religion and kids

[Bismillah]

Mathematics is absolute. Religion is not.

Are either any less important? If one teaches you basic arithmetic and the other teaches you reasoning and instills a set of morals which one is more important and is one truly damaging?

 

[Jacksnyte]

I had a simmilar upbringing to this,my parents were both Christian but it was never forced on me apart from being Baptised,i was encouraged to ask questions and make my own mind up as to the worth of the answers.

I think two quotes made my mind up as a Child "all that glitters isn't neccassarily Gold" and "just because its written doesn't make it true"

I wasn't even allowed to go to church with kids from other christian denominations because my parents were afraid I would convert!

 

[EmpiricalAgnosticAtheist]

Of course a responsible parent will teach his children the things they know best, and that which they hold in high regard. If you're an ardent proponent of hard work and discipline, then that's what you're going to teach his children. If you're a very religious person, then you'll teach a kid your beliefs. Especially since most people belong to organized religions, the child will most likely be attending "church" type services and functions with some kind of regularity.

Whether you're a Theist/ Atheist, or Gnostic/ Agnostic and all shades inbetween/ outside, you teach your children what you know and think about the world. And obviously your own belief system is going to seem superior, everyone thinks theirs is the best.

Now, obtrusively positing your religious beliefs onto someone else's children is not alright. Unless someone's beliefs are obviously endangering a child's safety, it's not your place to try to convince a child that your beliefs are better than what their parents are teaching them. If someone did this to your daughter, then you have all the right in the world to be ******.

 

[No Good Boyo]

Thanks, very interesting. Had never heard of it before.

 

[Jacksnyte]

Are either any less important? If one teaches you basic arithmetic and the other teaches you reasoning and instills a set of morals which one is more important and is one truly damaging?

It really depends on the approach whether or not it is damaging. I feel my ability to think critically was damaged. I had to learn critical thinking skills as a young adult that a lot of people learn before they are out of high school. Certain extreme religious stances can be emotionally/intellectually crippling for a child.

 

[Caladan]

I appreciate that these things can be given to children. What I’m driving at is whether or not religion should be given to children. As a parent I am fully aware that my children will accept what I teach them as truth, and this truth stays with them for a very long time. I completely accept that to each believer of any religion, their faith is their truth. But equally, that believer has to accept that the “truth” is unique to them, and is an untruth to people of other faiths or no faith. So given the margin of doubt that their truth may possibly not be “absolute truth”, is correct to pass this to ones child?
Does that make sense?

Like I said. I hope that no one is forcing you in your own nation to follow a tradition or a religion.
As for absolute truths. its all in the eye of the beholder. for a Muslim, Islam is the absolute truth. if you are a member of a different philosophy, it is most likely that this philosophy is the prime mover in your mind. and if it isn't, you should ask yourself if its a strong enough driving force in your life. or is it guiding you in the direction to accomplish whatever it is that you aim for.

 

[England my lionheart]

Are either any less important? If one teaches you basic arithmetic and the other teaches you reasoning and instills a set of morals which one is more important and is one truly damaging?

Arithmetic is essential in todays world,i can't see how religion teaches you to reason when if you used reasoning alone it becomes unbelievable and religion isn't required to have morals

 

[England my lionheart]

It really depends on the approach whether or not it is damaging. I feel my ability to think critically was damaged. I had to learn critical thinking skills as a young adult that a lot of people learn before they are out of high school. Certain extreme religious stances can be emotionally/intellectually crippling for a child.

Absolutely,certain extreme religious stances are not far short of Child abuse IMO

 

[Riverwolf]

It really depends on the approach whether or not it is damaging. I feel my ability to think critically was damaged. I had to learn critical thinking skills as a young adult that a lot of people learn before they are out of high school. Certain extreme religious stances can be emotionally/intellectually crippling for a child.

Though it should be understood that I also had trouble thinking critically until relatively recently, and even now have trouble with it sometimes, and I didn't grow up in a religious household.

Which is why while some extreme religious stances are crippling, as you say, I think the most important factor is NOT teaching the child how to think critically, which if my parents tried to(my dad tried as best he could when I was in junior high), they didn't really succeed (which may be in part due to my own closed-mindedness at the time.)

