Question for Atheists...

[Polymath257]

I don't know if ET's exist or not, however we are here.
The universe is roughly 13.5 billion years old.
Our solar system 4.5 billion years old

A lot can happen in that 9 billion years difference.

Oh, I agree. And I do think/bet there is other life in the universe, probably even rather abundantly. But 120 light years is a very small distance (essentially our back yard) when it comes to even our galaxy, let alone taking into account other galaxies. Also, there is the issue of the Fermi paradox.

Solutions to the Fermi Paradox

The Fermi Paradox is the thought that there is a high likelihood of extraterrestrial existence, yet there is no evidence for any. What are your solutions to this paradox? I have this in Science and Religion because I'm interested in religious takes as well as scientific ones. The idea that...

www.religiousforums.com

 

[We Never Know]

Oh, I agree. And I do think/bet there is other life in the universe, probably even rather abundantly. But 120 light years is a very small distance (essentially our back yard) when it comes to even our galaxy, let alone taking into account other galaxies. Also, there is the issue of the Fermi paradox.

Solutions to the Fermi Paradox

The Fermi Paradox is the thought that there is a high likelihood of extraterrestrial existence, yet there is no evidence for any. What are your solutions to this paradox? I have this in Science and Religion because I'm interested in religious takes as well as scientific ones. The idea that...

www.religiousforums.com

A lot of life exists in my backyard that goes unnoticed.

But yes 120 light years is a short distance compared to the universe. But with our galaxy at 100,000 light years, 120 light years is a good distance.

 

[Aupmanyav]

They most certainly do matter.
Actually, you wouldn't be here if you thought they didn't... but that's irrelevant to the discussion at hand.
Maybe you concede.

I was not using the forum for upward of three months (Warnings). I do not think that made any difference to the forum. We have big egos.Even relatives forget after a few days or months. Life does not stop.

 

[Polymath257]

A lot of life exists in my backyard that goes unnoticed.

But yes 120 light years is a short distance compared to the universe. But with our galaxy at 100,000 light years, 120 light years is a good distance.

Somewhere around 1/10% of the distance across our galaxy. That's like wanting to go across the US and managing to get 3 miles.

But your point is taken in regards to life that goes unrecognized. Of course, we have searched and not found *anything*.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Radius of the observable universe is 46.508 billion light years. There are between 100-200 billion galaxies. 100 billion stars on an average in a galaxy (Stats from Google Search). I am sure, there are billions of planets with life. However, we may not come across any evidence because of the distances and other factors (time).

 

[Heyo]

Of course, we have searched and not found *anything*.

We have taken a hand full of sand from the beach and glanced over it.

We don't have the microscope to see all the single celled life - yet (or just yet).
What we can say that there is no life out there that can be registered by our instruments.

 

[Polymath257]

We have taken a hand full of sand from the beach and glanced over it.

We don't have the microscope to see all the single celled life - yet (or just yet).
What we can say that there is no life out there that can be registered by our instruments.

Agreed. We are very, very, very far from having observed even a small fraction of available space.

 

[We Never Know]

We have taken a hand full of sand from the beach and glanced over it.

We don't have the microscope to see all the single celled life - yet (or just yet).
What we can say that there is no life out there that can be registered by our instruments.

"What we can say that there is no life out there that can be registered by our instruments."

I would say "has been" instead of "can be".

"there is no life out there that has been registered by our instruments."

 

[Bird123]

Why assume it has a purpose at all? Most stars don't, after all.

Again, why assume it has a purpose. Does it need one in order to do what it does?

No, I really don't. I see things that humans have put to a purpose for their own ends, or that interpret as having a purpose, again for their own ends. But I don't see any purpose other than what *we* give to it.

Again, why assume it has a purpose?

But in all, you are assuming a form for the answer. I ask whether or not there is a purpose and find none. You ask what the purpose is and make up one that fits your biases.

And it is becoming more clear to me all the time.

The sun's purpose is to supply the energy to make our world operate. Bias or not, take the sun away and the sun's purpose will be realized after 8 minutes.

Start taking the things with purpose away and things we all take for granted quickly disappear. How long would survival last at mankind's level of understanding?

If you can not see purpose, take each thing away and look for the changes to determine if a purpose is being served.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Polymath257]

The sun's purpose is to supply the energy to make our world operate. Bias or not, take the sun away and the sun's purpose will be realized after 8 minutes.

And why do you assume that is its purpose instead of a side effect? After all, the vast majority of the energy from the sun simply goes off into space.

Start taking the things with purpose away and things we all take for granted quickly disappear. How long would survival last at mankind's level of understanding?

And you assume that the benefits to us is the purpose? That seems incredibly egotistical.

If you can not see purpose, take each thing away and look for the changes to determine if a purpose is being served.

A benefit is not the same as a purpose. You assume that benefits to us means there is a purpose. That seems highly unlikely. I see it as far more likely that we are a side effect with no purpose.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[ratiocinator]

The sun's purpose is to supply the energy to make our world operate. Bias or not, take the sun away and the sun's purpose will be realized after 8 minutes.

