SAT adversity score

[Enoch07]

successfully score high on a test or not. Nowhere in the articles I've read mentioned race.

You must have missed post #1 then.

Here's the story: SAT to Give Students ‘Adversity Score’ to Capture Social and Economic Background

View attachment 29107

These new "adversity scores" are only used by colleges while reviewing students applications.

A prime example of the racism of low expectations - Wiktionary.

Why is this not treated as the racism that it is?

See the chart that has the SAT scores and the adjusted values? It's from the article I cited. It shows by ethnicity not poverty levels etc. Now If you are saying they did this to generalize that this chart list by ethnicity is a representation of socio economic hardship etc. That is in itself racist. Which is my point. People intelligence is not ruled by their ethnicity, this is race realism a.k.a. Scientific racism - Wikipedia.

 

[Sapiens]

I often wonder what admissions officers are looking for, is it:

1. Students most likely to earn a degree.
2. Students most likely to contribute to society.
3. Students most likely to go on to graduate or professional school (kind of a selective and limiting combination of 1 and 2).
4. Students most likely to make a contribution to bettering other students education.
6. Other?

 

[Daemon Sophic]

You must have missed post #1 then.



See the chart that has the SAT scores and the adjusted values? It's from the article I cited. It shows by ethnicity not poverty levels etc. Now If you are saying they did this to generalize that this chart list by ethnicity is a representation of socio economic hardship etc. That is in itself racist. Which is my point. People intelligence is not ruled by their ethnicity, this is race realism a.k.a. Scientific racism - Wikipedia.

Two things. First, as I noted, most of us cannot open the Wall Street Journal article without paying the Wall Street Journal fees.

Second that chart you copied into the OP is a discussion of what we classically see in the community with Asians and whites having the highest scores; but it is not a reflection of how the new adversity score will influence the SAT scores.
For that, please see my post #36 from the Atlantic (free access), and the particular quote I took out of it, discussing how Race is purposely and specifically kept out of the adversity scoring system.

 

[Shad]

See the chart that has the SAT scores and the adjusted values? It's from the article I cited. It shows by ethnicity not poverty levels etc

There is a paywall most of us can not bypass. It become hard to compared the two links you provided when I can only read a few sentences of the WSJ.

 

[Woberts]

If you think that this is racist, then you're probably the racist one. Simple.

 

[Enoch07]

Second that chart you copied into the OP is a discussion of what we classically see in the community with Asians and whites having the highest scores; but it is not a reflection of how the new adversity score will influence the SAT scores.

Still stinks of racism to me.

 

[Shad]

Still stinks of racism to me.

It has the possibility if scores were radically different based on race when social and economic situations are similar. Maybe if demographics were only looks at as a generalization instead of linked to the individual in question. This is why transparency is an issue. We may not know until someone becomes a whistle-blower like the last time racial bias became a factor.

Toss in the fact the rich have been continuously exposed rigging the system there are questions regarding universities holding to economic standards in the first place. Toss in legacy students as well.

Mindy Kaling's brother 'pretended to be black' to get into medical school

 

[Enoch07]

If you think that this is racist, then you're probably the racist one. Simple.

So you think that all African Americans and Hispanics need your help by increasing their SAT scores so that they can get into better colleges?

 

[Epic Beard Man]

You must have missed post #1 then.



See the chart that has the SAT scores and the adjusted values? It's from the article I cited. It shows by ethnicity not poverty levels etc. Now If you are saying they did this to generalize that this chart list by ethnicity is a representation of socio economic hardship etc. That is in itself racist. Which is my point. People intelligence is not ruled by their ethnicity, this is race realism a.k.a. Scientific racism - Wikipedia.

I looked at your source and unfortunately I cannot read the entire article because I need to pay for a subscription. Because I do not read the Wall Street Journal it would be a waste even for $1 to pay for a subscription just to respond to you here.Seeing how you got the chart off the WSJ website can you post the entire article minus the chart so I can verify your source?

 

[Epic Beard Man]

@Enoch07 You also never answered my question. Have you ever attended college?

 

[Epic Beard Man]

I often wonder what admissions officers are looking for, is it:

1. Students most likely to earn a degree.
2. Students most likely to contribute to society.
3. Students most likely to go on to graduate or professional school (kind of a selective and limiting combination of 1 and 2).
4. Students most likely to make a contribution to bettering other students education.
6. Other?

