Policeman becomes a hero but can't celebrate it

[Left Coast]

Of course, but our culture teaches us to hero worship both military and law enforcement, to the point where the reaction toward anything less than praise is knee-jerk denial. Same with U.S. founding fathers. obviously they've done some good and important things but they weren't without flaws, faults, and failings. Some consider it unpatriotic to acknowledge that dark side.

People who cannot tolerate any criticism of their nation's leaders and authority figures have exceeded patriotism and reached nationalism. One of the things that has always made America great is our tradition since our founding of a) recognizing government's tendency toward authoritarianism and the need to limit its power and b) enshrining in our Constitution the capacity of our system to be reformed.

 

[Father Heathen]

My reading is fine. I found it odd that you only questioned when something good was posted.

Does the bad out weigh the good?

All of your questions have already been answered by earlier posts in this thread.
I don't understand the struggle, but I'll try to help.

 

[We Never Know]

All of your questions have already been answered by earlier posts in this thread.
I don't understand the struggle, but I'll try to help.

Then answer this one little teeny tiny simple question...

Does the bad out weigh the good?

 

[Father Heathen]

People who cannot tolerate any criticism of their nation's leaders and authority figures has exceeded patriotism and reached nationalism. One of the things that has always made America great is our tradition since our founding of a) recognizing government's tendency toward authoritarianism and the need to limit its power and b) enshrining in our Constitution the capacity of our system to be reformed.

I think portraying police and military as infallible heroes who personify the nation's virtues and values plays into that jingoistic, autocratic mindset.

 

[Father Heathen]

Then answer this one little teeny tiny simple question...

Does the bad out weigh the good?

Are you asking me if there are more bad cops than good? I would hope not, but how would I know? Corruption is a serious issue that desperately needs to be addressed, regardless.

 

[fantome profane]

So only post bad things about cops, not good things.

Do you think the bad out weighs the good?

The “bad” indicates a problem that needs to be solved. It is something we need to talk about, whether we want to or not. It is ok to talk about the good cops, it presents a model to consider. But we need to address the problem.

For example, if you post something about a cop risking their life to save someone, that raises a question. Is this what cops are for? It has been pointed out in another thread that under the law the police have no duty to help or protect anyone, unless they are in custody.

So the question is, should they have a duty to save lives? Should we create laws that declare that cops do have a duty to protect? Should we punish cops who do nothing to help? I don’t know the answer to that question, but something to think about.


But when we talk about good cops or bad cops I am reminded of a line from one of my favourite movies:

“they’re either a benefit or a hazard. If they’re a benefit it’s not my problem”

 

[We Never Know]

The “bad” indicates a problem that needs to be solved. It is something we need to talk about, whether we want to or not. It is ok to talk about the good cops, it presents a model to consider. But we need to address the problem.

For example, if you post something about a cop risking their life to save someone, that raises a question. Is this what cops are for? It has been pointed out in another thread that under the law the police have no duty to help or protect anyone, unless they are in custody.

So the question is, should they have a duty to save lives? Should we create laws that declare that cops do have a duty to protect? Should we punish cops who do nothing to help? I don’t know the answer to that question, but something to think about.


But when we talk about good cops or bad cops I am reminded of a line from one of my favourite movies:

“they’re either a benefit or a hazard. If they are a benefit it’s not my problem”

If only bad things are posted, thats all people will focus on. There are bad cops and they should be dealt with and prosecuted if needed... But not all cops are bad.

IMO the good they do out weighs the bad, but we ignore the good and highlight the bad.

"Do a million things right and no one notices or cares but do something wrong and that's all that's seen and matters"

Nothing wrong with posting good things. As the OP poster said, it gives a little balance.

 

[Soandso]

Good cops should be celebrated for sure, and heroic deeds should be as well

I absloutely want to see abuses of power brought to light as well, though - especially when things like body cams and phone recordings have brought to light an alarming amount of them

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Yes, you are right... it is an attempt to balance things... would you like a more recent one?

A few cops doing their damn job doesn't balance against a mountain of pig flesh.

 

[fantome profane]

If only bad things are posted, thats all people will focus on. There are bad cops and they should be dealt with and prosecuted if needed... But not all cops are bad.

IMO the good they do out weighs the bad, but we ignore the good and highlight the bad.

"Do a million things right and no one notices or cares but do something wrong and that's all that's seen and matters"

Nothing wrong with posting good things. As the OP poster said, it gives a little balance.

If you had a hole in your roof, I bet you would concentrate on that hole, rarely mentioning all the parts where there is no hole. People never take their car to the mechanic just to tell them how good it is running.

There is a real problem with modern policing, and that is why we must talk about it.

 

[Heyo]

Then answer this one little teeny tiny simple question...

Does the bad out weigh the good?

Are you asking me if there are more bad cops than good? I would hope not, but how would I know? Corruption is a serious issue that desperately needs to be addressed, regardless.

I think that question can be answered. @Kenny had to dig up a two year old story, my example (#12) is five years old. Even if we allow for a lot of reporting bias, stories about cops going beyond their duty are far and in between.
So it is rational to conclude that there are far more badly trained, badly incentivised cops out there than there are "good" cops, based on the available evidence.

