Religion Done Right

[viole]

I don't know who "you folks" are but the Bible says a man should not lie with another man like he would with a woman. It is not my opinion but the words of the Bible. Of course, people who do not believe in the Bible will find some excuse to say it does not mean what it says. Again, that is your opinion. But the Bible is very clear. The original post was about a person who was supporting the LGBT community so that is what brought up the subject of homosexuality - not "yu folks."

It also says that you should not eat shrimps. And that you can forgive a rapist if he marries his victim. Not my opinion, either, but the words of the Bible. The universal and unchangeable moral guideline.

Is eating shrimps a sin? If not, why not?

Ciao

- viole

 

[lostwanderingsoul]

Some people just do not want to be subjet to any rules, whether made by man or God. Robbers and murderers do not feel they are required to obey the law. That is their opinion. People who do not feel they are subject to the laws of the Bible have their opinion. None of that makes it right to do these things.

 

[Riverwolf]

Some people just do not want to be subjet to any rules, whether made by man or God. Robbers and murderers do not feel they are required to obey the law. That is their opinion. People who do not feel they are subject to the laws of the Bible have their opinion. None of that makes it right to do these things.

False equivalency, and broad generalization. Theft and murder, which have victims, aren't even remotely comparable to a male having sex with another male, which has no victim.

I'm subject to the laws of my city, the state of California, and the US. I have PLENTY of problems with some of those laws, but I'm glad that there are laws, and fully accept that I'm very much subject to them.

I'm also subject to my own Code. I'm not perfect in following it, but it is there, and I strive to follow it as best as I can.

But there's nothing that binds me to the laws of the Bible. I've never seen any indication that it's anything more than a collection of Jewish and early Christian literature, all of it written by humans.

If you're gonna imply that it's "wrong" to believe that the Bible is not binding on anyone except by personal choice, then you're gonna have to back that up.

 

[Ingledsva]

I don't know who "you folks" are but the Bible says a man should not lie with another man like he would with a woman. It is not my opinion but the words of the Bible. Of course, people who do not believe in the Bible will find some excuse to say it does not mean what it says. Again, that is your opinion. But the Bible is very clear. The original post was about a person who was supporting the LGBT community so that is what brought up the subject of homosexuality - not "yu folks."

Translation again. - It does not actually say that.

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[lostwanderingsoul]

Those who think they are not subject to God's laws will find out someday. I do not know what you mean by "translation" but it does actually say that. Maybe you are using a different Bible.

 

[Ingledsva]

Those who think they are not subject to God's laws will find out someday. I do not know what you mean by "translation" but it does actually say that. Maybe you are using a different Bible.

You have been shown that it doesn't actually say that; those are about Sacred Prostitutes, - and you have given no actual rebuttal to prove otherwise.

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[Pudding]

Believer A/B/C...etc: Those who think they are not subject to my interpretation/beliefs of God's laws version 1/2/3...etc will find out someday.

Great.

 

[JustWondering]

Those who think they are not subject to God's laws will find out someday.

or not.

 

[lostwanderingsoul]

I do not see how saying a man should not lie with anotgher man is subject to interpretation.

 

[Riverwolf]

Those who think they are not subject to God's laws will find out someday.

Well, he'd better get on to proving that his law is binding, because I've seen no indication that it is.

I do not know what you mean by "translation" but it does actually say that. Maybe you are using a different Bible.

...you ... seriously?

You do realize that the Bible is not an English text?

You do realize that the true language of the Tanakh is Hebrew, and the language of the NT is Greek, even though Jesus himself spoke Aramaic?

Also, do you know how to quote posts?

 

[Riverwolf]

I do not see how saying a man should not lie with anotgher man is subject to interpretation.

Is it saying that men can't even sleep in the same bed together, even in a non-sexual context? Because the English verb "to lie" in this case isn't exclusively sexual, and in fact, is very rarely sexual in modern vernacular.

Also, taken literally, it's biologically impossible to "[have sex] with a [biosex male] as one would a [biosex female]", because biosex males lack vaginas.

But then, my replaced terminology brings up the other issue: what about men who have vaginas? Are they forbidden from having sex with other men, vagina or otherwise?

 

[Ingledsva]

I do not see how saying a man should not lie with anotgher man is subject to interpretation.

There are only two verses that are iffy (to some.) ALL the others have words that don't mean homosexuals.

Of those two - the first does not say "as with a" woman, and can be read differently, and mentions MOLECH worship, Sacred Sex, at the top, and the other which also has no "as with a," - is surrounded by text that tells us it is MOLECH worship - Sacred Sex.

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[lostwanderingsoul]

Leviticus 18:21 says that you shall not let your seed pass through the fire to Molech. Verse 22 says you shall also not lie with mankind as with womankind. You can read it any way you want to but the meaning is clear. Sex between men is an abomination to God. The only people who see a different interpretation are those who are looking for a way to say homosexuality is acceptable.

 

[Riverwolf]

Leviticus 18:21 says that you shall not let your seed pass through the fire to Molech. Verse 22 says you shall also not lie with mankind as with womankind. You can read it any way you want to but the meaning is clear. Sex between men is an abomination to God. The only people who see a different interpretation are those who are looking for a way to say homosexuality is acceptable.

It's acceptable for the rest of us regardless of what that verse is trying to say, because we're not bound to it.

And it actually says this, by the way:

כב וְאֶת זָכָר לֹא תִשְׁכַּב מִשְׁכְּבֵי אִשָּׁה תּוֹעֵבָה הִוא:

 

[Ingledsva]

Leviticus 18:21 says that you shall not let your seed pass through the fire to Molech. Verse 22 says you shall also not lie with mankind as with womankind. You can read it any way you want to but the meaning is clear. Sex between men is an abomination to God. The only people who see a different interpretation are those who are looking for a way to say homosexuality is acceptable.