"The goal is to find students who have transcended their environments by examining factors that are correlated, according to research, with lower academic achievement and lower lifetime earnings.
Some of the neighborhood factors are: median family income, percentage of households in poverty, percentage of single-parent households, percentage of vacant housing units, percentage of adults without a high school degree, percentage of adults without a college degree, percentage of adults with agriculture jobs and the unemployment and crime rates.

The school social measures look at a similar list of factors across all the census tracts of the students in the applicant’s school. The rating system potentially benefits gentrifiers on neighborhood factors, but its two-pronged approach balances that to some degree by also looking at a student’s school. Many middle-class and affluent parents living in poor neighborhoods do not send their children to local schools alongside low-income peers."

Source:Your Questions about the New Adversity Score on the SAT, Answered

Unlike the OP who most likely has never attended college much less taken the SAT, ACT, MCAT, LSAT, GMAT, GRE or any other test college students (or post-bac) or potential students take that requires intellectual fortitude. This isn't about race but looking at extraneous factors which may factor in a student's ability to succeed.

Now in looking at what schools look for as far as admissions processes go, it depends on the university itself. When it comes to Junior Colleges admissions process is not strenuous, but when it comes to four-year universities its a different story. It is even strenuous when you apply to graduate school as some admissions processes want you to write a personal statement in APA format. What schools are looking for in a student vary but what they all have in common is they want a student that is well rounded.

 

[Sapiens]

"The goal is to find students who have transcended their environments by examining factors that are correlated, according to research, with lower academic achievement and lower lifetime earnings.
Some of the neighborhood factors are: median family income, percentage of households in poverty, percentage of single-parent households, percentage of vacant housing units, percentage of adults without a high school degree, percentage of adults without a college degree, percentage of adults with agriculture jobs and the unemployment and crime rates.

The school social measures look at a similar list of factors across all the census tracts of the students in the applicant’s school. The rating system potentially benefits gentrifiers on neighborhood factors, but its two-pronged approach balances that to some degree by also looking at a student’s school. Many middle-class and affluent parents living in poor neighborhoods do not send their children to local schools alongside low-income peers."

Source:Your Questions about the New Adversity Score on the SAT, Answered

Unlike the OP who most likely has never attended college much less taken the SAT, ACT, MCAT, LSAT, GMAT, GRE or any other test college students (or post-bac) or potential students take that requires intellectual fortitude. This isn't about race but looking at extraneous factors which may factor in a student's ability to succeed.

Now in looking at what schools look for as far as admissions processes go, it depends on the university itself. When it comes to Junior Colleges admissions process is not strenuous, but when it comes to four-year universities its a different story. It is even strenuous when you apply to graduate school as some admissions processes want you to write a personal statement in APA format. What schools are looking for in a student vary but what they all have in common is they want a student that is well rounded.

That does not answer my question, though it outlines some real issues, I repeat: what is it that admissions officers are looking for? I get the adverse and transcendent issues, I am asking a more basic and initial question.

 

[Watchmen]

Maybe the WSJ should have an adversity score so others can access it since so many here complain of the paywall.

 

[Epic Beard Man]

what is it that admissions officers are looking for?

Sorry I was trying to give you an overall perspective on the issue, using that as a segway to the question I was going to address for you. Now to answer your question in addition to what I've already addressed in my last post to you, is that most university undergraduate admissions look for is a student that the school knows that they'll thrive at their institution. Now what those details entails depends on the institutions which is why a lot of universities want a personal statement on why you want to attend their university, your intended goals, and what you plan to do once you succeed in graduating (of course they will ask specific questions but this is just the gist of what they're talking about). For example my school University of Southern California has their own requirements see here

You'll also find an ethnic breakdown as well. You'll find that on an undergraduate level we have a 13% admission rate for fall of last year. I sometimes wonder how I got in myself considering that I didn't have the best letters of recommendation for the masters program.

 

[David1967]

I agree with the part of this article where it says that this sounds like a Saturday night live skit. The article says that
"Asian-Americans are currently suing Harvard University for discriminatory admissions policies. The Heritage Foundation’s Mike Gonzalez has noted that Harvard’s own reports reveal that “Only considering academics in the admissions process would raise the proportion of the Asian American students admitted to Harvard from 18.7 percent to 43.4 percent.”

