They're going somewhere. We don't know where.

But get out of the way. . . . and if they get too dangerous start warning other people.

BenJosh

 

[john63]

There is absolutely no more, and just as importantly no less evidence for the existence of Zeuss than there is of the God of the Bible. Zero tangible, measurable evidence for the existence of anything supernatural at all.

However, Stone Tablets, Gold Plates, The Ark of the Covenant, Noah's Ark, and the like are claims for divinely inspired tangible physical measurable objects. I think anyone would agree there is no evidence for the existence of supernatural spirits or beings, but when someone is claiming that a sacred object exists, or existed, I don't think it disengenuous to ask for such an object to be produced.

B.

But since the plates are said to now reside with the Angel Moroni in heaven, that would make them supernatural, not a tangible physical measurable object. I understand what your saying though.

 

[Solon]

This thread isn't about the veracity of my beliefs, which you can discuss in a new thread if you so wish. This thread is about that pathetic attempt to pass off that so-called copy of script of the non-exsistent gold plates as a real script based upon demotic Egyptian. Which, as I 've shown and others as well, is patent rubbish.

S

 

[john63]

This thread isn't about the veracity of my beliefs, which you can discuss in a new thread if you so wish. This thread is about that pathetic attempt to pass off that so-called copy of script of the non-exsistent gold plates as a real script based upon demotic Egyptian. Which, as I 've shown and others as well, is patent rubbish.

S

Not my point. I was trying to say that it's impossible for any of us to validate our claims with earthly tangible evidence. Everyone here knows that all of our beliefs, save a few, are based on pretty much faith alone. That's why we call them "faiths". I don't even understand the point of these threads that ask for proof of things that are based on faith.

It seems to me that the only purpose they serve is to validate in the mind of the challenger his or her belief that the religion in question is a fake. In that case, why waste so much bandwidth? Why don't we all just tell each other we're all full of baloney and get it done with.

 

[FFH]

I have found, and have come to the conclusion, after reading these last few posts, that the opposition to such beliefs, as ours, actually helps us dive deeper into the evidences of these subjects being discussed. It only helps to reinforce our convictions. In a strange way I appreciate all of the opposing comments. They help me think a little deeper about the subject and it moves me to find more evidences regarding the subject we are discussing. All are edified. All have something to offer, whether it be for or against the topic of discussion. Solon, as well as you John63, have much to offer that I could not offer on the subject. Many people on both sides of the issues have offered much information that helps us to dig deeper into the subject being discussed. It was another thread started by Solon that prompted me into digging a little deeper into the evidences that the "golden plates" existed. I greatly respect Solon's knowledge of certain subjects. Everyone has a knowledge about certain subjects more than another. Solon seems to know a lot more about Egytian and Greek history than any of us and I respect him for that. I still believe what I believe, and Solon still believes what he believes, that may never change, but in a strange way we are both edified by the various threads in this forum, for or against the subject. It is not baloney, but very important in the progression of our knowledge.

Read the parable of the wheat and the tares. Both the wheat and the tares must exist together. The tare represents the opposition or the opposing force. The tare strengthens the wheat and makes it grow taller and stronger and in the end results in a better harvest.

 

[Solon]

A fair enough point FFH, and taken in the spirit of contesting the issues in a forthright manner that is true debate.

S