Paranormal activity

[1137]

Consciousness is more than just awareness, which is what i have repeated so many times. If you are making the claim that this is your thread and you get to make the definitions in your thread about what you want, well that doesn't really make you any different from religious fundamentalists and I will stop wasting my time.

Here, see if you can somehow keep up.

So I have noticed that people use paranormal activity, mainly ghost experiences (is there any other kind?) as evidence for a soul, an astral body, or even other supernatural forces. Some pass it off as demons, others say it proves that there is a soul or that consciousness can survive death. Then, of course, others say it is all nonsense, misinterpretations or tricks of the mind.

I personally do not believe in these hopeful concepts such as consciousness survival. I do not believe in souls, I definitely do not believe in angels and demons. But I have had ghostly experiences all my life, many that I cannot explain or rationalize away without abandoning my love for logic, evidence, and intelligence. So I wanted to reconcile this with my lack of belief in supernatural and magical nonsense. What I came up with is extremely basic since I am not an expert on the more advanced aspects.

My theory is vague currently. I posit that 'ghosts' are caused pretty much by a glitch in the system that is this third dimensional reality as we perceive it. Time is an illusion that we experience here, it does not exist. I say that when you see a ghost, which is usually not a clear image, it is existing in the past and somehow is observable in our third dimensional space. This explains, also, why ghost seem to linger in places they spend a significant amount of time in.

Obviously, I currently cannot explain this 'glitch'.

Discuss.

This is the original post. When referring to consciousness I am not talking about some subtle mind, new agey idea here. Replace "consciousness" with "awareness" (what the word means in English) an this would be easily solved.

You are not thinking logically. You have assumed what the conclusion is (consciousness is separate from the brain) and are trying to make the premises fit.

Again, ignore this whole new agey, supernatural idea of consciousness you are getting caught up an and, instead, use the English language (which is what dictionaries do).

Sorry to disappoint...

con·scious·ness /ˈkänCHəsnəs/
Noun: 1. The state of being awake and aware of one's surroundings.
2. The awareness or perception of something by a person.

Consciousness is awareness and google is your friend.

Here I even provided the English definition of consciousness, the meaning of the word and not a magical separate force.

No, you are starting with the observation that paranormal activity exists, assuming the conclusion that it means consciousness is separate from the brain, and filling in the blanks. Then you are saying that theories that reject the conclusion you leaped for and grasped onto cannot be correct. No, that is not how science works.

Again, basic English. If you want to explain to me how you can be aware without your brain working I would be fascinated.

So you are the type that realizes the provided definition we are actually discussing is against what you believe, so you just choose to deny it? I find that highly annoying. The definition of consciousness, as related to this thread, is awareness. When you die, and your brain stops working, there is no way to be aware. People try to complicate it because they want consciousness to be some magical, super special and amazing thing that can live after death, because it all being over is just too depressing. Being conscious is being aware.

I even specifically restated the fact that we are talking about definitions and not new age philosophy.

Yeah you really have proven me wrong, haven't you. As far as this thread goes, consciousness = awareness. Have anything to contribute?

Obviously you are having some comprehension problems here. This thread was created to discuss paranormal experiences without the silly idea that we will be aware (aka conscious) after death. Anything to contribute?

Consciousness | Define Consciousness at Dictionary.com
Consciousness - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary
conscious - definition of conscious by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.

Ok how is it possible that you cannot grasp that "consciousness", in this thread, is awareness? Am I speaking a foreign language, is this like way more complex than I realize? Utterly ridiculous.

Catching on?

 

[1137]

Anyways i'm not going to waste my time anymore since this doens't match your 'definition'.

I am honored that you think I am such an amazing person, but I did not create the English language, therefore this is not "my" definition. However, if you cannot keep up with the conversation leaving is a respectful choice.

 

[MD]

I'm not talking about some new agey crap, this is a real problem in the scientific world. Consciousness is an absolutely amazing occurence which is very difficult to define and some say science may never be able to because it is a subjective experience. This is called the 'hard problems' of consciousness. There's even work being done on consciousness and quantum mechanics.

