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Proof of evolution -at last-

Since humans don’t have authority and rule over the Earth we can drop all this Climate Change conversation, we don’t have to worry about the spotted owl, or other creatures habitats and all that. Let the animals pay their fair share of the finances to clean up after themselves. And stop murdering each other too, then they leave the carcasses all over the place. Don’t the insects know to keep to their own territory? Why do they think they can come set up in my house like that? Prosecute them for trespassing!
Should’ve known better than to assume anything with some on here, when our society can’t tell the difference between and male and female should’ve expected as much. Later peeps, have fun stormin the castle.:D
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
Since humans don’t have authority and rule over the Earth we can drop all this Climate Change conversation, we don’t have to worry about the spotted owl, or other creatures habitats and all that. Let the animals pay their fair share of the finances to clean up after themselves. And stop murdering each other too, then they leave the carcasses all over the place. Don’t the insects know to keep to their own territory? Why do they think they can come set up in my house like that? Prosecute them for trespassing!
Should’ve known better than to assume anything with some on here, when our society can’t tell the difference between and male and female should’ve expected as much. Later peeps, have fun stormin the castle.:D

In response to this I am looking forward to the 'Planet of the Apes.'
 

Mark Charles Compton

Pineal Peruser
We have that already. Just different apes.

Lol, I don't know why these posts caused this goofy idea. It made me chortle at the thought of it, so here is a hybrid Idiocracy and Planet of The Apes parody:

"Planet of The IDIOCR-APES!"

The Statue of Liberty was in shambles as his eyes went wide. "Oh my God. I'm back. I'm home. All the time, it was... We finally really did it." Colonel George Taylor cried in despair.

It was at this moment President Joe Bauers "The smartest man on Earth" was walking passed and felt compelled to cheer the distraught homeless man with the good news!

"Look, it's all going to get better from here. I've fixed the plants. We'll have burrito coverings again in no time. I put toilet water on them, and get this! It worked! You don't have to thank me." He snugly professed before cheerfully continuing walking down the beach.

Exasperated at the insane ramblings of the primitive man that just staggered passed, the colonel collapsed to his knees and screamed, "You Maniacs! You blew it up! Ah, damn you! God damn you all to hell!" Finally breaking down in sobs, he buried his face into his hands.

Joe Bauers always wanting to help, spoke at the vagrant, "Okay. Look! As your President, I am going to treat you to anything you want at ST<A>R8UCKS. Doesn't that sound good? Get a Latte and relax. Doesn't that sound good?" Without hesitating he offered a hand to help the scraggly man to his feet.

With a wellspring of emotions col. Tayler smack the Presidents hand away while exclaiming, "Take your stinking paws off me, you damned dirty ape server!"

Startled at the idea of the bum refusing a Latte, Joe's face went awash with worry and confusion as he began running back towards Costco, the way he had come.

Fin. :D
 

wellwisher

Well-Known Member
One indirect proof of evolution, that is consistent with science and the bible, is animal and plant breeding. In this case, instead of natural selection setting the potentials for animal or plant selection, we have humans setting the potentials for selection.

In dog breeding, for example, the breeders may start with a litter of puppies. They will pick the ones that best represent the goal of the breeding project. This may be color, markings, temperament, athleticism, and health. Those puppies which best express the goal are then bred, thereby reinforcing these traits in the next generation, etc., until the best of the breed appears one day.

Other breeders of dogs may select differently. They may be looking for a unique spin on a breed, that is off the beaten path; new fur color. Once this secret project is finished, it will look like a missing link appears, as another separate breed of dog. There are now over 150 distinct breeds, all from wolves.

In the Bible, humans bred plants and animals for utility, so they could produce more and better food. The farmer may also save seeds to heirloom varieties. These are kept the same by choice and design; already perfect like Galapagos critters.

