religion unites...yeah right...

[Greyn]

Those are three monuments for three different things: Chaplains of WWI, Catholic chaplains and Protestant Chaplains, not the Four Chaplains.

"There are about 255 chaplains who died in active service; 242 of them are memorialized on Chaplains Hill. From my perspective that's wrong," he said.

Indeed it is wrong for the Jewish community to take so long to honor their veterans.

 

[waitasec]

Those are three monuments for three different things: Chaplains of WWI, Catholic chaplains and Protestant Chaplains, not the Four Chaplains.

the article is a lie, is that you are saying?

read...

"Amid the chaos, survivors later recalled, four U.S. Army chaplains fought to bring calm and comfort, praying for the dead and encouraging the living to fight for survival. They helped frightened servicemen find life jackets and head to rescue craft. Each of the four chaplains gave up his life jacket to save the life of another.

All four stayed on the ship's new course to the bottom of the ocean and gave their lives so others might live. The last thing survivors saw of the four chaplains, they were huddled together praying.

Lt. George Fox, a Methodist chaplain; Lt. John Washington, a Roman Catholic chaplain; and Lt. Clark Poling, a Dutch Reformed chaplain, are each memorialized on Chaplains Hill at Arlington National Cemetery on monuments honoring the service of Protestant and Catholic chaplains killed in the line of duty."

 

[Greyn]

the article is a lie, is that you are saying?

read...

"Amid the chaos, survivors later recalled, four U.S. Army chaplains fought to bring calm and comfort, praying for the dead and encouraging the living to fight for survival. They helped frightened servicemen find life jackets and head to rescue craft. Each of the four chaplains gave up his life jacket to save the life of another.

All four stayed on the ship's new course to the bottom of the ocean and gave their lives so others might live. The last thing survivors saw of the four chaplains, they were huddled together praying.

Lt. George Fox, a Methodist chaplain; Lt. John Washington, a Roman Catholic chaplain; and Lt. Clark Poling, a Dutch Reformed chaplain, are each memorialized on Chaplains Hill at Arlington National Cemetery on monuments honoring the service of Protestant and Catholic chaplains killed in the line of duty."

I am not saying the article is a lie. I do agree that (just like Kathryn and your quote says) their respective churches honored their Chaplains. The only religious group that did not was the Jewish community. That is until now...a long time coming, imo.

 

[waitasec]

Indeed it is wrong for the Jewish community to take so long to honor their veterans.

it's a given that all those who fought and died be remembered...
is this something you are going to blame the jewish community for...

 

[Greyn]

Okay, before you get yourself all worked and start calling me anti-Semitic, the memorials in Arlington are funded by private groups. Those groups typically are related in some way to the people they are memorializing.

So, do you think some other group than the Jewish community should honor the Rabbis that died in action?

 

[waitasec]

Okay, before you get yourself all worked and start calling me anti-Semitic, the memorials in Arlington are funded by private groups. Those groups typically are related in some way to the people they are memorializing.

So, do you think some other group than the Jewish community should honor the Rabbis that died in action?

it's a national cemetery...
are you implying that in order to be remembered for dying for your country you need $$?

nice.

 

[Greyn]

it's a national cemetery...
are you implying that in order to be remembered for dying for your country you need $$?

nice.

I appreciate your concern for veterans, but your ignorance of Arlington cemetery (or any veteran's cemetery) is undermining your argument. The rabbi can be buried and have a headstone in the cemetery that bears their personal faith (as shown in Kathryn's post). To have a specific memorial beyond that for a group of people, it needs to be approved by Congress and funded by an organization.

Please re-read Kathryn's post, it is really all in there.

 

[waitasec]

I appreciate your concern for veterans, but your ignorance of Arlington cemetery (or any veteran's cemetery) is undermining your argument. The rabbi can be buried and have a headstone in the cemetery that bears their personal faith (as shown in Kathryn's post). To have a specific memorial beyond that for a group of people, it needs to be approved by Congress and funded by an organization.

