RF gender poll

[Mindmaster]

So I look up the definition of male. And I love the internet!


of or denoting the sex that produces small, typically motile gametes, especially spermatozoa, with which a female may be fertilized or inseminated to produce offspring.

And female. of or denoting the sex that can bear offspring or produce eggs, distinguished biologically by the production of gametes (ova) that can be fertilized by male gametes.

So real non-binary can mean the body can do both or neither. Or maybe it means the person does not want to do either.

I did not want to be pregnant. It happens with sex. I don't talk about sex. Not that I don't want to. It's this planet's status quo and it is annoying.

Apparently, this definition does not include boobs. That is a critical problem.

 

[Brian Schuh]

That I'm a a failure as a man on all counts?

Oh hell, look once you live up to being a real man, then to keep your manhood, you hear more of (a real man . . .) and ( if you . . ., then you are not a real man) and people make it up as they go.

By the way, there is nothing a female must do to prove she is a real woman.

But the criteria to be a real man never ends and is made up as you go.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

By the way, there is nothing a female must do to prove she is a real woman.
But the criteria to be a real man never ends and is made up as you go.

 

[Brian Schuh]

Gender identity and gender roles are two independent variables. For example men in women's role, women in men's role, women in women's role and men in men's role. And gender roles change from culture to culture and generation to generation.

At one time, before WWI, women in the workforce had to be school teachers or nurses or similar jobs. Women were full time wives, mothers and homemakers.

I don't live up to a man's role in society by any standard. A nurse asked me if I'd rather be a woman. I said, "if I don't make a good man as a man, I probably would make an even worse woman."

But there is nothing a female or transgender has to do to prove they are a woman. But the demands made on a male to prove he is a man, never end. "If you are not a super man, then you are not a real man."

 

[Rival]

"Change your vote"

???

 

[Brian Schuh]

"Change your vote"

???

No, as long as I have a y- chromosome, I am a male. Even if I lose my genitals to cancer, and take enough estrogen to grow breasts, I am still a male. No matter what, I am a male. Nothing can change that short of reincarnation into a new body.

 

[beenherebeforeagain]

Growing up, I read Everything You Always Wanted to Know About Sex But Were Afraid to Ask (the parents conveniently had a copy they left around the house), Kinsey (our public library had copies of various reports and I knew how to find them), and Playboy (Friends' parents subscribed and we'd read them). Through these sources I learned a term that applied/s to men who are interested in/have relationships with both women and other men, and it also applies to women who do the same: bisexual. I understood the term because it applied/s to me, even though I have never acted on the attraction to men.

I also learned early on that most people being primarily or entirely hetero/straight by birth and enculturation, don't understand other categories, and so generalize bisexual and gay--and maybe even asexual--men into the same group, etc. While I don't seem to be able to keep up with all the nuanced differences in categories today, I really don't have a problem with understanding that the categories/differences/similarities are important to some people...in both positive and negative aspects. Growing up male in my community, you didn't want to be identified as non-straight, because that often came with ostracism and even violence. But fortunately, our society has changed a great deal since my teenage years. It still needs to change more, in my opinion.

 

[Smart_Guy]

Ehhm...

Boys win!

 

[beenherebeforeagain]

Gender identity and gender roles are two independent variables. For example men in women's role, women in men's role, women in women's role and men in men's role. And gender roles change from culture to culture and generation to generation.

At one time, before WWI, women in the workforce had to be school teachers or nurses or similar jobs. Women were full time wives, mothers and homemakers.

I don't live up to a man's role in society by any standard. A nurse asked me if I'd rather be a woman. I said, "if I don't make a good man as a man, I probably would make an even worse woman."

But there is nothing a female or transgender has to do to prove they are a woman. But the demands made on a male to prove he is a man, never end. "If you are not a super man, then you are not a real man."

Uh, to many males, a "butch" woman has to prove she's a woman by being attracted to men...growing up in Central Illinois, not being a "normal" (hetero) girly girl was just as big a problem as a boy not being a (hetero) manly man.

 

[Brian Schuh]

Uh, to many males, a "butch" woman has to prove she's a woman by being attracted to men...growing up in Central Illinois, not being a "normal" (hetero) girly girl was just as big a problem as a boy not being a (hetero) manly man.

A butch female doesn't prove she is a woman by an attraction to males, she just proves she has opposite sex attraction. Doesn't prove that she doesn't also have same sex attraction.

A feminine man, same thing.

Look at the very few matriarchal societies. Gender roles are reversed. Doesn't have any effect on gender identity or sexual orientation. Men still know they are men and still have attraction to women, they just live out a gender role we would see as a woman's.

 

[Revoltingest]

Growing up, I read Everything You Always Wanted to Know About Sex But Were Afraid to Ask

I skipped the book, & just watched the movie.

 

[Brian Schuh]

I know of a rabbi whose wife works and brings home the bacon. Just joking, they don't eat bacon, you get the point. He takes care of their small children and is the homemaker. In Judaism, Torah study is only for men. So besides being a homemaker, his full time job is study of Torah and that is how he keeps his "manhood." It is very manly to study Torah. Every Jewish girl (generalization here) wants to marry a Torah scholar. So gender roles are independent of gender identity and sexual orientation.

 

[beenherebeforeagain]

A butch female doesn't prove she is a woman by an attraction to males, she just proves she has opposite sex attraction. Doesn't prove that she doesn't also have same sex attraction.

A feminine man, same thing.

Let me rephrase that: growing up in Central Illinois in the 1970s, it was not acceptable--primarily to hetero males, and to a lesser extent, hetero females (or those who wished to not be ostricized and regularly verbally and/or physically abused)--for males to appear to be anything except hetero males, and females to be anything except hetero females. To prove she wasn't a lesbian pervert (and thus be subject to abuse), a butch woman was expected to date men, etc., regardless if she was hetero or lesbian or bisexual or whatever. An "unmanly" man was still expected to display interest in women and not in men--or face verbal and physical abuse from others. The term "heteronormal" very definitely applied to gender and sexual relationships.

 

[beenherebeforeagain]

I skipped the book, & just watched the movie.

I read the book before the movie came out; the movie was much better, and more informative...

 

[Revoltingest]

I read the book before the movie came out; the movie was much better, and more informative...

Yes, Woody Allen is a gifted documentarian.

 

[YmirGF]

What exactly does 'non binary' mean? :I

I, my larger identity, has male and female aspects but is actually well beyond such narrow considerations. My current physical body is clearly and happily male.

 

[Brian Schuh]

I, my larger identity, has male and female aspects but is actually well beyond such narrow considerations. My current physical body is clearly and happily male.

A friend of mine who has passed on, was a tough attorney, a dominant male. One time he told a church gathering, "I like my feminine side, but I hide it, because I'm afraid you might like it too."

 

[1137]

I have all male anatomy, so looks like I'm male.

 

[Deidre]

I'm female.

 

[Smart_Guy]

Okay, who wants to make a bet? Boys or girls will win?