Even the Genealogy in the Bible is based on breeding humans true to a specific bloodline, which was the ancient way of saying the same maternal DNA, even before tools could see the DNA. Evolution is not new, except to the atheists. Ancient explorers would see new plants and animals that were restricted to, via selection within foreign lands. They may bring some home, and a missing link appears in their native country. It may be out of place, but it thrives; evasive species with selective advantages.

The most interesting evolutionary angle with the Bible, has to due with religions in general. Many of the world's religions are very old. They also have books that stay the same. They, in general, define moral and rules of behavior, with animal behavior part of animal DNA and selection.

The question is what has been the impact on human behavioral evolution, due to thousands of years of similar willful behavior; morals, and its self serving selection process? This practice and selection for behavior, should eventually become part of the DNA, thereby making a new version of humans.

It may not be coincidental that Christian countries have the most countries represented in the first world. Something is ingrained in their genes; behavioral traits, by natural selection, in the context of two thousand of years of consistent religious beliefs.

If a warrior religion had sustained for thousands of years, and the best of the best were selected each generation, the future of their group DNA would reflect this, making each new generation of humans, innate warriors. But such secular things, do not last long enough, to make this stick for all. Religions are unique to human evolution due to their longevity and selective behavioral consistency. The DNA is slow to change and needs time that only the main religions offer.

The Jews and Chinese are two of the most ancient of cultures. These belief systems have had, perhaps the longest impact on group DNA. This makes it easier to get with the program.

Civilization has not always been part of human evolution. This change is relatively new and offered more in the way of human selection. This changed the trajectory of human evolution, with the old religions of the world offering the longest consistent potential for this new form of selection. The Bible speaks of the first new human; Adam. The natural human, that came before, had a different and more natural selective path with different goals.
 
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It Aint Necessarily So

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Is biogenesis considered synonymous to creationism?

The term is used two ways, one consistent with creationism. The term refers to the creation of a living thing by another living thing as occurs billions of times every day. It also refers to the claim that living things ONLY come from other living things, which implies creationism to some.

Pasteur demonstrated that rats and maggots weren't coming from straw or rotting meat, but rather, from other rats and flies, replacing a hypothesis of abiogenesis for these things with a biogenesis alternative. Creationists have distorted this to say that Pasteur proved abiogenesis impossible. He didn't.

But here the thing with creationists saying that all life comes from other life. Whether you consider a deity life or not, the claim falls apart. If a disembodied mind can be called life, then God is an example of life that did not come from other life. If one considers pure mind to not be life, then life on earth came from mind, not other life.

Do you know the word biopoiesis? It's synonymous with abiogenesis.

the problem was is when someone says a human used to be an ape due to evolution. This is absurd.

That's not a rebuttal. It's an ad lapidem fallacy.

It's settled science that man evolved from ancestral, non-human apes. I realize that that means as little to you as your religious beliefs mean to science, but the fact that religionists choose to think differently is irrelevant to academia, as I recently explained to the OP.

My testimony isn’t hearsay and neither is the Bible.

If either of you are reporting on things you believe other people saw, then it's hearsay. "Bob's son says Bob was in Vietnam" is hearsay. "Bob was in Vietnam with me" is eyewitness testimony. "I saw Jesus rise from the dead" is eyewitness testimony. "I read where Mark and Luke heard from witnesses about a resurrection" is hearsay.
 

It Aint Necessarily So

Veteran Member
Premium Member
The gospels don’t contradict themselves

Yes, they do. Most Striking Contradictions in the Gospels among the Four Evangelists | The Blog of Dimi

No one has ever observed evolution, there are no transitional fossils at all, see my article on the missing transitional fossils here.


All of this is incorrect. Evolution has been observed (it's being observed now in coronaviruses), all fossils are transitional, and there are not millions of brachiating human ancestors still living if that's what that first image is intended to represent. It looks like a modern chimp, in which case there are about a quarter million of them around, but they don't belong in that succession

Well you can classify yourself as an ape if you like but that’s not me

Science classifies you as an ape just as it does Lucy. You're just taller, smarter, walk upright exclusively, less hairy, and can reason and speak, but none of that makes you not an ape, just as none of that makes you not a primate, mammal, tetrapod, or vertebrate.

