Science cannot solve the final mystery

[Milton Platt]

Biology is certainly not a choice but sexual orientation absolutely is. Otherwise you wouldn't have people choose to go back to being cisgender or heterosexual.

When did you decide to be straight???

 

[Maximilian]

Such people do not exist.

This biography here proves otherwise-

"I grew up in Avaré, a quiet little town in the state of São Paulo. Its residents are mainly of the working class.

My father died while my mother was expecting me. As a young boy, I dressed in my mother’s clothes while she was out. I adopted feminine mannerisms, and people started to view me as gay. In time, I began having sex with other boys and men.

By the time I reached my late teens, I was actively seeking sexual partners (both male and female) wherever I could find them—in bars, nightclubs, and even churches. At carnival time, I would dress as a woman and dance in samba-school parades. I was very popular.

Among my friends were gays, prostitutes, and drug addicts. Some of them influenced me to try crack cocaine, and soon I was hooked. Sometimes we smoked all night long. At other times, I would isolate myself and spend the entire day smoking crack. I became so emaciated that a rumor went around that I had AIDS.

HOW THE BIBLE CHANGED MY LIFE: About this time, I came in contact with Jehovah’s Witnesses. They were very kind to me. One of the Bible verses they read to me was Romans 10:13, which says: “Everyone who calls on the name of Jehovah will be saved.” Those words impressed on me the importance of using Jehovah’s name. Many times, after having smoked crack cocaine all night long, I would open the window, look up to heaven, and pray to Jehovah in tears, begging him to help me.

Worried about my anguished mother, who suffered deeply as she watched me destroy myself with drugs, I made up my mind to stop taking them. Soon after that, I accepted the Witnesses’ offer of a Bible study. They assured me that the study would strengthen my resolve to quit drugs—and it did!

As I continued studying the Bible, I realized that I needed to change my lifestyle. It was especially difficult to abandon my homosexual practices, as these had been a part of me for as long as I could remember. One thing that helped, though, was changing my environment. I ended my old friendships and stopped going to bars and nightclubs.

Although it was not easy to make these changes, I found comfort in learning that Jehovah cared for me and that he understood my struggle. (1 John 3:19, 20) By 2002, I had stopped all homosexual practices, and in that year I was baptized as one of Jehovah’s Witnesses."

 

[Darkstorn]

God has never given anyone ASD, if that's what you're suggesting. In fact, God is absolutely not responsible for any genetic disorder/disability anyone has ever been born with.

Then it looks like your god isn't really responsible for anything. This is one of those all or nothing type of things. It either looks like he's responsible for everything or nothing.

Glad you agree with the atheists: They don't think your god is responsible for genetic disorders either!

 

[Darkstorn]

This biography here proves otherwise-

It only proves that a guy said all that. Here: My biography says that you're wrong. I said it, therefore it's proven.

Using your methodology.

 

[Maximilian]

Such people do not exist.

Here's another biography which shows this just isn't true-

"I was one of seven children, brought up in Hermosillo, in Sonora, Mexico, an area afflicted with much poverty. My father died when I was a little boy, so my mother had to work to support us. I usually went barefoot because we had no money to buy shoes. While still young, I started working to help with the family’s expenses. Like many families, we lived crowded together.

For most of the day, my mother was not around to protect us children. When I was 6 years old, I fell victim to a 15-year-old who began to abuse me sexually. This abuse continued for a long time. One result was that I became very confused sexually. I thought it was normal to feel attracted to men. When I sought the help of doctors or clergymen, they assured me that I had no problem and that my feelings were normal.

When I was 14, I made the decision to present myself to the world as a homosexual. I stayed that way for the next 11 years, even living with several different men during that time. Eventually, I took a course to become a hair stylist and ran a beauty shop. However, I was unhappy. I led a life of suffering and betrayal. I sensed that what I was doing was not right. I started to ask myself, ‘Are there any good and worthwhile people?’

I thought of my sister. She began studying the Bible with Jehovah’s Witnesses and eventually got baptized. She would tell me what she was learning, but I paid no attention. Still, I admired her for her life and her marriage. I could see that she and her husband really loved and respected each other. They treated each other with kindness. In time, one of Jehovah’s Witnesses began to study the Bible with me. At first, I just went along with it—without enthusiasm. Then things changed.

HOW THE BIBLE CHANGED MY LIFE: The Witnesses invited me to one of their meetings, and I went. It was a new experience for me. People in general made fun of me but not the Witnesses. They greeted me kindly, and they treated me with dignity. I was moved.