Anyways this is all about what YOUR definition of consciousness is rather than the actual ambiguity of what consciousness actually is in the first place. Next time don't try to act so smug, it doesn't make you sound any more credible.

 

[MD]

I am honored that you think I am such an amazing person, but I did not create the English language, therefore this is not "my" definition. However, if you cannot keep up with the conversation leaving is a respectful choice.

Trying to attack my comprehensive skills is kinda weak considering how i completely destroyed you from a scientific perspective.

 

[1137]

I'm not talking about some new agey crap, this is a real problem in the scientific world. Consciousness is an absolutely amazing occurence which is very difficult to define and some say science may never be able to because it is a subjective experience. This is called the 'hard problems' of consciousness. There's even work being done on consciousness and quantum mechanics.

Anyways this is all about what YOUR definition of consciousness is rather than the actual ambiguity of what consciousness actually is in the first place. Next time don't try to act so smug, it doesn't make you sound any more credible.

Look, you are missing completely what I am getting at. The science behind consciousness is a joke. What is there to study if we cannot even define it? To be conscious is to be aware, that is the supernatural magic of definitions. Since that definition exists, consciousness is directly from the brain. Just because scientists are bickering about it doesn't make it worthwhile. Last I heard, some scientists want to build a laser that shoots through space time or something....

 

[1137]

Trying to attack my comprehensive skills is kinda weak considering how i completely destroyed you from a scientific perspective.

Ok man you are obviously dealing with some aggression and ego issues. Take some time and we'll try again tomorrow.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Same here.

After witnessing chairs being upended, doors slamming shut where no breeze occurred, loud crashes on occasion and stomping sounds upstairs, lights turning on and off, a UFO sighting where it glided silently then sped away at an incredible speed (I wasn't the only one who witnessed that), canned goods flung out several feet from kitchen cabinets, a photograph revealing a shadowy figure, and a crucifix that was bent in half, one could relatively assume I'm a staunch believer in all paranormal explanations.

I just report what I and others experienced. I find your studies on possible scientific explanations fascinating. Can you send me links or book references?

Hey Mystic
! :0)

Just some basic general information ATM. WebMd and Wiki with a snippet from the Hardcore Zen study guide by Brad Warner concerning Mayko although I'm sure you are familer with the phenomenon and it's effects. (Quote) All covers my experiences adequately. If this is too general I can try to locate. edu url's and other references that covers this.

Mayko:* By literally combining the pre- and suffixes, the term translates as "bad world."* In Zen, a mayko is considered a devil experienced during zazen but, in Western terms, it is the experience of the subconscious no longer being repressed, often resulting in the sudden confrontation of unpleasant memories or "personal demons."* Maykos are distinct and separate from hallucinations, which are often caused by poor posture during zazen. -Hardcore Zen Study Guide -

Pareidolia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Sleep Paralysis: Demon in the Bedroom

 

[Twilight Hue]

The ufo sighting may be different although givin my age at the time as this could be aircraft I never saw before. Yet I do recall a strange feeling associated with this particular sighting. Ufo's are probably the only phenomena that I can agree on over the possibility that there is possibly something out there just awaiting validation.

 

[1137]

The ufo sighting may be different although givin my age at the time as this could be aircraft I never saw before. Yet I do recall a strange feeling associated with this particular sighting. Ufo's are probably the only phenomena that I can agree on over the possibility that there is possibly something out there just awaiting validation.

Yeah, UFOs are not really supernatural. It is not so much about explaining as discovering, if the sightings are true. Alien life is as natural as ours, if it exists.

 

[Vultar]

Look, you are missing completely what I am getting at. The science behind consciousness is a joke. What is there to study if we cannot even define it? To be conscious is to be aware, that is the supernatural magic of definitions. Since that definition exists, consciousness is directly from the brain. Just because scientists are bickering about it doesn't make it worthwhile. Last I heard, some scientists want to build a laser that shoots through space time or something....

Looks like you have been having lots of fun with unimportant things such as definitions. This of course is losing the whole point of your original OP.

Now you have things which you can't explain, but also don't want to abandon your logic. You don't believe consciousness exists after death (or whatever you wish to call it - the definition is unimportant). You also don't believe in angels or demons (don't blame you as they don't exist). Now the one thing you will need to do is open your mind just a bit to other possibilities (you can still use your logic).

