outrage with islam

[Autodidact]

And your back at square one, its unjust to YOU, not just YOU personally, but western civilization and OTHER countries.

Believe it or not, other countries think we do unjust things as well

And they're welcome to start threads about that.

The purpose of this forum is to debate. If someone thinks this law is just, they are welcome to say so, here, and why they think so.

 

[Autodidact]

And your back at square one, its unjust to YOU, not just YOU personally, but western civilization and OTHER countries.

Believe it or not, other countries think we do unjust things as well

Of course me. Who else's opinion would I be giving. Now, do you agree or disagree with my opinion?

 

[outhouse]

I wasn't "going after you" Again:IT ISN'T ABOUT YOU. You are not the topic of this thread and you are not the focal point of this conversation (sheesh).

I know im not

Now, what do you really want?

 

[Sahar]

now, what do you really want?

lol!! :d

 

[Quagmire]

I know im not

Now, what do you really want?

What a strange question. Look, you made a point, ie., that making any effort to understand other cultures or religions is somehow a sign of weakness, a form of pandering. I think it's fair to surmise by the implications of this, as well as by going over your responses to some of the other posts in this and other threads, that you consider it more appropriate to judge, condemn, and attack anything that you don't understand.

Now, that said, you're in the position of either having to defend that stance, or admit that it's flawed.

All you've done so far is to try and change the subject by reiterating the point you were making in your OP.

Again, I don't think you quite understand how a debate is supposed to work. A debate should go like this:

An intelligent debate schematic:

Someone presents a point.

The next person either supports and expands on that point, if they agree, or offers a counterpoint if they disagree.

And the debate goes on from there.

whats been going on in our little back-and-forth:

You made a point (see above).

I showed you why I thought your point was flawed.

You as much as said: "I decline to respond to your rebuttal, but for the sake of changing the subject here's a pointless little sermon for ya. "

I tried to get you to address my original response.

You made a token effort, started making mysteriously unrelated responses to my posts, and kept asking why you were being picked on.

Again, it doesn't look to me like you understand the whole idea behind a debate.

I get the impression that you think you're here to give a lecture, that the rest of us (as the audience) are free to either agree or be silent, and that if anyone disagrees they're heckling you.

AGAIN: IT-ISN'T-ABOUT-YOU.

 

[outhouse]

that making any effort to understand other cultures or religions is somehow a sign of weakness

did i say this or is this how you percieved my statement

that you don't understand

I understand theres a terrible thing happening due to religion

you consider it more appropriate to judge, condemn, and attack

show me a red blooded american who doesnt think this is tragic and that murder is justified because of there cultural beliefs.

You made a token effort

not in my eyes

you're here to give a lecture

I dont feel like im here to give a lecture.

if anyone disagrees they're heckling you.

Thats not it either, all i need is to simply understand your question.



Look I stated we should not have to learn there culture when it comes to murder. I stand behind this.

you then argued about my stand. You have a question, please ask without putting words in my mouth.

 

[Quagmire]

You have a question, please ask without putting words in my mouth.

OMG. Do you really think anybody here is stupid enough not to see what you did with my last post?


anyway, now that I see what depths you're willing to stoop to I'm done with you man. Have fun.

 

[outhouse]

So you really think attempting to understand where the person sitting across the table from you is coming from is kissing butt somehow?

It's as if you're saying, "I refuse to understand you, but I'm going to judge you anyway, according to my own standards, which I don't expect you to understand". Doesn't sound like a real promising scenario as far as resolution goes, but it's a fantastic recipe for self-righteousness.

look i dont want to argue with you, your coming after me. im just trying, trying to defend myself.

you state " is kissing butt somehow" , did i say that? or are you assuming, or putting words in my mouth??

And as far as

It's as if you're saying, "I refuse to understand you

that another wrong statement on your part, the "IF" is wrong

I do not refuse to understand I understand quite clearly.

You would be correct if we were talking about common law and the punishment. When the punishment is blatent murder, not punishment all bets are off.

Do you understand me now?

 

[Quagmire]

Do you understand me now?

there was never any misunderstanding on my part.

 

[crimsonlung]

Of course me. Who else's opinion would I be giving. Now, do you agree or disagree with my opinion?

I agree with your opinion about it being wrong, yes, we share that aspect.

 

[YmirGF]

What do you mean by marginal?

The explanations i heard for it are quite convincing, and are in context with other things in the Quran. If you mean by marginal that it is less likely, or that its based on something weak, then i disagree.

No, of course not, lol. It is that the opinion itself is marginal.

 

[crimsonlung]

No, of course not, lol. It is that the opinion itself is marginal.

How do you know? Majority of the Muslims I talk to here in San Diego all agree that the verse does not mean cut off hands and would side against that behavior in the Middle East. I've discussed this question with relatives and Sheiks IN various parts of Jordan and they also disagree with hand chopping and the sentence on this girl.

In fact, the Mid East might even be using her as a bargaining chip with the US or other countries for humanitarian Aid or something, NK does that all the time.

 

[YmirGF]

How do you know? Majority of the Muslims I talk to here in San Diego all agree that the verse does not mean cut off hands and would side against that behavior in the Middle East. I've discussed this question with relatives and Sheiks IN various parts of Jordan and they also disagree with hand chopping and the sentence on this girl.

In fact, the Mid East might even be using her as a bargaining chip with the US or other countries for humanitarian Aid or something, NK does that all the time.

What do I care about what a minor group of people in San Diego thinks? Splitting hairs: I am not talking about any particular case but the opinion of the most highly regarded schools of thought in Sunni Islam. I take it they're are a bit behind the times... perhaps they will eventually recognize they are so deeply misunderstanding.

 

[Autodidact]

I've seen this a couple of times, where you have a word in the qur'an in Arabic, and it yields wildly different translations into English. It makes me wonder how people reading it Arabic use it, and how on earth they know what it's supposed to mean.

Which of course raises the question as to why on earth an almighty and brilliant God would use this method to communicate His laws, and expect us to follow them.

 

[Meow Mix]

I've seen this a couple of times, where you have a word in the qur'an in Arabic, and it yields wildly different translations into English. It makes me wonder how people reading it Arabic use it, and how on earth they know what it's supposed to mean.

Which of course raises the question as to why on earth an almighty and brilliant God would use this method to communicate His laws, and expect us to follow them.

I watched a funny video on the Tower of Babel that raised a great point... God confuses all the languages on Earth, then suddenly one of the angels says to God, "Um... you realize that now they're going to have to translate your Word into all those languages and lose things in the translation and give future cartoonists something to mock, right?"

That struck me as funny and an interesting point at the same time.