Start taking the things with purpose away and things we all take for granted quickly disappear. How long would survival last at mankind's level of understanding?

If you can not see purpose, take each thing away and look for the changes to determine if a purpose is being served.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

"This is rather as if you imagine a puddle waking up one morning and thinking, 'This is an interesting world I find myself in - an interesting hole I find myself in - fits me rather neatly, doesn't it? In fact it fits me staggeringly well, must have been made to have me in it!'"

-- Douglas Adams​

 

[Heyo]

"This is rather as if you imagine a puddle waking up one morning and thinking, 'This is an interesting world I find myself in - an interesting hole I find myself in - fits me rather neatly, doesn't it? In fact it fits me staggeringly well, must have been made to have me in it!'"

-- Douglas Adams​

:winner:

 

[nPeace]

The sun's purpose is to supply the energy to make our world operate. Bias or not, take the sun away and the sun's purpose will be realized after 8 minutes.

Start taking the things with purpose away and things we all take for granted quickly disappear. How long would survival last at mankind's level of understanding?

If you can not see purpose, take each thing away and look for the changes to determine if a purpose is being served.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[nPeace]

"This is rather as if you imagine a puddle waking up one morning and thinking, 'This is an interesting world I find myself in - an interesting hole I find myself in - fits me rather neatly, doesn't it? In fact it fits me staggeringly well, must have been made to have me in it!'"

-- Douglas Adams​

I guess you also say that about all your possessions... including your house.
"Oh, these things weren't made for a purpose. We just happened to fit nicely in."
Sounds like somthing the frogs would say... if they could tell us.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

One must seek first.

Seek what? Define it. What are the leads? Why do think the thing to seek is even there to be found?

I point to where you can Discover the evidence for yourself. I can not do it for you. I will not feed your belief structure that you seem to depend upon. On the other hand, if I were trying to feed your belief structure I would have to work harder to convince you.

What does this mean?

Little do you realize I'm not dealing with beliefs and I do not want others to as well. Discover what is will bring better results and greater wisdom. Your choices will always be your free choices. To want anything else will not bring the best results. Each decides for themselves what they truly seek.

Again, this abstract vaguery isn't going anywhere...

What is it that you seek?

I don't know in advance what the answers are.
I go where the evidence leads. I don't decide before hand what I want to be true.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

It doesn't sound very clear.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Lol thanks. Certain collections. They have to be magnetically connected I guess. Tell me about it...lol.

You've never seen such a certain collection of atoms? We call such particular formation "brains".
You'll find it in the head of any being capable of thought.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Yup by gravity. Or magic, you think? Single atoms don't think huh but put them together like in a bee brain and they magically think maybe through Einstein's theory, eh? My oh my...so good learning from you guys and gals about "science." What's gravity, magic and stupid strawmen arguments. Eeks. Been a trip, who needs Timothy Leary?

Today, we take a bunch of sillicon, plastic etc... put them together in a specific way (you know, just some collection of atoms) and make it think
We call them computers.

Why do you consider it so strange that certain collections of atoms put together into specific patterns, can as-a-collection do things that the individual atoms can't?

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Can you really see no purpose in anything? Start small. See where it leads.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

All "purpose" I see in the world has been super-imposed on it by myself or other humans.

I see no purpose at all in anything absent a human brain that super-imposes that purpose unto whatever it is.

WE give meaning to things.
Things don't have meaning "inherently", independently from human brains..

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Are you admitting that man cannot determine that desires, intentions, emotions, and thoughts, are physical?

AI makes non-invasive mind-reading possible by turning thoughts into text

Advance raises prospect of new ways to restore speech in those struggling to communicate due to stroke or motor neurone disease

www.theguardian.com

Even considering how little we know about the brain, we are even able to take these first baby steps in building "brain interfaces". This here is tech that looks at physical brain activity and converts the thoughts into text.

The thoughts = the brain activity.
"reading" the brain activity, allows for outputting the thought in text form.

This is only possible because the thought = the brain activity.

In other words.... thoughts = physical (as physical brain activity).

Yes, there are such things as physical, mental, and spiritual, and those do not change form based on what man believes.

Says the person who's rather fundamentalist religious doctrine literally requires her to believe that some kind of immaterial ghost / "soul" is hiding somewhere in the body and uses that assumption to be so certain that thoughts are not physical.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Start with simple things. What purpose does the sun have? What purpose does the water cycle have?

About the same "purpose" as the sharp random rock sticking out of the ground that the cat is using to scratch itself in places it can't reach.

What purpose does a water table supply? Can you see no purpose anywhere? What purpose is there great distances from planets and systems in the universe? What is the purpose for gender? What is the purpose for birds or even mosquitoes? What purpose does God have not speaking to everybody? What is the purpose of death?? There are an endless supply of question for those who Seek!!!

I see function at best. Maybe you should define what you mean by "purpose".