Perception of Violent Music

[McBell]

Sadly I have dealt with several people who, because of their unstable mental states, have told me that they believe a piece of music was specifically "talking" to them and so reacted the way they did. I'm was only responding to Druidus' comment Simply hearing violent phrases does not cause people to do violent things.

So the music triggered their violent outburst.
You yourself have pointed out that they were unstable to begin with.
So really, the only conclusion one should come up with is that music can trigger violent behavior in those who are mentally unstable.

I have heard nothing that suggests that the music caused the violence, only that it triggered it.

 

[mrsk]

So the beat can make an evil song?

I didn't say that...because I don't believe it! People can be evil, thoughts can be evil, but I don't believe a song can be evil. I don't believe a beat can be evil.

I can't even begin to understand why someone would want to write, sing, or listen to angry, violent songs but thats just me. I do not believe that such music can cause a mentally stable person to commit murder, rape or any other violent act.

After 15 years of bartending I will say that there is definately a difference in the atmosphere depending on the type and volume of the music being played.

 

[Bishka]

I can't even begin to understand why someone would want to write, sing, or listen to angry, violent songs but thats just me. .

Because they are working through the problems life has dealt them.

 

[Wandered Off]

Because they are working through the problems life has dealt them.

Or they just like the way it sounds.

 

[kadzbiz]

So the music triggered their violent outburst. You yourself have pointed out that they were unstable to begin with. So really, the only conclusion one should come up with is that music can trigger violent behavior in those who are mentally unstable. I have heard nothing that suggests that the music caused the violence, only that it triggered it.

Okay, I'll agree with that. Not caused, but triggered. Although I'm finding it difficult to differentiate the two terms.

 

[McBell]

Okay, I'll agree with that. Not caused, but triggered. Although I'm finding it difficult to differentiate the two terms.

Triggered meaning that the tendency for violence was already there and the music brought it out.
Like when I put a CB radio in my car and it sped up the finding of a short.
The short was always there, the CB just accelerated the problem bringing it out into the open sooner.


Causing the tendency would be a nonviolent person hearing violent music and becoming a violent person ONLY because they listened to the violent music.
As I have stated before, I know of no legitimate report that supports this allegation.

 

[Dr. Nosophoros]

What I find funniest is that violence existed long before modern middle class white kids caused a stir, hollywood left a dead man hanging in your living room and you love it because that is entertainment to you, and you wonder why.
Did you care that just down the street around the block blacks were killing each other en-masse , no- because it didn't affect you, or you didn't think it did.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

What I find funniest is that violence existed long before modern middle class white kids caused a stir, hollywood left a dead man hanging in your living room and you love it because that is entertainment to you, and you wonder why.

Let's not forget the violence and sexual content contained within many of Shakespear's plays.
Hamlet even made out with his mom, yet we don't blame that for causing emotional distress.

 

[Aqualung]

Of course not! Destroying property is not silly....writing a song about it is though!
Honestly I don't put that much into the lyrics of a song. Every once in awhile a good one comes along, but in general I think it's the beat that catches my attention.

I agree. If I wanted to hear a message, I'd listen to a speech or read a book. I listen to music for its musical qualities, not for its message.

 

[azumi]

if people are violent its some thing to do with they way they were brought up. It doesent mater what type of music they listen too.

 

[McBell]

if people are violent its some thing to do with they way they were brought up. It doesent mater what type of music they listen too.

It does not have to be "the way they were brought up."
There are many different things that can cause a person to be violent.
Ever try to mess with the babies of a wolverine?

 

[storm2020]

"So really, the only conclusion one should come up with is that music can trigger violent behavior in those who are mentally unstable."

But if the music didn't trigger it something else would have. A person, an event, a film, bullying, a tragedy, having to sit through three hours of really bad theatre. The list could be endless. The gun is already loaded, cocked and ready to go by that stage.

 

[ChristineES]

My son loves rap, which is no problem with me. I have to listen to it first, however, so I can make sure there are no bad words, no degrading of women, and no violence. I do the same with any music he would listen to.

 

[McBell]

"So really, the only conclusion one should come up with is that music can trigger violent behavior in those who are mentally unstable."

But if the music didn't trigger it something else would have. A person, an event, a film, bullying, a tragedy, having to sit through three hours of really bad theatre. The list could be endless. The gun is already loaded, cocked and ready to go by that stage.

That is correct.
So the logical conclusion is that it was not the music, person, an event, a film, bullying, a tragedy, having to sit through three hours of really bad theatre that CAUSED the violence.
The the music, person, an event, a film, bullying, a tragedy, having to sit through three hours of really bad theatre is merely the finger that pulled the trigger, not the gun itself.

 

[ChristineES]

That is correct.
So the logical conclusion is that it was not the music, person, an event, a film, bullying, a tragedy, having to sit through three hours of really bad theatre that CAUSED the violence.
The the music, person, an event, a film, bullying, a tragedy, having to sit through three hours of really bad theatre is merely the finger that pulled the trigger, not the gun itself.

I have to agree. Some people can sit through hours of slasher films and be the nicest, gentlest person. People seem to always need a scapegoat or an excuse. Even Couey has excuses of why he should not be liable for that child's rape and murder and he still got the death penalty.

 

[McBell]

It has turned into a "everyones a victim" society.
Don't believe it?
Check out this thread:
http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/general-religious-debates/55874-playing-cards-evil.html

Please take particular note of how everything is the fault of the playing cards.
Even his letting people steal and fraud the company is the fault of the playing cards.

 

[storm2020]

An example of how violent media does not cause violent behaviour would be Japan which has extremely violent games and films and one of the lowest crime rates in the world. If violent media caused violent behavior the statistics just wouldn't fall that way.

 

[zombieharlot]

Yet MM sings "I am not a slave, to a God that doesn't exist" "Were all stars now, in the Dope Show" "The beutiful people, it's all relative to size of your steeple. You can't see the forest, for the trees. And you can't smell your own **** on your knees." Has lyrics about a "horned one" "Suicide is painless." and other stuff that doesn't compair to numerous other groups, and he is blamed?

The funny thing about all this is that Suicide is Painless was actually a cover of the M*A*S*H theme song.

And the reason why Marilyn Manson gets blamed is because he is widely recognized on a mainstream level.

 

[zombieharlot]

Columbine: Whose Fault Is It? : Rolling Stone

An article Marilyn Manson wrote after being blamed for Columbine that I think everyone should read.

 

[McBell]

Columbine: Whose Fault Is It? : Rolling Stone

An article Marilyn Manson wrote after being blamed for Columbine that I think everyone should read.

My favourite paragraph from that article:

Responsible journalists have reported with less publicity that Harris and Klebold were not Marilyn Manson fans -- that they even disliked my music. Even if they were fans, that gives them no excuse, nor does it mean that music is to blame. Did we look for James Huberty's inspiration when he gunned down people at McDonald's? What did Timothy McVeigh like to watch? What about David Koresh, Jim Jones? Do you think entertainment inspired Kip Kinkel, or should we blame the fact that his father bought him the guns he used in the Springfield, Oregon, murders? What inspires Bill Clinton to blow people up in Kosovo? Was it something that Monica Lewinsky said to him? Isn't killing just killing, regardless if it's in Vietnam or Jonesboro, Arkansas? Why do we justify one, just because it seems to be for the right reasons? Should there ever be a right reason? If a kid is old enough to drive a car or buy a gun, isn't he old enough to be held personally responsible for what he does with his car or gun? Or if he's a teenager, should someone else be blamed because he isn't as enlightened as an eighteen-year-old?
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