Question about "deities" that come to us in our dreams.

[sun rise]

As far as I know it mostly happens to deeply religious or spiritual people I am more or less sure it does not happens to non believers.

There are books written by people who were turned into believers by such visits.

 

[Spirit of Light]

There are books written by people who were turned into believers by such visits.

I know but are this visits real, or are it demons who pretend?

 

[sun rise]

As to my own experiences, on a couple of occasions during my 75 years of life, I have had such experiences. They had a quality that is other than any other I've ever had and they have not faded with time.

To your second question, there is a difference between a vision in the dream state and an ordinary dream. One guide is that in a vision there is a feeling of bliss which is not present in ordinary dreams.

After one of the sleeping visions, I wrote this:
God's waters flood me
and I come alive.

 

[Left Coast]

What if your reality is simply a product of your mind/brain?

Possible I suppose, although unfalsifiable. If the mental illusion of "reality" is so similar to what reality would be like if it weren't dependent on our brains, that there's no way to tell the difference, then it's basically irrelevant.

 

[Sw. Vandana Jyothi]

Sometimes we can experience that we are "visited" by a deity or some religious figure that are close to our belief when we dream.
My question is.

1: How can we be sure this visit is the real deal, and not an imposter (demon) that trying to confuse us to believe we are special and get visits from the Deity we believe in? And it leading us in to a false path and away from our religious cultivation.

Namaste, Amanaki~
Luckily, you will not need to ask to weigh divine experiences with your mind or intellect to determine their validity (whether they occur in a waking, dreaming, deep sleep or transcendental state of consciousness) . Neither mind nor intellect are capable of discerning spiritual truth, anyway; they are much more a hindrance than a help until they become silent.

So be at ease, you will absolutely be sure when you receive that blessing because a visitation, with visuals or otherwise (darshan) of the Real Deal leaves NO doubt in its wake. None whatsoever. Conversely, if there is any doubt, that is the sign that the experience was hallucination, ordinary dream or whatever. They can be most pleasant but they won't leave you debating with yourself about the nature of reality. When you experience Real, everything else seems unreal and you just get used to it, you don't mistake unreal for real ever again. And how could it be otherwise? "We" ourselves are a spark of a Real fire and fire recognizes itself. "We" are waves on a vast Real ocean; ocean water and wave water are alike. There's no effort required for either to recognize and relate to itself and no doubt at all when it occurs.

2: Have you experienced this you self? What does the religioues/spiritual teaching you follow say about this topic?

Yes, in both waking and dream state consciousness. God's grace and mercy alone, I'm not special but having them is how I can so earnestly speak to your first question. You will have no doubt! Hinduism is replete with stories of divine dreams and even gurus coming into the dream of their disciples to initiate or communicate with them (e.g., Sant Tukaram). For ordinary people, the walls between wakeful, dream, deep sleep and transcendental states of consciousness are apparently impenetrable. While experiencing one, the others are not usually available. But Self-realized beings have no difficulty doing so. When one realizes that he is Consciousness Itself, what wall in any state of consciousness exists then?!

 

[Spirit of Light]

Namaste, Amanaki~
Luckily, you will not need to ask to weigh divine experiences with your mind or intellect to determine their validity (whether they occur in a waking, dreaming, deep sleep or transcendental state of consciousness) . Neither mind nor intellect are capable of discerning spiritual truth, anyway; they are much more a hindrance than a help until they become silent.

So be at ease, you will absolutely be sure when you receive that blessing because a visitation, with visuals or otherwise (darshan) of the Real Deal leaves NO doubt in its wake. None whatsoever. Conversely, if there is any doubt, that is the sign that the experience was hallucination, ordinary dream or whatever. They can be most pleasant but they won't leave you debating with yourself about the nature of reality. When you experience Real, everything else seems unreal and you just get used to it, you don't mistake unreal for real ever again. And how could it be otherwise? "We" ourselves are a spark of a Real fire and fire recognizes itself. "We" are waves on a vast Real ocean; ocean water and wave water are alike. There's no effort required for either to recognize and relate to itself and no doubt at all when it occurs.



