Pastor Kicked Out by His Congregation Over Transphobic Church Sign

[loverofhumanity]

I dont want to judge any of the parts involved, but should not a priest preach the bibles words? and when he do he get kicked out?
Or should he adapt to what people want to hear because it is comfortable today?

I fully agree with you. You are Buddhist and Buddhism is founded upon non violence so how can we accept the violence against Rohingya by Buddhists? It’s hypocritical,to compromise the basic teachings of any religion and the Bible does not support homosexuality so then those who do support it should seriously consider whether they want to remain Christians or not.

 

[Spirit of Light]

I fully agree with you. You are Buddhist and Buddhism is founded upon non violence so how can we accept the violence against Rohingya by Buddhists? It’s hypocritical,to compromise the basic teachings of any religion and the Bible does not support homosexuality so then those who do support it should seriously consider whether they want to remain Christians or not.

In my understanding those who call them self Buddhists who did wrong toward Rohingya are not truly buddhists, they maybe think they are because of family history, but if they do not follow the teaching they are not Buddhists. So i do agree with you

 

[loverofhumanity]

If people want a religion which accepts homosexuality then form one themselves but the Bible clearly prohibits it and whether people consider that right or wrong that’s what it says.

 

[JJ50]

If people want a religion which accepts homosexuality then form one themselves but the Bible clearly prohibits it and whether people consider that right or wrong that’s what it says.

The authors of the Bible lived many centuries ago and we live in the 21st century, times have changed thank goodness. In Biblical times women were considered subservient to the male of the species too. do you think that still should be the case?

 

[PruePhillip]

The authors of the Bible lived many centuries ago and we live in the 21st century, times have changed thank goodness. In Biblical times women were considered subservient to the male of the species too. do you think that still should be the case?

Are you saying we should change the bible?
If so, how often?
I mean, back in the 1980's people wanted to decriminalize homosexuality
And in the 2000's they wanted to promote homosexuality
And in the 2010's they wanted gay marriage.

Maybe we could have a new bible every ten years?
It says that a man should be the husband of "one wife" and that's going
to change in the next ten years too.

 

[JJ50]

Are you saying we should change the bible?
If so, how often?
I mean, back in the 1980's people wanted to decriminalize homosexuality
And in the 2000's they wanted to promote homosexuality
And in the 2010's they wanted gay marriage.

Maybe we could have a new bible every ten years?
It says that a man should be the husband of "one wife" and that's going
to change in the next ten years too.

People should read that book bearing in mind how long ago it was written, and how times have changed since then, thank goodness.

Homosexuality was legalised in the mid 60s here in the UK, and not before time. I am glad gay marriage is permitted too.

 

[Woberts]

And I am not sure what Communist countries think of gay marriage,
civil rights, transgenderism etc.. They might just put you in jail, or
worse.

Let me just say that there's a reason that Africans migrated to the USSR in droves.

 

[Polymath257]

Are you saying we should change the bible?
If so, how often?
I mean, back in the 1980's people wanted to decriminalize homosexuality
And in the 2000's they wanted to promote homosexuality
And in the 2010's they wanted gay marriage.

Maybe we could have a new bible every ten years?
It says that a man should be the husband of "one wife" and that's going
to change in the next ten years too.

No, I think we should realize that the Bible, like many other books from that time, isn't necessarily the last word on morality.

It describes the morality that people promoted 2000 years ago (and more). As such, it has many aspects that reflect their biases,
bigotry, and failures to care.

 

[Polymath257]

Do you want a sign of the times? Here's a good one:

2001-2015 Gallop figures on approval rates for moral issues in USA:

Gay lesbian 40 to 63%. Baby outside marriage 45 to 61%. Casual sex 53 to
68%. Divorce 59 to 71%. Polygamy 7 to 16%. Doctor suicide 49 to 56%.
Personal suicide13 to 19%. Gambling 63 to 67%. Abortion 42 to 45%. Married
men having affairs 7 to 8%.

There's a few missing here, such as
mainstreaming of pornography
child sexualization
drug abuse
pedophilia
pederasty
number of children in broken homes
cultural division
disrespect for authority
politicization of the culture
violence rates towards women
etc
etc
etc

Your quote "learning a better morality"
Is that being moral to trees and whales?

Not mainly. it is being better towards people.

Do you really think that the list you gave is a list of *new* problems?

'Spare the rod, spoil the child' is an ancient inducement to child abuse.
Now, women who are abused can divorce their abusers. In the Bible, they were required to marry a rapist.
Have you ever looked at the number of orphanages in previous times? A broken home is far better than that.
Sometimes authorities deserve to be disrespected.
Cultural division? Have you ever read what it was like arount the time of the American Revolution?
Drug abuse? How about in the late 1800's and even early 1900's?

I would bet that in *every one* of the things on your list, the culture has improved.

 

[Polymath257]

**mod edit**
People thought racism was a bad thing with the civil war.

Some people thought that *slavery* was bad in the Civil War.
But most at the time thought 'separate, but equal' was acceptable.
Racism was in the fiber of the society at that time.

USA
had the civil rights movement, with its admonishment that we
should not judge a person by the color of their skin. Now we
have on universities white free days, people supporting higher
taxes for whites, whites disenfranchised from political
discussions, whites facing higher SAT score requirements
and so on, so forth.

With the rise of eno-Nazi's, the details of police brutality
(fortunately, now possible to record), the fulminations
of our current president, etc, you can hardly say we have or
had equality between the races.

At worst, white men have had to give up a bit of the power we've
enjoyed for far too long and to be come a bit more aware of
how our actions affect others.

Sorry, but this is also a moral advance.

But more to the point - people who claim America is racist
still want to
a - stay in America
b - come and live in America
c - can't identify any other diverse culture with such tolerance.