My good impression of the Witnesses deepened when I attended an assembly. I saw that even in large groups, these people were like my sister—genuine and sincere. I asked myself if this might be the group of good and worthwhile people whom I had long been seeking. Their love and unity amazed me, as did their use of the Bible to answer every question. I realized that it was the Bible that was the force for good in their lives. And I saw, too, that I would have to make many changes to become one of them.

In fact, I had to undergo a complete metamorphosis, for I was living a feminine life. My speech, mannerisms, clothing, hairstyle, and choice of friends all needed changing. My former friends began to mock me, saying: “Why are you doing this? You were fine as you were. Don’t study the Bible. You have everything.” The most difficult things to change, though, were the practices of my immoral lifestyle.

Still, I knew that great changes were possible, for the Bible’s words at 1 Corinthians 6:9-11 had reached my heart: “What! Do you not know that unrighteous persons will not inherit God’s kingdom? Do not be misled. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men kept for unnatural purposes, nor men who lie with men . . . will inherit God’s kingdom. And yet that is what some of you were. But you have been washed clean.” Jehovah helped people back then to make changes, and he helped me too. It took several years and a good deal of struggling, but the guidance and love of the Witnesses helped me a great deal.

HOW I HAVE BENEFITED: Today, I lead a normal life. I am married, and my wife and I are teaching our son to live by Bible principles. My former life is far behind me now, and I enjoy many spiritual benefits and privileges. I serve as an elder in the congregation, and I have been able to help others to learn the truth of God’s Word. The changes I made in my life made my mother so happy that she accepted a Bible study and has since become a baptized Christian. A sister of mine who led an immoral life also became one of Jehovah’s Witnesses.

Even some of the people who knew me in my former life now recognize that I have changed for the better. And I know what has been behind those changes. In the past I sought professional help but received only bad advice. However, Jehovah truly helped me. Although I felt unworthy, he noticed me and treated me with love and patience. The fact that such a wonderful, intelligent, loving God would take notice of me and want me to have a better life made all the difference."

 

[Darkstorn]

Here's another biography which shows this just isn't true-

I once heard a guy say the moon is made of cheese. Which is true.

That is the level of an unreliable eye witness.

 

[Maximilian]

Then it looks like your god isn't really responsible for anything. This is one of those all or nothing type of things. It either looks like he's responsible for everything or nothing.

What an odd thing to claim. If I may, do you have ASD?

 

[Darkstorn]

What an odd thing to claim. If I may, do you have ASD?

You may not. And I don't believe you when you say you don't have ASD.

Nice to know you advocate for a limited god, ability wise.

 

[Maximilian]

I once heard a guy say the moon is made of cheese. Which is true.

That is the level of an unreliable eye witness.

Then surely you can present actual research which clearly shows how sexual orientation is immutable, right?

 

[Maximilian]

You may not.

It's ok. I recognize that not everyone with ASD is comfortable talking about it

 

[Audie]

Here's another biography which shows this just isn't true-

"I was one of seven children, brought up in Hermosillo, in Sonora, Mexico, an area afflicted with much poverty. My father died when I was a little boy, so my mother had to work to support us. I usually went barefoot because we had no money to buy shoes. While still young, I started working to help with the family’s expenses. Like many families, we lived crowded together.

For most of the day, my mother was not around to protect us children. When I was 6 years old, I fell victim to a 15-year-old who began to abuse me sexually. This abuse continued for a long time. One result was that I became very confused sexually. I thought it was normal to feel attracted to men. When I sought the help of doctors or clergymen, they assured me that I had no problem and that my feelings were normal.

When I was 14, I made the decision to present myself to the world as a homosexual. I stayed that way for the next 11 years, even living with several different men during that time. Eventually, I took a course to become a hair stylist and ran a beauty shop. However, I was unhappy. I led a life of suffering and betrayal. I sensed that what I was doing was not right. I started to ask myself, ‘Are there any good and worthwhile people?’

I thought of my sister. She began studying the Bible with Jehovah’s Witnesses and eventually got baptized. She would tell me what she was learning, but I paid no attention. Still, I admired her for her life and her marriage. I could see that she and her husband really loved and respected each other. They treated each other with kindness. In time, one of Jehovah’s Witnesses began to study the Bible with me. At first, I just went along with it—without enthusiasm. Then things changed.