Yes, in both waking and dream state consciousness. God's grace and mercy alone, I'm not special but having them is how I can so earnestly speak to your first question. You will have no doubt! Hinduism is replete with stories of divine dreams and even gurus coming into the dream of their disciples to initiate or communicate with them (e.g., Sant Tukaram). For ordinary people, the walls between wakeful, dream, deep sleep and transcendental states of consciousness are apparently impenetrable. While experiencing one, the others are not usually available. But Self-realized beings have no difficulty doing so. When one realizes that he is Consciousness Itself, what wall in any state of consciousness exists then?!

I agree to what you speak of here @Sw. Vandana Jyothi yes only those who have awaken to a certain wisdom level will have real interaction with spiritual beings
For my self I have not had dreams with this kind of beings, but I "met" a few in meditation.

 

[Cooky]

Yes this is true too
Personally I do not hold the belief that a deity come to us in our dreams. But a demon could do that dressed as a deity, in my understanding

Now that I have had, actually, except he presented himself as he was.

 

[Cooky]

I had a dream where one demon, who claimed to have been with me, stood and watched another demon enter into my home.

...The second demon resembled captain caveman, except scary, and spun in circles so fast, and moved about so violently It destroyed my kitchen and my home by it's very presence.

The dream was so vivid and scary I woke up screaming. I believe it was a sign. But it was a useless sign... More like a showing off.

 

[Sw. Vandana Jyothi]

I agree to what you speak of here @Sw. Vandana Jyothi yes only those who have awaken to a certain wisdom level will have real interaction with spiritual beings
For my self I have not had dreams with this kind of beings, but I "met" a few in meditation.

You answer made me smile big time. Bigger than that, even. May your meditations prove even more friendly and fruitful. (See, I can say that, tee hee, but you can't. We're taught to meditate without regard for the fruits and neither cling to nor reject any of those which arise.) It took me quite a while to understand that rejecting with passion and possession (i.e., self-centered, selfishly) created just as much karma and whoop-di-do as clinging tenaciously in attachment to something or someone.

Sometimes I wonder if there are levels of wisdom and what it means to awaken to it. Maybe wisdom is like consciousness, a big soup with no containers and no boundaries and our awakening, if gradual, is merely (?!) the diminishment of ego bit by bit, i.e., the "giving up" of ignorance and desires and all that which we think we are, that we think will makes us happy, all that which causes us to mistake and sometimes even yearn for the unreal over the Real. Because even after having an experience with Real, if it isn't one's "final liberation" where forever after all events, peoples and places are seen and experienced as God, then there's this darn prarabdha (predestined) karma to deal with. Equanimity, O wherefore out thou, my equanimity....

 

[Spirit of Light]

You answer made me smile big time. Bigger than that, even. May your meditations prove even more friendly and fruitful. (See, I can say that, tee hee, but you can't. We're taught to meditate without regard for the fruits and neither cling to nor reject any of those which arise.) It took me quite a while to understand that rejecting with passion and possession (i.e., self-centered, selfishly) created just as much karma and whoop-di-do as clinging tenaciously in attachment to something or someone.

Sometimes I wonder if there are levels of wisdom and what it means to awaken to it. Maybe wisdom is like consciousness, a big soup with no containers and no boundaries and our awakening, if gradual, is merely (?!) the diminishment of ego bit by bit, i.e., the "giving up" of ignorance and desires and all that which we think we are, that we think will makes us happy, all that which causes us to mistake and sometimes even yearn for the unreal over the Real. Because even after having an experience with Real, if it isn't one's "final liberation" where forever after all events, peoples and places are seen and experienced as God, then there's this darn prarabdha (predestined) karma to deal with. Equanimity, O wherefore out thou, my equanimity....

You are right again we should not cling to any of our experience within meditation and also discussing experience from meditation can be difficult because everyone are at different level of wisdom, so we do not see or experience the same, it is a personal journey from within us I can feel you already know all of this
Karma can make it difficult to awaken spiritually yes, because with to much karma it will be like seeing through mud, but when spiritual awakening happens the mud in our eyes disappear and we see clearly
The most difficult part for me in the cultivation has been to realize that even I have "progress" in one area of the spiritual cultivation, I notice the lagging behind in other areas. But that is of course a part of the cultivation of mind and body.
If we were to awaken fully in one second without all the years of removing attachments and tighten our morality I think we would go crazy in the moment we realize the full truth.