 

[We Never Know]

I think that question can be answered. @Kenny had to dig up a two year old story, my example (#12) is five years old. Even if we allow for a lot of reporting bias, stories about cops going beyond their duty are far and in between.
So it is rational to conclude that there are far more badly trained, badly incentivised cops out there than there are "good" cops, based on the available evidence.

That depends on how you define a "good cop"

IMO....

A cop that takes a drunk drivers off the street potentially saved lives =a good cop

A cop that takes a drug dealer off the street potentially saved lives = a good cop

A cop that takes a pedophile off the streets potentially saved other children = a good cop

A cop that takes a murderer off the streets potentially saved lives =a good cop

A cop that takes a burglar off the streets potentially saved other places from being burglarized =a good cop

A cop that takes a armed robber off the streets potentially saved other places from being robbed =a good cop

A cop that takes a rapist off the streets potentially saved others from being raped =a good cop

Etc etc.

 

[Heyo]

That depends on how you define a "good cop"

IMO....

A cop that takes a drunk drivers off the street potentially saved lives =a good cop

A cop that takes a drug dealer off the street potentially saved lives = a good cop

A cop that takes a pedophile off the streets potentially saved other children = a good cop

A cop that takes a murderer off the streets potentially saved lives =a good cop

A cop that takes a burglar off the streets potentially saved other places from being burglarized =a good cop

A cop that takes a armed robber off the streets potentially saved other places from being robbed =a good cop

A cop that takes a rapist off the streets potentially saved others from being raped =a good cop

Etc etc.

I define "good", for this comparison, as exceeding simple mediocrity. A cop doing their job is just an average cop. A cop doing their job gets as often in the news as an accountant doing their job. The vast majority of police work is just that, doing their job. We don't have to look at those.
Those who excel at their job, who go the extra mile, get reported and those who don't do their job and misuse the uniform also get reported. Now, there is a massive reporting bias. Bad news sell better than good news. But even when we take that into account, there are still a lot more stories of cops misbehaving than about cops exceeding expectations.
So much so that it becomes a concern. And when we analyse the situation, which has been done, we find that the "bad cop" is not a personal but a systemic problem. Training and incentives are the main culprits.

 

[Kenny]

I think that question can be answered. @Kenny had to dig up a two year old story, my example (#12) is five years old. Even if we allow for a lot of reporting bias, stories about cops going beyond their duty are far and in between.
So it is rational to conclude that there are far more badly trained, badly incentivised cops out there than there are "good" cops, based on the available evidence.

Not really.

Bad news sells, good news doesn't. Bad news always gets local and national attention, good news doesn't.

Not to mention I gave multiple "last year sources".

 

[Revoltingest]

Yes, you are right... it is an attempt to balance things... would you like a more recent one?

Balance is useful.
After all, there are some good cops.
I've made some posts about cops handling
themselves in an exemplary fashion. I find
it useful to contrast them with bad cops.

 

[Guitar's Cry]

Cop dies in the line of duty while heroically saving the life of swimmer in distress

I wonder how many policeman won't be able to be thanked.

I often hear and see news stories about heroic cops. I also see flags and bumper stickers celebrating the profession. There are countless movies and shows depicting cops as heroes, not to mention how police are depicted to children.

It seems like we do celebrate them as heroes.

 

[Revoltingest]

I often hear and see news stories about heroic cops. I also see flags and bumper stickers celebrating the profession. There are countless movies and shows depicting cops as heroes, not to mention how police are depicted to children.

It seems like we do celebrate them as heroes.

Youtube is changing all that.
News often breaks there before mainstream media.

This channel provides legal analysis of events,
more than typically found in regular news. Such
corruption would continue without public shaming
on social media.

 

[Guitar's Cry]

Youtube is changing all that.
News often breaks there before mainstream media.

This channel provides legal analysis of events,
more than typically found in regular news. Such
corruption would continue without public shaming
on social media.

Yes, absolutely! Which is where I think the hyperbole of "we can't celebrate them" comes from; suddenly criticising heroes sometimes disillusions people who are unaffected by the misdeeds.

It is untrue that because there is criticism there can't be and isn't celebration over good deeds.

I do think both should occur.

 

[We Never Know]

This one is unique:

NYPD officer saves 5 lives by donating organs after Harlem shooting

‘That’s a real cop;’ veteran officer killed while saving others honored by NYPD at annual gathering

But there is a big list for sure.

This year and last year. Here's just few that came up when googled.

Off-duty police officer saves mom and injured child in car crash

https://www-today-com.cdn.ampprojec...r-saves-mom-injured-child-car-crash-rcna48178

Las Vegas police officer rescues driver from burning car along Las Vegas Strip

Las Vegas police officer rescues driver from burning car along Las Vegas Strip

Video shows off-duty police officer saving woman from fiery crash in Brookfield

https://www-sportskeeda-com.cdn.amp...e-officer-saving-woman-fiery-crash-brookfield

California police officer saves life of 2-year-old on fentanyl

https://www-wbtv-com.cdn.ampproject...-police-officer-saves-life-year-old-fentanyl/

Los Angeles police officer saves life of choking toddler

Los Angeles police officer saves life of choking toddler | WFLA

Kansas City police officers save 1-month-old baby girl’s life

Kansas City police officers save 1-month-old baby's life