 

[No Good Boyo]

Finding one's place in the world is predetermined from the culture they are raised in. One cannot simply just change that fact. Regardless this understanding of the past does not limit the future, but refines the perception of the present.

Sorry, I have to disagree with that. The culture a person is born into may have some influence over their future, but it does not necessarily predetermine it. Your statement could be considered to be both defeatist and elitist depending on the context in which it is delivered.

 

[Riverwolf]

d

Are either any less important? If one teaches you basic arithmetic and the other teaches you reasoning and instills a set of morals which one is more important and is one truly damaging?

Reasoning and morals can be obtained from other sources besides religion. I actually know of a computer game that's all about ethics, and the system of virtues it has is quite good. It's also very much secular.

 

[Bismillah]

It really depends on the approach whether or not it is damaging. I feel my ability to think critically was damaged. I had to learn critical thinking skills as a young adult that a lot of people learn before they are out of high school. Certain extreme religious stances can be emotionally/intellectually crippling for a child.

Sure, but we are talking about different aspects of "indoctrination" where as one is suppressive and the other is inquisitive.

i can't see how religion teaches you to reason when if you used reasoning alone it becomes unbelievable and religion isn't required to have morals

So you are of the camp that theists are unreasonable? Religion almost always has a set of morals ascribed to it.

 

[Bismillah]

The culture a person is born into may have some influence over their future, but it does not necessarily predetermine it.

It most certainly alters their perspective of it.

 

[Riverwolf]

Sorry, I have to disagree with that. The culture a person is born into may have some influence over their future, but it does not necessarily predetermine it. Your statement could be considered to be both defeatist and elitist depending on the context in which it is delivered.

After all, one of the greatest of modern Hindu Sages, Satguru Sivaya Subramuniyaswami, was born in San Francisco. ^_^ And yet his teachings are very, very orthodox.

 

[England my lionheart]

I wasn't even allowed to go to church with kids from other christian denominations because my parents were afraid I would convert!

That sucks,i guess its the same for a lot of Kids,alienation is never going to be good for a Child.

 

[Jacksnyte]

Sorry, I have to disagree with that. The culture a person is born into may have some influence over their future, but it does not necessarily predetermine it. Your statement could be considered to be both defeatist and elitist depending on the context in which it is delivered.

This serves to illustrate the difference between people who have lived in one area for centuries, and people whose recent ancestors were immigrants to a fairly young culture that is still in it's infancy.

 

[Breathe]

I plan on teaching the children [one of] my religious beliefs.

I also plan on teaching them to question, to study, and to learn and trust science, and not to take the stories of religions as literal, and to study other religious scriptures and visit other religious places of worship, too.

And if anyone has a problem with it, they can bite my backside.

 

[Oneatatime]

Children shouldn't be forced to adopt a particular religion or no religion. They should be made aware of the options they have and allowed to choose for themselves. Its fairly obvious that a religion which does not encourage its adherents to forcefully recruit children into its ranks will soon be outcompeted by those religions which do. The religious who do this seem genuinly ignorent of the reasons why they forcibly convert people and its interesting to see the various justifications that are put forward in an attempt to rationlise their behaviour. Religion has also developed an effective defence mechanism in the form of subjecting anyone who suggests that children shouldn't be forced into their parents religion to a torrent of abuse until they fall quiet.

This highlights the need for Freedom from Religion to be written into the law.

 

[No Good Boyo]

Are either any less important? If one teaches you basic arithmetic and the other teaches you reasoning and instills a set of morals which one is more important and is one truly damaging?

it can be argued that faith does not teach "reasoning". It can be argued that faith is quite unreasonable as it requires you to believe without fact. Also, you do not need faith to have moral values, just look at the number of paedophiles in the clergy.

 

[England my lionheart]

Sure, but we are talking about different aspects of "indoctrination" where as one is suppressive and the other is inquisitive.

So you are of the camp that theists are unreasonable? Religion almost always has a set of morals ascribed to it.

Not at all,i'm saying that if you were to use reasoning when reading scriptures it would become unbelievable,for example the stories of Noahs Ark or Adam and Eve which require a lot of faith to believe,morals IMO are something we as Humans have learned a long time before the major religions appeared.