OK... so where does that leave us...

Testing.... (that is the fun part anyways)

So the first thing to test is whether you can have your consciousness control something outside your body (if you can control something outside your body then logically the consciousness could exist outside your body after you die)

Okay, now how do we test the consciousness... the answer... thought transferance (sounds funky, but it is one of the easier things to do. It wouldn't be logical to start with something hard)

I used to do this one test around 25 years ago while riding the bus (it was a long boring daily trip to work). All you need to do is concentrate on a person and think about a spot on their body as really itchy. Think about how the itch would feel and try to focus it on that person (and don't scratch yourself as that would be cheating). When they scratch that spot you know you got them (some people are easier then others). Then go on to a different person and itch them in a different spot. The more you do it the better you get at it, and it will prove that consciousness can work outside the body.(it can also win you some money if you have betting friends and you get good at it).

Discussion has its merits, but sometimes you need to quit talking and start doing

Don't close the doors of your perception...

 

[1137]

Looks like you have been having lots of fun with unimportant things such as definitions. This of course is losing the whole point of your original OP.

:clap getting back on track, thank you!

Now you have things which you can't explain, but also don't want to abandon your logic. You don't believe consciousness exists after death (or whatever you wish to call it - the definition is unimportant). You also don't believe in angels or demons (don't blame you as they don't exist). Now the one thing you will need to do is open your mind just a bit to other possibilities (you can still use your logic).

My mind is open to other possibilities. I was simply throwing out a theory that came to me to explain things I currently can't.

OK... so where does that leave us...

Testing.... (that is the fun part anyways)

So the first thing to test is whether you can have your consciousness control something outside your body (if you can control something outside your body then logically the consciousness could exist outside your body after you die)

Okay, now how do we test the consciousness... the answer... thought transferance (sounds funky, but it is one of the easier things to do. It wouldn't be logical to start with something hard)

Getting ahead, what have you done that is more complicated than this? Just out of curiosity.

I used to do this one test around 25 years ago while riding the bus (it was a long boring daily trip to work). All you need to do is concentrate on a person and think about a spot on their body as really itchy. Think about how the itch would feel and try to focus it on that person (and don't scratch yourself as that would be cheating). When they scratch that spot you know you got them (some people are easier then others). Then go on to a different person and itch them in a different spot. The more you do it the better you get at it, and it will prove that consciousness can work outside the body.(it can also win you some money if you have betting friends and you get good at it).

Discussion has its merits, but sometimes you need to quit talking and start doing

I am really glad you brought this up. This is the one thing that keeps seeping into my mind: actively expand your consciousness (everyone calm down about the word). You see, in a way you could consider me a monist. Everything that exists is from the same "source" so it is all interconnected. My questioning has been if we could connect this subtle nature within ourselves to the subtle nature in the rest of the universe.

Anyways... this is very interesting and I will definitely do it. But I am not sure what it will change in my mind. You see, it ties in with what I mentioned above. Our consciousness (deep breath guys), whether a product of the brain or something else, is still interconnected with everything. So, in my belief this will work even thought consciousness is a product of the brain.

It's still cool though

 

[Vultar]

:clap getting back on track, thank you!

Your very welcome

My mind is open to other possibilities. I was simply throwing out a theory that came to me to explain things I currently can't.

Well you did mention that consciousness couldn't exist without the body, but we will see if we can open your mind to it using testing and logic

Getting ahead, what have you done that is more complicated than this? Just out of curiosity.

Keep in mind that my perceptions and abilities were unlocked after the first time I died (giving me a leg up so to say). Well, of course there is thought projection (works great in business allowing me to become CIO then CEO in my thirties). I have massive empathy control. (I can "feel" what others are feeling and can transmit emotion via touch). This can mess you up a bit in a crowded room but allows you to give a massage like you wouldn't believe . I've also experienced telekinesis a few times, but have not tried to gain control over that one as it could be too dangerous (it only came about as a defensive mechanism). I also seem to be able to cause power surges (again with little control), plus a bunch of other stuff that would make you think I'm crazier then a loon (I only feel comfortable mentioning this stuff as I am anonymous on the boards).