Look up 21 in the Hebrew. Sex-copulation - not fire.

Lev 18:21 as for Thy seed/semen don't give in sex/copulation (abar specifically to cover in copulation - Strong's) to Molech don't profane the name of Elohiym; I am YHVH.

The next line is usually started - and with man don't - however the word also means - and for man, don't. And there is NO - "as with a."

Lev 18:22 and for/with man don't lie down (mishkab) beds/intercourse woman (tô‛êbah) Idolatry/abomanation it is.

However, even if you left it as usually TRANSLATED - it is still Sacred Prostitution - not homosexuality.

The next line continues on with the things we know they did in Molech worship.

Lev 18:23 And you shall not give your semen with any animal, for uncleanness with it. And a woman shall not stand before an animal to lie down with it; it is a shameful mixing.

With either translation of 22 - it is still talking about the Qadesh - Sacred Prostitutes of Molech.

Lev 18:30 confirms it is Temple Sex IDOLATRY - by adding -

Lev 18:30 Therefore shall ye keep mine ordinance, that ye commit not any one of these abominable customs, which were committed before you, and that ye defile not yourselves therein: I am the LORD your God.

That word translated "customs" is chuqqah - STATUTES/LAWS/RITES

Lev 18:5 Ye shall therefore keep my statutes/chuqqah, and my judgments: which if a man do, he shall live in them: I am the LORD.

Num 9:3 In the fourteenth day of this month, at even, ye shall keep it in his appointed season: according to all the rites/chuqqah of it, and according to all the ceremonies thereof, shall ye keep it.

Homosexuality is not a LAW-STATUTE-RITE, etc, that they PRACTICED BEFORE!!!!!

However Sacred Sex with the Qedeshah and Qadesh WAS!!!

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[lostwanderingsoul]

I find it interesting that your own translation of Lev 18:30 shows God telling His followers to follow His rules and not follow the abominable practices that others followed before. Those included sex between men, sex with animals and sex with close relatives. Not one word about sacred sex or prostitutes. So what are your thoughts on sex with animals? Maybe some people are born with a trait that makes them attracted to animals. Would you call that normal behavior?

 

[Riverwolf]

I find it interesting that your own translation of Lev 18:30 shows God telling His followers to follow His rules and not follow the abominable practices that others followed before. Those included sex between men, sex with animals and sex with close relatives. Not one word about sacred sex or prostitutes.

Do you know what context is?

So what are your thoughts on sex with animals? Maybe some people are born with a trait that makes them attracted to animals. Would you call that normal behavior?

"Normal" doesn't exist.

But at this time, it is impossible to establish clear consent when it comes to sex between a human and a non-human animal. If we can ever come up with some way to determine if consent has been given, then I will find it acceptible in those instances.

 

[Ingledsva]

I find it interesting that your own translation of Lev 18:30 shows God telling His followers to follow His rules and not follow the abominable practices that others followed before. Those included sex between men, sex with animals and sex with close relatives. Not one word about sacred sex or prostitutes. So what are your thoughts on sex with animals? Maybe some people are born with a trait that makes them attracted to animals. Would you call that normal behavior?

Pure BULL! 18:21 tells us it is sex to Molech!

All of these texts mention Molech worship, which IS Sacred Sex/Sacred Prostitutes, and/or Qadesh which are the Sacred Prostitutes.

These texts are telling us NOT to have sex with the Qadesh - because such is Sacred Sex with Sacred Prostitutes in worship of Molech, - which is IDOLATRY, - and worthy of death.

These texts very obviously have nothing to do with homosexuals.

Also - you seem to have missed that 18:30 actually says RITES!!!

Homosexuality is not a RITE.

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[lostwanderingsoul]

Lev 18:21 means not to offer your children as a sacrifice to Molech. And 18:30 says not to do any of these abominable things. Since you seem to approve of sex with animals ( when they give their consent ) then what about 18:20 which says not to have sex with your neighbor's wife. What if she gives consent? Then it is OK. If you were married would you want your husband to have sex with a neighbor and say it is OK because she agrees? It still looks like making excuses to do things that God says you should not do. By the way, I like your line, Do what is right and eventually it will circle around and bless you. But the problem is that we do not get to decide what is right. God has decided. Trying to interpret things to mean something different will not change God's laws. Ignorance of the law is no excuse. All who break the law will be caught and punished.

 

[Ingledsva]

Lev 18:21 means not to offer your children as a sacrifice to Molech. And 18:30 says not to do any of these abominable things. Since you seem to approve of sex with animals ( when they give their consent ) then what about 18:20 which says not to have sex with your neighbor's wife. What if she gives consent? Then it is OK. If you were married would you want your husband to have sex with a neighbor and say it is OK because she agrees? It still looks like making excuses to do things that God says you should not do. By the way, I like your line, Do what is right and eventually it will circle around and bless you. But the problem is that we do not get to decide what is right. God has decided. Trying to interpret things to mean something different will not change God's laws. Ignorance of the law is no excuse. All who break the law will be caught and punished.

LOOK up Lev 18:21 in the Hebrew - NO FIRE - in that text!!!!!!!

ABAR means specifically to cover in copulation = sex.

Lev 18:21 as for Thy seed/semen don't give in sex/copulation (abar specifically to cover in copulation - Strong's) to Molech don't profane the name of Elohiym; I am YHVH.

You are hilarious, - how do I approve of sex with animals, - or sex with the neighbor's wife, - By pointing out that these texts are about Sacred Prostitution as Molech worship???

How did you jump to such a ridiculous conclusion?


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