Here are my thoughts on this. If the Asian American kids bust their behinds studying hard and through hard work achieve such a high admission number then good for them. Hard work should be rewarded, not punished. This is sickening. Can you imagine being passed over for admission even though you scored extremely high due to this diversity BS?

SAT ‘adversity score’ isn’t what America is about

 

[David1967]

So you think that all African Americans and Hispanics need your help by increasing their SAT scores so that they can get into better colleges?

I think that in itself is racist. Saying that without artificially increasing their scores they are not capable of competing? That to me is racist.

 

[Sapiens]

Sorry I was trying to give you an overall perspective on the issue, using that as a segway to the question I was going to address for you. Now to answer your question in addition to what I've already addressed in my last post to you, is that most university undergraduate admissions look for is a student that the school knows that they'll thrive at their institution. Now what those details entails depends on the institutions which is why a lot of universities want a personal statement on why you want to attend their university, your intended goals, and what you plan to do once you succeed in graduating (of course they will ask specific questions but this is just the gist of what they're talking about). For example my school University of Southern California has their own requirements see here

You'll also find an ethnic breakdown as well. You'll find that on an undergraduate level we have a 13% admission rate for fall of last year. I sometimes wonder how I got in myself considering that I didn't have the best letters of recommendation for the masters program.

I am an academic. I got into grad school as 1 of 18 out of 1,840 applicants. I have no idea of why anyone got in or was rejected ... it seemed pretty arbitrary. Years later I asked someone who was on the admission committee and he said that he voted for me, in the final analysis, since all the finalists were more than qualified, because I lived in the area and he really liked my dog.

Please define "thrive" in the sense of the criteria I used:
1. Students most likely to earn a degree.
2. Students most likely to contribute to society.
3. Students most likely to go on to graduate or professional school (kind of a selective and limiting combination of 1 and 2).
4. Students most likely to make a contribution to bettering other students' education.
6. Other?

 

[Epic Beard Man]

I am an academic.

Interesting, what program? Did you finish? I'm asking out of curiosity. Congratulations by the way.

I have no idea of why anyone got in or was rejected

Admissions committee keeps that private to the student.

Years later I asked someone who was on the admission committee and he said that he voted for me, in the final analysis, since all the finalists were more than qualified, because I lived in the area and he really liked my dog.

So based on what you said in the above you never got in? i'm sorry to hear that.

Please define "thrive" in the sense of the criteria I used:

1. Students most likely to earn a degree.

In this context students who can exhibit an intellectual ability to succeed and complete difficult course work and maintain a grade point average reflective of above average scholarship. These students in this context most likely will succeed and earn a degree.

2. Students most likely to contribute to society.

Not sure how "thrive" could fit in this context, but I guess you can say that through successful scholarship, the most successful student is one who can learn, maintain and exhibit integrity, grit, innovation, and implementation of the learn academic skills sets they've acquired.

3. Students most likely to go on to graduate or professional school (kind of a selective and limiting combination of 1 and 2).

My answers for 1 and 2 apply here as well.

4. Students most likely to make a contribution to bettering other students' education.

See answers for 1 and 2.

6. Other?

Can't think of anything else at this moment....

I'm surprised for someone who is an academic, prior to application there is a set criterion for graduate school that certain universities look for. I don't know about you but most graduate students apply to over 50 different schools for the program they intend to go in. Usually because of this you'd have a healthy understanding what the admissions process is, and look for not sure why you want to know considering you admitted to have went through this process yourself.

 

[AsianActivist]

This is not a race issue, it's more of an income issue. In other words it's what the conservatives have been demanding all these years but when people finally put it into practice those same conservatives are up in arms:

SAT will assign a new score that factors in where you live and the crime level in your neighborhood - CNN

The score takes into account information from the student's background, but it does not include race.

Let's write that again in case you didn't read it the first time.

The score takes into account information from the student's background, but it does not include race.

And again:

The score takes into account information from the student's background, but it does not include race.[/f

Instead, it focuses on factors like their high school's average senior class size, percentage of students eligible for free and reduce lunches and academic achievement in Advanced Placement classes.

A student's environment at home and in his or her neighborhood, like the crime level, the median family income and family stability, will be factors as well.

Colleges will be able to see the number when considering applicants, but students themselves won't be told their scores.

On the plus side this will also significantly hamper attempts by East Asian foreign students (particularly Chinese and Korean) to cheat their way into US colleges.

 

[Epic Beard Man]

@Enoch07 See? There you go, you have an Asian with a different opinion.