Please re-read Kathryn's post, it is really all in there.

so in other words yes $$$ talks and ********** walks.

it is my understanding that common decency would have all of their names on that hill...but at the end of the day he was a rabbi and was excluded...that's the ugly truth...
you can put a lipstick on a pig..but it's still a pig

 

[Greyn]

You still didn't answer my question, so I will ask it again in a different way. Should the 13 rabbis that died in action be placed on the Catholic, Protestant or WWI (no rabbis died in WWI) memorial?

 

[waitasec]

I appreciate your concern for veterans, but your ignorance of Arlington cemetery (or any veteran's cemetery) is undermining your argument. The rabbi can be buried and have a headstone in the cemetery that bears their personal faith (as shown in Kathryn's post). To have a specific memorial beyond that for a group of people, it needs to be approved by Congress and funded by an organization.

Please re-read Kathryn's post, it is really all in there.

and...
you are also forgetting the argument of the OP...
religion divides...if each religion has to fend for themselves as far as remembering those who have fought and died in a national cemetery...backs up my claim that religion divides not unites.
:slap:

 

[waitasec]

You still didn't answer my question, so I will ask it again in a different way. Should the 13 rabbis that died in action be placed on the Catholic, Protestant or WWI (no rabbis died in WWI) memorial?

yes if you claim that religion unites...

 

[Greyn]

yes if you claim that religion unites...

That does not answer my question. Are you trying to say that because they were religious men, then they should be on all the memorials?

 

[waitasec]

That does not answer my question. Are you trying to say that because they were religious men, then they should be on all the memorials?

Should the 13 rabbis that died in action be placed on the Catholic, Protestant or WWI (no rabbis died in WWI) memorial?

yes...if you believe religion unites...where did i imply all the memorials?

 

[Greyn]

I really am having a hard time understanding your point. You believe the Rabbis should be on the Catholic and Protestant and a memorial that they didn't not have any connection to just because religion has the ability to bring people together?

Please explain your reasoning.

 

[waitasec]

I really am having a hard time understanding your point. You believe the Rabbis should be on the Catholic and Protestant and a memorial that they didn't not have any connection to just because religion has the ability to bring people together?

Please explain your reasoning.

the entire point of creating this thread is to show how religion divides people...
do you agree or not?

 

[Greyn]

the entire point of creating this thread is to show how religion divides people...
do you agree or not?

Ah I see, I do believe religions can drive people apart. But, I do not think the memorial for the Rabbis is an example of this possible division.

I also believe religion can create bridges bringing people together (just like here on this thread).

 

[waitasec]

Ah I see, I do believe religions can drive people apart. But, I do not think the memorial for the Rabbis is an example of this possible division.

i think you missed this post...

and...
you are also forgetting the argument of the OP...
religion divides...if each religion has to fend for themselves as far as remembering those who have fought and died in a national cemetery...backs up my claim that religion divides not unites.
:slap:

I also believe religion can create bridges bringing people together (just like here on this thread).

and i wouldn't say religion is what brought people together on this thread...
the attraction to a lively discourse is the culprit...

 

[Greyn]

And I think you missed this post...

The rabbi can be buried and have a headstone in the cemetery that bears their personal faith (as shown in Kathryn's post). To have a specific memorial beyond that for a group of people, it needs to be approved by Congress and funded by an organization.

Being a rabbi with the military was his chosen profession. He was more then that to the military and country. But, he still gets the same honor as any soldier or sailor receives. If an outside group wants to do something more, there are avenues to pursue those endeavors.

You seem to think a third party (Catholic/Protestant churches or veterans groups) should have included them with their organizations memorial. I disagree and it has nothing to do with religion. I believe the Jewish community is completely capable of erecting a special memorial for the rabbis.

 

[waitasec]

You seem to think a third party (Catholic/Protestant/jewish/muslim/hindu etc... ) should have included them with their organizations memorial. I disagree and it has nothing to do with religion. I believe the Jewish community is completely capable of erecting a special memorial for the rabbis.

see what i mean?

 

[Greyn]

see what i mean?

not really...

Any religion represented by the Chaplin Corp should be given the opportunity to honor their representative's sacrifice...if they desire to do that. Remember, memorials are for the living, not the dead.