I am really glad you brought this up. This is the one thing that keeps seeping into my mind: actively expand your consciousness (everyone calm down about the word). You see, in a way you could consider me a monist. Everything that exists is from the same "source" so it is all interconnected. My questioning has been if we could connect this subtle nature within ourselves to the subtle nature in the rest of the universe.

The mind is capable of much more then we have currently scientifically proven. The biggest issue with it is there is little control over it for testing purposes. You can see all kinds of examples of it though. Many religious and mystical practises in essence trick the brain into unlocking some of these abilities, so you end up having "miracles" and "magic" when all you really have is the consciousness performing some of its extra functions. You see this with faith healing and magic spells which aren't actually real, but are a smoke screen to what is really happening.

Anyways... this is very interesting and I will definitely do it. But I am not sure what it will change in my mind. You see, it ties in with what I mentioned above. Our consciousness (deep breath guys), whether a product of the brain or something else, is still interconnected with everything. So, in my belief this will work even thought consciousness is a product of the brain.

It's still cool though

The biggest hurtle to overcome is the minds own mechanism to think something is not possible. If you think something is impossible... it will be...

 

[1137]

Well you did mention that consciousness couldn't exist without the body, but we will see if we can open your mind to it using testing and logic

I am open to rejecting it, if the right evidence is provided, which I am not sure you have done

Keep in mind that my perceptions and abilities were unlocked after the first time I died (giving me a leg up so to say). Well, of course there is thought projection (works great in business allowing me to become CIO then CEO in my thirties). I have massive empathy control. (I can "feel" what others are feeling and can transmit emotion via touch). This can mess you up a bit in a crowded room but allows you to give a massage like you wouldn't believe . I've also experienced telekinesis a few times, but have not tried to gain control over that one as it could be too dangerous (it only came about as a defensive mechanism). I also seem to be able to cause power surges (again with little control), plus a bunch of other stuff that would make you think I'm crazier then a loon (I only feel comfortable mentioning this stuff as I am anonymous on the boards).

The first thing I would like to say is I do not believe your abilities were unlocked, simply discovered. I have experienced things like this, which also interests me. However, I am not sure it can convince me of consciousness without the brain. I will explain further down.

The mind is capable of much more then we have currently scientifically proven. The biggest issue with it is there is little control over it for testing purposes. You can see all kinds of examples of it though. Many religious and mystical practises in essence trick the brain into unlocking some of these abilities, so you end up having "miracles" and "magic" when all you really have is the consciousness performing some of its extra functions. You see this with faith healing and magic spells which aren't actually real, but are a smoke screen to what is really happening.

I agree that we are capable of more than we currently realize. Such things are really not testable though, as you have said. I kind of consider myself a mystic but not openly because people get so hung up on basic concepts that I seem like a walking contradiction haha. As I pointed out, I think there is a subtle, fundamental something underlying and creating all reality. I do not think it is personal or intelligent or anything necessarily, but it makes up everything, and at the most basic everything is just this source. Quantum physics, especially String theory, says that the most basic we can currently recognize is that everything is vibrations. What I think is more basic is this force. So, at the most basic everything is 100% interconnected. This explains all of the above without brain / consciousness separation. The brain taps into that with things like meditation.

The biggest hurtle to overcome is the minds own mechanism to think something is not possible. If you think something is impossible... it will be...

I agree, although I do believe that some things are impossible but they are not realistically related to the power of the human being (such as flying, defying gravity, etc). As I pointed out just before though, I do not see it as brain / consciousness separation. My theory in the OP ties to that belief.

 

[Vultar]

I am open to rejecting it, if the right evidence is provided, which I am not sure you have done

well, since I haven't provided any evidence, that would make sense. It only through testing and logic that you will be able to see what I say is true (words are meaningless)

The first thing I would like to say is I do not believe your abilities were unlocked, simply discovered. I have experienced things like this, which also interests me. However, I am not sure it can convince me of consciousness without the brain. I will explain further down.

