Pagans: If the God and Goddess Are Equal...

[Sunstone]

If the God and Goddess are equal, then why does the Goddess get almost all the press and the God is seldom talked about? Are they really equal? Or, is something going on here that I'm not aware of?

 

[Willamena]

Blame feminists. At least, those who feel some need to 'correct' a balance by unbalacing it.

 

[Sunstone]

Please respect that this thread is in the Same Faith Debates section and is meant to be Pagans only.

 

[Feathers in Hair]

If the God and Goddess are equal, then why does the Goddess get almost all the press and the God is seldom talked about? Are they really equal? Or, is something going on here that I'm not aware of?

I think that the Goddess get most of the press because it's something that sets apart we Pagans (or at least those of us who honor all 'genders') from most any other faith. A number (I was about to say 'many', and then caught myself- there's almost no way to characterize all Pagans!) of us see the Male and the Female as being equal in the divine, but choose to honor the Female first. For example, if I'm overjoyed about something, I'll sometimes say "Goddess be praised!" Much as in the same way that many Christians honor their God as encompassing all genders (or no genders) but still refer to the god as "He", Pagans sometimes forget to actively acknowledge the aspect of Deity that is (to some traditions) equally important. I'm afraid I'm one of those people, simply because I haven't found very many male deities I connect with.

 

[Pardus]

Tho i will agree with his point.

I am a pagan, but i avoid the pagan community because it is too full of unbalenced individuals.

 

[Gentoo]

If the God and Goddess are equal, then why does the Goddess get almost all the press and the God is seldom talked about? Are they really equal? Or, is something going on here that I'm not aware of?

I've been wondering that exact same thing. Taditional Gardnarian Wiccan High Priestesses just kinda stand there looking pretty while the High Priest does a lot of the actual work.

And then there are the Dianic Wiccans...

But really I think that it's a response to an overly patriarchal society that throw the men into a higher place than women.

 

[Feathers in Hair]

And then there are the Dianic Wiccans...

There are, indeed, branches of the Dianic tradition that acknowledge only the Goddess, but there are also ones that recognize the male aspect of Deity.

 

[Gentoo]

There are, indeed, branches of the Dianic tradition that acknowledge only the Goddess, but there are also ones that recognize the male aspect of Deity.

Are there? I haven't heard of any... if there are, then those groups balance out the others

 

[Pardus]

They still perpetuate the imbalance by being imbalanced themselves.

 

[Feathers in Hair]

Are there? I haven't heard of any... if there are, then those groups balance out the others

Hehee, if there weren't, I wouldn't be Dianic! McFarland tradition is really the only widely known one, though. (There may be others that I'm unfamiliar with, too.)

 

[Feathers in Hair]

They still perpetuate the imbalance by being imbalanced themselves.

How do you mean?

 

[Pardus]

If it is believed that feminist movements/religions are there because of the imbalence within the patriarchial system, which means that when you tip to one side you create a need for others to tip to the other.

Meaning that if you try to rebalance things against them, you give them more reason to exist.

 

[Feathers in Hair]

So you are referring to those Pagan traditions that state that the Goddess should be worshipped over the God? If so, I certainly agree.

 

[Pardus]

Other than those trads, what is dianic?

 

[Feathers in Hair]

Other than those trads, what is dianic?

In the McFarland tradition, it's a non-heirarchal, Faerie-centered path. I'm begining to realize, though, that in my joy in finding what I'd thought was a good summary/ term for what my general beliefs, that there seems to be a conflict in trying to explain what I believe- that one can celebrate the feminine and still honor the male- and what the tradition itself seems to have a perception of being.

My apologies to everyone. I was just so happy for a brief time to have thought there was a name for my tradition.

 

[Mike182]

In the McFarland tradition, it's a non-heirarchal, Faerie-centered path. I'm begining to realize, though, that in my joy in finding what I'd thought was a good summary/ term for what my general beliefs, that there seems to be a conflict in trying to explain what I believe- that one can celebrate the feminine and still honor the male- and what the tradition itself seems to have a perception of being.

My apologies to everyone. I was just so happy for a brief time to have thought there was a name for my tradition.

i have always seen, and i may very well be ignorant in this, that dianic traditions put a lot more emphasis on the feminin than the masculine - but that is not me saying Dianic traditions are bad/wrong, just different

i myself tend to be guilty of overlooking male Deities to an extent, i am yet to find one i am completely comfortable relating to and working with, where as i have found a few female deities that *fit* with me. this is something i am aware of, and hope to balance out in time when i have become accustomed with one or two male Deities, i think the masculine aspect is deffinatley missing in my spiritual path at the moment :sad4:

in answer to the OP, yes, i think a balance between the two is a healthy spiritual path for myself, and i hope to find that - but i wouldn't say that someone who does not have a balance of God and Goddess is in some way wrong. i guess it depends upon the individual's needs, or the needs of the person at specific times in their lives...

... at certain times in my life, i might feel the need to boost the elements of my personality that i attribute to the Goddess, so i will primarily focus upon her at those times, and vice verse. but i guess in a way that might balance itself out, again i guess it depends upon the individual needs of the person.

 

[Pardus]

that one can celebrate the feminine and still honor the male

Do you notice a problem in what you said there? It might be a typo, or it might be more important.

"Feminine" and "Male"

I would assert that feminity has nothing to do with female empowerment (yes i know i'm just "strawman"ing here) acctually female empowerment is quite a masculine thing, it is about your masculinity.

Goddess gives/nutures life, God takes/defends life. (You must kill to eat, animal, vegetable, does not matter)

We all have both within us.

 

[Makhsihed]

It depends on what sect of paganism you're talking about, I think.

The Wiccan and Wicca-derived paths of paganism tend to concentrate more on the Goddess than the God, agreed. But it's not that way in the non-Wicca-esque traditions.

For instance, the Heathens/Norse pay a lot of homage to Odhinn and Thor just as they honor Freyja and Frigg (and so on); there's not so much exalting female over male or vice versa. Same with Hellenics. Same with Celtic Reconstructionists, Druids, etc.

Any reconstructionist faith doesn't really honor male over female or female over male, for the most part, from what I've seen.

And then there's Kemetic pagan/Kemetic reconstructionist, which is anything but dualistic - there's no stark concentration on male/female dualism like there is in Wicca.

(My apologies if I'm slightly incoherant. The naprosyn is fuzzing my brain. @_@ )

 

[Zephyr]

Jumping in here a bit late, but oh well. Makhsihed put it pretty well. When it comes to Heathenry, who said the Gods and Goddesses are equal? Some gods are clearly more powerful than eachother, but they all fit in their own little place. While Woden or Ziu are clearly stronger then Walburga Frouwa or Frija, they certainly would be in a bind if they tried to fill their places.

 

[enchanted_one1975]

The God and Goddess (or Gods and Goddesses) serve different purposes. They are often looked to for different reasons. We may even have One that is preferred and that we look to more often in general, as we are just more comfortable with that particular One. The best way I can describe my views on this is the way one may look at their parents. You should love them equally. Yet there are things you are more comfortable talking to mom about and things you are more comfortable talking to dad about. They both know this is going on and they should not be jealous. They should both be glad you are communicating with one, the other, or both when you need them. Now, a different aspect to look at is this:

There are those like me who worship multiple Gods and Goddesses. While there are some Goddesses that I see as "Motherly" to me, my Gods and Goddesses have certain specialties. It is when the issue I have deals with one of Their specialties that I pick and choose (usually). Otherwise, I do have one particular God and one particular Goddess that I look to in pretty much the same way as the above analogy.