In Australia there's talk now of a two tier legal system - aborigines
will face lesser penalties for the same crime. That's racism, just
like the American experience.

That other systems are worse doens't mean we can't improve the one we have.
Furthermore, if we see places where it needs improvement,
we *should* improve it as opposed to keeping a status quo
that is based on bigotry.

One of the main draws of the USA is its tremendous economy. Even in
'bad' times, it is pretty good. But it's *moral* attitudes are recognized
around the free world as being deficient and in need of serious repair.

 

[loganonekenobi]

I dont want to judge any of the parts involved, but should not a priest preach the bibles words? and when he do he get kicked out?
Or should he adapt to what people want to hear because it is comfortable today?

your point is valid sir. He did preach the words of the bible. In that case it is the bible that should have been kicked out. I like the way you think.

 

[PruePhillip]

Let me just say that there's a reason that Africans migrated to the USSR in droves.

Aren't gays migrating to Russia in droves today?


As I like to say to Marxists, show me a Marxist society that worked.
As for gay rights - ordinary people in those societies had NO RIGHTS.
All rights went to the Ruling Class.

 

[Woberts]

Aren't gays migrating to Russia in droves today?

>compares capitalist Russia to communist USSR to discredit it.
>Thinks Cultural Marxism exists

My poe radar is going crazy...

 

[Revoltingest]

So, God is a liberal and a cultural Marxist?

That would explain all the plagues, smiting, oppression & other disasters.

Revoltifarian sign....
BRUCE JENNER IS ONE UGLY WOMAN
WE CELEBRATE THE RIGHT TO BE UGLY

 

[PruePhillip]

>compares capitalist Russia to communist USSR to discredit it.
>Thinks Cultural Marxism exists

My poe radar is going crazy...

Well, we know Putin's attitude towards gays - we won't stop them but
they won't convert our children like they do in the West (paraphrasing
him.)
But what was Stalin and Lenin's view on gays? Let's forget the millions
and millions or ORDINARY Russians sent to the gulags or worse - what
was the fate of the homosexuals?
And what was the attitude of other liberated countries like East Germany,
Vietnam, Cambodia, Cuba, China etc. to homosexuals?

ps cultural Marxist has existed as a concept since at least the time of
the Frankfurt School
Frankfurt School - Wikipedia

Many American university professors openly claim to be Marxist, so too
do their students. Many more are Democrat or to the left of that party.

 

[Woberts]

Well, we know Putin's attitude towards gays - we won't stop them but
they won't convert our children like they do in the West (paraphrasing
him.)
But what was Stalin and Lenin's view on gays? Let's forget the millions
and millions or ORDINARY Russians sent to the gulags or worse - what
was the fate of the homosexuals?

You're saying that communism is bad because Putin is bad.
Weird flex, but ok.

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

I dont want to judge any of the parts involved, but should not a priest preach the bibles words? and when he do he get kicked out?
Or should he adapt to what people want to hear because it is comfortable today?

Adapt or fail. This is basically a fundamental idea within existence as we perceive it.

• Hungry, but can't get the food you used to eat? Better find a new food source.
• Only safe place for you is in the trees? Better become a good climber.
• Your particular skill/trade getting sourced in robotics? Maybe a change of career is in order.
• Stuck parroting old, outdated (and let's face it in this case - bigoted) ideas to a crowd who doesn't agree with you? Change or don't, it's up to you to live with the consequences.

Choosing not to adapt in most cases is suicide in that area of your life. If we were truly talking about immutable facts it would be one thing... but we're not. And anyone who thinks we are is also failing to adapt. It is a failure to adapt to a rational outlook.

 

[Spirit of Light]

Adapt or fail. This is basically a fundamental idea within existence as we perceive it.

• Hungry, but can't get the food you used to eat? Better find a new food source.
• Only safe place for you is in the trees? Better become a good climber.
• Your particular skill/trade getting sourced in robotics? Maybe a change of career is in order.
• Stuck parroting old, outdated (and let's face it in this case - bigoted) ideas to a crowd who doesn't agree with you? Change or don't, it's up to you to live with the consequences.

Choosing not to adapt in most cases is suicide in that area of your life. If we were truly talking about immutable facts it would be one thing... but we're not. And anyone who thinks we are is also failing to adapt. It is a failure to adapt to a rational outlook.

When a person follow a religion they adapt toward what the religion teach, and no they should not "fix" the teaching to fit them self, it is the other way around.
For those who are not following a religion does not need to think of this things.

Even the teaching are many thousand years old it is still a spiritual teaching that is right for those who choose to follow it. for those who do not follow it they dont need to see it as the truth.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

What if he put up a sign saying he opposes adultery or divorce?
Both are condemned quite literally in the New Testament, so too
is homosexuality - quite explicitly.

What is happening now is that THE CHURCHES ARE LED BY
SOCIETY INSTEAD OF LEADING IT.

Or what if he actually followed Jesus's example and emphasized comforting the afflicted, feeding the hungry, condemning the wealthy, and railing against people who practice religion without love?

 

[nPeace]

View attachment 26525

The above transphobic sign got Pastor Justin Hoke of the Trinity Bible Presbyterian Church in deep trouble with his congregation.

He put the sign up sometime around December 31st. In less than two weeks, he was out of a job. His congregation was disgusted with him and they rebelled almost to a person. Every couple in his church -- except one -- declared they would leave the Church if Hoke stayed on as Pastor.

https://www.pinknews.co.uk/2019/01/14/pastor-fired-caitlyn-jenner-man-sign/

Is the response to Hoke's sign a "sign of the times" (pun shamelessly intended)?

Questions? Comments?

Pastor Justin Hoke should be one happy man, and go his way rejoicing. 2 Corinthians 6:17, 18