oldbadger
Skanky Old Mongrel!
That's made your week, I expect.
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Paid less for doing exactly the same work
- Thread starter David Young
- Start date
HonestJoe
Well-Known Member
For exactly the same work, probably not, though only because of the various laws and regulations requiring equal pay in the first place.
The issue isn't limited to that though. There are plenty of circumstances where there are jobs or roles that are traditionally seen as specifically "male" or "female", and remain that way due to social pressure, internal resistance to change or explicit discrimination. The traditional "male" jobs will often be see as more valuable than the traditional "female" jobs solely based on that gender perception, even in in reality they involve equivalent levels of effort, education and skill, and that can obviously continue to impact the pay levels offered and expected of those jobs.
There can be similar issues in any jobs where pay can be or is individually negotiated to some extent, with women tending to be offered less than men in similar positions. While the common comeback on that is that women don't negotiate as aggressively as men (which I'm not sure is a justification, even if true) but I strongly suspect that women who pushed harder for more pay would be seen as argumentative and disruptive when men who do the same are seen as strong and confident.
These are slowly shrinking problems I think, but they certainly haven't been reduced to nothing.
You've made my year!
David Young
Member
The BBC story may need some clarification.
There were two programmes, one a long-running show from the pre-internet days and another more recent one on a digital channel. They both involved reading out emails, and previously letters, from viewers. One was about anything on television and the other was specifically about the news. The presenter of the news programme, who was female, was paid less than the presenter of the television-feedback programme, who was male.
The courts decided that both should be paid the same and that the reason they were not was because of their difference in sex, despite the claims of the BBC's lawyers to the contrary. Incidentally, the male presenter of the BBC's television-feedback programme was paid the same as his predecessor, who was a woman and who had negotiated a higher salary than her predecessor, who was a man.
As for all of the posts that talk about average salaries, read the original post.
There were two programmes, one a long-running show from the pre-internet days and another more recent one on a digital channel. They both involved reading out emails, and previously letters, from viewers. One was about anything on television and the other was specifically about the news. The presenter of the news programme, who was female, was paid less than the presenter of the television-feedback programme, who was male.
The courts decided that both should be paid the same and that the reason they were not was because of their difference in sex, despite the claims of the BBC's lawyers to the contrary. Incidentally, the male presenter of the BBC's television-feedback programme was paid the same as his predecessor, who was a woman and who had negotiated a higher salary than her predecessor, who was a man.
As for all of the posts that talk about average salaries, read the original post.
oldbadger
Skanky Old Mongrel!
David, your opening post was a question, but maybe your intent was to push your favoured answer?
When I mentioned BBC newsreaders' pay my first thought was about the unreasonably high wages they all receive, but this knowledge only came to light because of a female claim and the subsequent arguments. That's why it came to my mind.
You might find it strange but many women feel that they get a lesser deal than men in their employments, despite legislation that demands equal pay for same jobs.
I don't think that the situation is severe now....
But I get the impression that there are still gaps in the delivery of the legislation, and out of several answers to exactly that question on dear old 'google', this was the first reply:-
----------------+++++
Women in the UK are not paid the same as men:
- Gender pay gap
In April 2024, the gender pay gap in the UK was 7.0% for full-time employees, down from 7.5% in 2023. However, the gap varies by sector, age, and occupation:- Sector: The highest pay gap is in finance and insurance (27.9%), while the lowest is in caring, leisure, and other service occupations.
- Age: The gap is larger for employees aged 40 and over than those under 40.
- Occupation: The gap is highest in skilled trades occupations.
- Region: The gap is higher in every English region than in Wales, Scotland, or Northern Ireland.
- Sector: The highest pay gap is in finance and insurance (27.9%), while the lowest is in caring, leisure, and other service occupations.
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Yes. Although laws have largely irradicated this in lower paying fields, especially in union shops, when you start getting into salaried personnel the disparities begin. In fact, the higher you go in the food chain, the greater the sexual disparity.
"ASAE’s executive compensation team, which consults with associations and boards of directors to benchmark salaries in associations, analyzed data from 2,868 national associations that had paid a full-time CEO. They found that women association chief executives continue to earn less than men in the same positions in nearly every organizational category. In trade groups, women earn a median of 12 percent less. In professional societies, it is 10 percent less. A surface look at the data reveals female leaders earn 27 percent less than their male counterparts"
If you read the entire article, you will find that the actual situation is more complicated. Life is just messy. Very few things are black and white. Nevertheless the general trend holds that in positions of leadership, women are paid considerably less.
Women CEOs Earn Less Than Male Counterparts in Associations
Other notable websites addressing this issue:
Gender Pay Gap for Executives Grew During Pandemic
The pay gap between male and female executives at U.S. companies expanded during the pandemic after years of improvement. While transparent pay practices help reduce the gender pay gap, they do so primarily below the executive level.