Putting the JW Stand on Evolution in Perspective

[Jose Fly]

Oh, brother! I think they support mainstream science...so since they wrote what they did — they did add the preposition “in most cases,”....they didn’t say ‘all’ phyla lines (I’m surprised you didn’t pick up on that) — that would mean they are....honest?

So why did you offer them up as the definitive authority for the fossil record?

The Cambrian Radiation being in the spotlight as it is.... if there were valid “evident precursors” (of the Cambrian life) discovered in the Ediacaran.... we’d never see or hear the end of it!

But not a peep.

Again, there's an enormous amount of material available on the subject. I linked you to one such source earlier (HERE it is again). So if you're interested, you'll make the effort to educate yourself.

 

[savagewind]

So if you're interested, you'll make the effort to educate yourself.

They seem to be uninterested in anything that their master does not allow them to be.

 

[savagewind]

Which, makes a good story. Doesn't it?

 

[Hockeycowboy]

It was not even one valid reason. It was clutching at straws by Deeje.

This had nothing to do with Deeje. In fact, I was addressing Deeje. I would not then use the pronoun “her”, as in “her statement,” if I meant Deeje‘s statement. I was referring to the woman in the video.

 

[Jose Fly]

They seem to be uninterested in anything that their master does not allow them to be.

That's why I don't waste time writing up an explanation. I used to do that sort of thing quite a bit back in the day, but now? Nah.

 

[savagewind]

That's why I don't waste time writing up an explanation. I used to do that sort of thing quite a bit back in the day, but now? Nah.

I think that what power they have to ignore might be something interesting for someone somewhere to investigate

 

[savagewind]

It is a fact that it can't be me!

 

[Jose Fly]

I think that what power they have to ignore might be something interesting for someone somewhere to investigate

I've actually read some decent papers on the psychology behind fundamentalism and denialism. Internet creationists are excellent case studies of coping mechanisms and avoidance behaviors.

 

[Subduction Zone]

This had nothing to do with Deeje. In fact, I was addressing Deeje. I would not then use the pronoun “her”, as in “her statement,” if I meant Deeje‘s statement. I was referring to the woman in the video.

Oh sorry, I saw that at first, but then it seemed you were saying it was Deeje's mistake in a later post.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

So why did you offer them up as the definitive authority for the fossil record?

It was about the Cambrian record, and it’s lack of “evident precursors”. Only that. Comprende? Yes? No?

I appreciated their candor.

Again, there's an enormous amount of material available on the subject. I linked you to one such source earlier (HERE it is again). So if you're interested, you'll make the effort to educate yourself.

What, you want me to buy a book? Are you the seller?

 

[Subduction Zone]

I've actually read some decent papers on the psychology behind fundamentalism and denialism. Internet creationists are excellent case studies of coping mechanisms and avoidance behaviors.

You are probably right. I have on rare occasions had creationists make an honest attempt to understand a topic. But when the idea clearly refuted their beliefs cognitive dissonance would cut in.

I will have to see if I can find some old sources with a couple of true masters of cog dis, on a separate subject. They were such a train wreck that it was all but impossible not to.debate with them.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

Oh sorry, I saw that at first, but then it seemed you were saying it was Eddie's mistake in a later post.

No problem. A lot is going on here on these threads.

 

[Jose Fly]

It was about the Cambrian record, and it’s lack of “evident precursors”. Only that. Comprende? Yes? No?

Really? So they're authorities on the fossil record of the Cambrian, but no other aspect of the fossil record. How exactly does that work? I mean....how did that come to be, and how do you know?

I appreciated their candor.

Ah, so it's a classic case of confirmation bias. When they seem to agree with you, they're an authority. When they disagree with you, they're not. That about right?

What, you want me to buy a book? Are you the seller?

*ahem* There's these buildings called "libraries" and believe it or not, you can actually borrow books from them for free!

Like I said, if you're interested you'll make the effort.

 

[metis]

I was answering what you posted to me....how thoughtless of me not to consider your sensibilities....sorry. I'm not good at condensing a book into one paragraph.

I am not your enemy metis....I am only putting a voice to the doubt you already have. I believe that you are actually fighting yourself.....and you have probably been doing it for as long as you can remember.

We all have the same choices and can all access the same information. Why did some people love Jesus and want to follow him, while others wanted to kill him? It's all about what we want to believe....isn't it? That is what separates the sheep from the goats.



All is relevant to the topic. I like side points personally as they expand knowledge of the subject...I think I can understand why you don't like them. I love detail but you seem to be offended by it.



No metis, it is impossible to have a discussion with someone who "can't handle the truth" even when it is apparent from their frequent shifts in religious thinking over the years, that they have difficulty pinning it down. What I shared is the honest truth as I understand it. I assume that you do too?

The church, (like their role models the Pharisees) say one thing and do the opposite.

I found my truth over 45 years ago and I haven't budged an inch. I feel genuinely sorry for the indecisive people of this world, who can never quite get a handle on what to believe. (James 1:6-8) I believe that these conversations give them food for thought....don't you?

I sincerely hope you eventually find what you are looking for, but I would be more than amazed if you found it in Catholicism. I think your logic will ultimately defeat how much faith it takes to believe what Catholicism teaches....but that is just me....a refugee from Christendom who found a solid house to live in...not built on sand, but built on the rock that is not Peter, but Jesus Christ. The storm is coming, so let's see whose house is still standing at the end...?



I understand, but I might start a thread anyway and open it up to the Catholic folk here for discussion. I'm sure that the differences will interest at least some people. I'll work on it.

 

[Subduction Zone]

No problem. A lot is going on here on these threads.

And my tablet's Autowrong feature kicked in. I wrote Deeje but it changed it to Eddie.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

Really? So they're authorities on the fossil record of the Cambrian, but no other aspect of the fossil record. How exactly does that work? I mean....how did that come to be, and how do you know?


Ah, so it's a classic case of confirmation bias. When they seem to agree with you, they're an authority. When they disagree with you, they're not. That about right?


*ahem* There's these buildings called "libraries" and believe it or not, you can actually borrow books from them for free!

Like I said, if you're interested you'll make the effort.

You know what? You keep on with this, in it just bolsters what they’ve posted about the pre-Cambrian fossils...that, when they post on a topic, they try to post what they view as truth. Or do you think they’re lying?

 

[savagewind]

No problem. A lot is going on here on these threads.

But, I'm not.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

According to you, she said "Your God wants me to curse MY morality."

That’s what I thought she said. What did you hear?

Gotta go for now. I’ll respond later.

 

[oldbadger]

Meanwhile China adds 15,000 cars per day.

Defeatist?

 

[oldbadger]

Right on, @oldbadger!

JW’s, as you know, are not YEC’s, so we don’t believe that rock strata were laid down by the Flood (which we believe was Global)... at least, most of the strata. We certainly believe, though, that the Flood cut into more of the Grand Canyon, resulting in its great width & depth.

Secular scientists’ timelines virtually never agree with the Bible’s, but I don’t put much stock in their dating methods.
The soft-tissue and such discovered by Dr. Mary Schweitzer within fossilized remains of a T-Rex, supposedly at least 65 mya (when their “extinction” occurred), justifies skepticism. Hey, whaddaya know? I’m a skeptic!

Back to the Flood: interesting article about the power of a recent flood in Texas.....

Canyon carved in just three days in Texas flood: Insight into ancient flood events on Earth and Mars

What a good example of how nature can achieve amazing results very quickly. Carving a 2.2 kilometer gorge several meters deep in to bed rock in a few weeks.

Yes..... I know that you believe that the flood was global.

I do know that there have been global floods before, several of them, not always of water but floods just the same.