Even have only scratched the ssurface of what truth is, I understand I have so much to realize truthfulness, compassion and forbearance is so much more then we think, but in the same way it is so very simple.

 

[Sw. Vandana Jyothi]

I had a dream where one demon, who claimed to have been with me, stood and watched another demon enter into my home.

...The second demon resembled captain caveman, except scary, and spun in circles so fast, and moved about so violently It destroyed my kitchen and my home by it's very presence.

The dream was so vivid and scary I woke up screaming. I believe it was a sign. But it was a useless sign... More like a showing off.

Hello, Cooky
Your post touched me. I believe you, it rings as true. So I'd like to offer a potential clue to the meaning of your dream. Not necessary to answer here at all, but the specter of "jealousy" leapt at me when I read how the demon moved, that it invaded your space and destroyed your kitchen and home. That demon is horrific. Perhaps it was not a useless sign, dreams are often crafted by our higher selves to give an important message. Please don't be offended that I wrote these things. No offense is intended at all.

 

[Valjean]

There are books written by people who were turned into believers by such visits.

Saul/Paul?

Amanaki said:
↑As far as I know it mostly happens to deeply religious or spiritual people I am more or less sure it does not happens to non believers.

https://www.religiousforums.com/goto/post?id=6751441#post-6751441
Why would it not? Are non-believers' brains different from believers'?
Hallucinations, delusions, seizures, vivid dreams, &c. are more common than people realize. They can be induced by all sorts of stimuli -- and, frequently, by lack of stimuli, and mental hospitals are full of would-be prophets, seers and god-men.

People experience, see or hear all sorts of things that aren't apparent to those around them. These usually go nowhere. Occasionally, though, circumstances conspire to generate religious, political or social movements, led by charismatic prophets, saints and seers.
Results are mixed.

 

[sun rise]

Saul/Paul?

Sure. Also people like Francis Collins. I think there are others but can't remember them right now.

 

[viole]

Sometimes we can experience that we are "visited" by a deity or some religious figure that are close to our belief when we dream.
My question is.

1: How can we be sure this visit is the real deal, and not an imposter (demon) that trying to confuse us to believe we are special and get visits from the Deity we believe in? And it leading us in to a false path and away from our religious cultivation.

2: Have you experienced this you self? What does the religioues/spiritual teaching you follow say about this topic?

A few weeks ago I dreamed of Superman taking me for a ride to New York. So do you think he was an impostor, like Batman instead, or the real thing?

Ciao

- viole

 

[Spirit of Light]

A few weeks ago I dreamed of Superman taking me for a ride to New York. So do you think he was an impostor, like Batman instead, or the real thing?

Ciao

- viole

Is superman or Batman deities as I ask about in the OP? No they are not

 

[syo]

How can we be sure this visit is the real deal, and not an imposter (demon)

The imposters visit us when we are awake.

 

[Spirit of Light]

The imposters visit us when we are awake.

Yes I experienced that too my self

 

[viole]

Is superman or Batman deities as I ask about in the OP? No they are not

True, but logically, if dreams are somehow indicators of an external reality, why should not that be applicable to Batman, Superman, Mickey Mouse, etc? And if they are not reliable, concerning an external reality, why do you ask questions in the form as if they were?

This is called begging the question, I am afraid.

Ciao

- viole

 

[syo]

Have you experienced this you self?

Yes.

 

[Spirit of Light]

True, but logically, if dreams are somehow indicators of an external reality, why should not that be applicable to Batman, Superman, Mickey Mouse, etc? And if they are not reliable, concerning an external reality, why do you ask questions in the form as if they were?

This is called begging the question, I am afraid.

Ciao

- viole

I asked about deities as of heavenly beings, Superman and Batman is man made cartoons and movies.
I know atheists and non believers will not get what ask. Sorry for being so blunt