Don't get caught up in terminology again. What I was refering to is my time in the afterlife and the way you move and communicate there translated into an increased ability to connect with abilities that all of us have but don't use. Call it discovered if you want. The brain functions more like RAM and ROM, The CPU of the mind is a bit less constricted (hope the metaphor isn't too confusing), that is why it is so tough for scientist to figure it out, they can exactly map memories, but not the thought process
(they can just narrow down general areas of activity).

I agree that we are capable of more than we currently realize. Such things are really not testable though, as you have said. I kind of consider myself a mystic but not openly because people get so hung up on basic concepts that I seem like a walking contradiction haha. As I pointed out, I think there is a subtle, fundamental something underlying and creating all reality. I do not think it is personal or intelligent or anything necessarily, but it makes up everything, and at the most basic everything is just this source. Quantum physics, especially String theory, says that the most basic we can currently recognize is that everything is vibrations. What I think is more basic is this force. So, at the most basic everything is 100% interconnected. This explains all of the above without brain / consciousness separation. The brain taps into that with things like meditation.

Meditation can be a useful tool to get "in touch" with your abilities. There are a number of things that are testable, but they take much practice and you need to trust what you feel in order to make a proper connection.

I agree, although I do believe that some things are impossible but they are not realistically related to the power of the human being (such as flying, defying gravity, etc). As I pointed out just before though, I do not see it as brain / consciousness separation. My theory in the OP ties to that belief.

Well I've never seen anyone fly but I have seen defying of gravity (telekinesis). Again we could banter back and forth about this all day but until you attempt to test things out your opinion will remain fixed (not that I blame you for that). The most important thing to be able to accomplish something is to "believe you can" and start out simple so you don't discourage yourself. Also it is best to use "weak minded" people in your tests to have the best results (that's why mass transit customers are good to use). It is much harder to get an "Alpha" to scratch....

_______________________

cellphones are slowly simmering you brain... call me when your done

 

[Yusz]

Hello Brother,

Well my English maybe not good but I'll try hard explain to you, what ghost is really is ... I only like to discuss it for who really ever saw ghost or paranormal thing because you don't know what are you talking about unless you experience it... The thing that I want to told is the one I experience it , and I study it. Not only me can see it, my brother, my uncle (my Guru) also can see, It looks like I'm not crazy....

As an Exorcist, I saw many things, I not define is as ghost because not only ghost we talking about, I'll rather call It supernatural thing... We are not alone in this world, there is many dimension of other living creature In this world... Some Human have the abilities to see supernatural thing and it call third eye... Not some, but every human have it but you need to unlock it through meditation.. You just can see it but cannot go to their world... maybe we can but, I don't know how.. I post a picture so you can see what dimension I talking about...

I don't know how total dimension is, but this is some of Dimension that I know... For religion, Heaven and Hell also in dimension but I think it's too far or impossible to reach it for Human being... Why is Ghost thing is most famous from the other? It because Ghost dimension is most closest from our world ...Some people don't believe this... Yes, they need evidence, but how can I show you the evidence for the thing you can't see? ...

Sorry for my bad English

 

[Vultar]

Ghosts, demons, angels and devils are actually all just spirits (given different names throughout mythology), elves are simply the mythological name for asians to explain the different race of people in stories.

 

[Yusz]

It's up to you to say that all of this it's mythology because you never seen with your own eyes, I say like that before too ... I only share this because I experience it myself and I refer to who we better than me if I don't understand something, so I'm not alone for this paranormal thing.. At my country this paranormal thing, it's a normal ..

P/s : All human have the third eye, and can unlock it..

 

[Vultar]

It's up to you to say that all of this it's mythology because you never seen with your own eyes, I say like that before too ... I only share this because I experience it myself and I refer to who we better than me if I don't understand something, so I'm not alone for this paranormal thing.. At my country this paranormal thing, it's a normal ..

P/s : All human have the third eye, and can unlock it..

You obviously have not read any of my posts.... I've died 4 times and have experienced the afterlife so know exactly what is there....

As for the references to mythology, mythology is basically just stories that have been overly exagerated over the years but do have some basis in truth (athough sometimes it is difficult to see which parts are real)