Well it’s a bogus assumption to believe or classify humans in the same category as apes or any animal seen as we are in a totally different class, made in the image of God our Creator.

That's a religious belief, not a fact.

Look at the images above. You were made in the image of those ancestral apes, as was I. The family resemblance is unmistakable. It seems the thought offends you.
 

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Since humans don’t have authority and rule over the Earth we can drop all this Climate Change conversation, we don’t have to worry about the spotted owl, or other creatures habitats and all that. Let the animals pay their fair share of the finances to clean up after themselves.
?????
You're equating "authority" with human actions, technology or climatic effects? How does "authority" have anything to do with these?
You seem to have invented a new definition of the word. It seems to involve responsibility or duty.
And stop murdering each other too, then they leave the carcasses all over the place. Don’t the insects know to keep to their own territory? Why do they think they can come set up in my house like that? Prosecute them for trespassing!
This is becoming an incoherent rant. What does any of this have to do with authority, rule, or evolution?
Should’ve known better than to assume anything with some on here, when our society can’t tell the difference between and male and female should’ve expected as much. Later peeps, have fun stormin the castle.:D
Sorry you're so cognitively simplistic and inflexible. Everything is not black or white, and some things are complicated. Sorry this discomfits you so.
 
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Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
One indirect proof of evolution, that is consistent with science and the bible, is animal and plant breeding. In this case, instead of natural selection setting the potentials for animal or plant selection, we have humans setting the potentials for selection.
Yes. Artificial vs natural selection. Same process, same results.

"But selective breeding of maize or dogs yields only different maize and dogs, not new kinds!"
1. How many generations of maize and dogs have we seen? Don't expect a change in "kind" in only a few generations.
2. Humans don't select for new kinds. We select for more useful features within the commodity in question. We don't allow radiation into new niches. We cull any adaptations not useful to our single goal. Nature does not.
 
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YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
You have never revealed the knowledge necessary nor the references supporting your supposed examination 'thoroughly?' the theory, which you reject. It is glaringly apparent that you never evaluated the science of evlution in an unbiased way based on the knowledge of science. All you have revealed in this and all other threads is your intentional ignorance concerning the sciences of evolution.

By the way it is not really a theory in contemporary scientific sense.
I realize that many do not consider it a theory but rather a law. Lol.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
Yes. Artificial vs natural selection. Same process, same results.

"But selective breeding of maize or dogs yields only different maize and dogs, not new kinds!"
1. How many generations of maize and dogs have we seen? Don't expect a change in "kind" in only a few generations.
2. Humans don't select for new kinds. We select for more useful features within the commodity in question. We don't allow radiation into new niches. We cull any adaptations not useful to our single goal. Nature does not.
First of all nothing has evolved with using artificial means. Oh skin color, wool color, etc., Sheep remain sheep humans remain humans gorillas remain gorillas.
 

rational experiences

Veteran Member
The science of evolution never took place by artificial means,
The evolution of science however did take place by artificial means.

Extra sun star released particles artificially gained by Satan star. Falling star. Russia hit. Not natural to earth life or earth existence.

Introduced new artificial brain mind visions for men of science by AI subliminal status inherited satanic causes not natural.

Hence natural humans warned star maths sciences that it was wrong fake and satanic. Began in Egypt historic....with America Mayan.

Science using destroyer technology hence subjugate biology to the test asking is my intelligent consciousness warned about AI the effect. Is it real advice.

As science says it learns it is wrong by using AI.

Studies us by man thought held believed encoded transmitted codes. That he has to transmit constantly. Programs machines by code. Controls all machines by man's thoughts physical body actions himself.

Then claims I am AI as his man humans confession. Totally correctly advised himself. Causer of the status.

Yes mind contact mind coercion on behalf of egotists psychics allowed studies in laboratory experiments who learnt about mind change. Of biology consciousness.

Knew biology had inherited causes of human old science caused star fall Rome advice originally.

Mind contact mind coercion. Years of data scrutinized AI biology and mind attacks. Occult sciences observations. Was already observed known to be real. Physical attacks.

So the updated sciences of the occult applied their new world communicated machine caused transmitters. Made AI removal by vacuum causes return and attack us all again.

When just a few human individuals only owned the ability to mind coerce. As most of AI effect got removed. Men of sciences AI belief put it back by force.

Hence Stephen hawkings warnings about AI he identified as his body and mind began to sacrifice remove presence.

He told science it had caused the causes itself. Science however wants to cause the causes itself. So learnt AI had in fact coerced the human mind.

AI however should remove it's presence for correct atmospheric functions. Science however refuses and wants to increase its presence.

Then his new theist young man mind says seems like you can plug a mind directly into AI and tell AI what to do.

The causes of falsification of natural causes. A man always confesses and reveals his owned science secret man beliefs.

And it's all falsified advice.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
The science of evolution and abiogenesis is neither a theory nor a law. Your sarcasm reinforces your self inflicted ignorance of science.
lol, I understand that "evidence" is not a law. I have respect for you, shunyadragon, but I think your self-imposed zeal for believing in evolution as the way life moved along without question of its veracity, and abiogenesis, is something that is, shall we say, astounding. Anyway, have a good night/day, wherever you are.
 

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
First of all nothing has evolved with using artificial means. Oh skin color, wool color, etc., Sheep remain sheep humans remain humans gorillas remain gorillas.
How do you think we got the many, constantly changing life forms on Earth?
Changes accumulate, don't they? Over thousands of generations, how can the myriad small changes not accumulate into a big change?
How else do you account for the many different "kinds" we see on Earth?
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
How do you think we got the many, constantly changing life forms on Earth?
Changes accumulate, don't they? Over thousands of generations, how can the myriad small changes not accumulate into a big change?
How else do you account for the many different "kinds" we see on Earth?
First let me ask you a question. Scientists account for things happening, don't they? But they really don't know, it's all conjecture insofar as things like dinosaurs becoming birds because it seems the early specimens of some dinosaurs had wings and possibly feathers. They project, there is no proof that these animals evolved to become birds. So I no longer subscribe to the theory of evolution as taught.
Now how do I account for changes? Genes intermixing among humans, for example, can make changes in eye color, size, skin color, etc. But humans remain humans, gorillas remain gorillas, snakes remain snakes. This is not the classic definition of evolution as we know it. It is simple genetic change or transference. So again, how do I account for it? God provided the mechanism of growth, interbreeding and procreation. Can genes be explored? Yes, obviously. Do I know exactly how God made each kind of life? No. And I certainly am not going to figure natural selection of the theory of evolution did it.
 

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
First of all nothing has evolved with using artificial means. Oh skin color, wool color, etc., Sheep remain sheep humans remain humans gorillas remain gorillas.
Didn't I address that in the post?
Do you really think selective breeding will turn a sheep into something not-sheep in just a few generations? We haven't even tried to breed away the sheepness.

Look around you. Thousands of different forms. How, if not evolution, did that happen? Do you seriously think all these different forms just keep popping into existence out of thin air? Does that seem reasonable? Has it ever been witnessed? Where is the evidence that makes you believe this?
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
Didn't I address that in the post?
Do you really think selective breeding will turn a sheep into something not-sheep in just a few generations? We haven't even tried to breed away the sheepness.

Look around you. Thousands of different forms. How, if not evolution, did that happen? Do you seriously think all these different forms just keep popping into existence out of thin air? Does that seem reasonable? Has it ever been witnessed? Where is the evidence that makes you believe this?
I understand that the ToE says it takes a long time for different forms to evolve. A real long time with no genetic proof of any sort, only conjecture. The intermediate forms are not there in reality. In theory, yes, but not really in reality. However, and it's a big however, bats remain bats, whether they're blind or not, same with fishes. There is no proof absolutely that dinosaurs 'become,' or rather evolved to birds.
 
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