HOW THE BIBLE CHANGED MY LIFE: The Witnesses invited me to one of their meetings, and I went. It was a new experience for me. People in general made fun of me but not the Witnesses. They greeted me kindly, and they treated me with dignity. I was moved.

My good impression of the Witnesses deepened when I attended an assembly. I saw that even in large groups, these people were like my sister—genuine and sincere. I asked myself if this might be the group of good and worthwhile people whom I had long been seeking. Their love and unity amazed me, as did their use of the Bible to answer every question. I realized that it was the Bible that was the force for good in their lives. And I saw, too, that I would have to make many changes to become one of them.

In fact, I had to undergo a complete metamorphosis, for I was living a feminine life. My speech, mannerisms, clothing, hairstyle, and choice of friends all needed changing. My former friends began to mock me, saying: “Why are you doing this? You were fine as you were. Don’t study the Bible. You have everything.” The most difficult things to change, though, were the practices of my immoral lifestyle.

Still, I knew that great changes were possible, for the Bible’s words at 1 Corinthians 6:9-11 had reached my heart: “What! Do you not know that unrighteous persons will not inherit God’s kingdom? Do not be misled. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men kept for unnatural purposes, nor men who lie with men . . . will inherit God’s kingdom. And yet that is what some of you were. But you have been washed clean.” Jehovah helped people back then to make changes, and he helped me too. It took several years and a good deal of struggling, but the guidance and love of the Witnesses helped me a great deal.

HOW I HAVE BENEFITED: Today, I lead a normal life. I am married, and my wife and I are teaching our son to live by Bible principles. My former life is far behind me now, and I enjoy many spiritual benefits and privileges. I serve as an elder in the congregation, and I have been able to help others to learn the truth of God’s Word. The changes I made in my life made my mother so happy that she accepted a Bible study and has since become a baptized Christian. A sister of mine who led an immoral life also became one of Jehovah’s Witnesses.

Even some of the people who knew me in my former life now recognize that I have changed for the better. And I know what has been behind those changes. In the past I sought professional help but received only bad advice. However, Jehovah truly helped me. Although I felt unworthy, he noticed me and treated me with love and patience. The fact that such a wonderful, intelligent, loving God would take notice of me and want me to have a better life made all the difference."

Typical of the canned-to-order stories that just are not
true.

If nothing else gave it away, the writing style is just
not that of a poor Mexican peasant boy.

 

[Darkstorn]

Then surely you can present actual research which clearly shows how sexual orientation is immutable, right?

I don't need to. Neither of those people you quoted were homosexual. At best, bisexual. Homosexual practices don't make for a homosexual.

Other option: They are lying. Either to themselves or to everyone else.

Third option: Neither person exists. They are an invention by liars.

 

[Audie]

I don't need to. Neither of those people you quoted were homosexual. At best, bisexual. Homosexual practices don't make for a homosexual.

Other option: They are lying. Either to themselves or to everyone else.

Third option: Neither person exists. They are an invention by liars.

As I said, i it reads like a fake. At the very best,
the "Mexican" kid story MIGHT be an "as told to"
and then ghost written.

Most likely it is just some hack, who concocted it
as one might a parable of how things "ought" to be.

Jesus did it, why not?

 

[Darkstorn]

It's ok. I recognize that not everyone with ASD is comfortable talking about it

I am. Very comfortable.

I just think there's nothing for me to gain when the only point it relates to is that you're here to convert people into your little JW cult.

 

[Maximilian]

Okay. I was under the impression he was in total control. so thing can happen that he has no control over. Sort of a "limited" god.

That's a curious conclusion you've jumped to. If I may, do you have ASD?

 

[Maximilian]

When did you decide to be straight???

Thankfully, I've never been sexually abused so the issue has never come up.

 

[Maximilian]

Typical of the canned-to-order stories that just are not
true.

If nothing else gave it away, the writing style is just
not that of a poor Mexican peasant boy.

In your opinion.

 

[Milton Platt]

Thankfully, I've never been sexually abused so the issue has never come up.

Sexual abuse has nothing to do with it. I have a friend who was sexually abused as a child. Why isn't she a lesbian? I have a brother-in-law who is gay. He wasn't sexually abused.

So your sexuality wasn't a choice? I thought you just said sexuality was a choice??? You need to make up your mind. Which is it?

First, people tend to be pressured by outside forces to try and be straight when they are not. They choose to try and conform. They don't really change who they are.
Second, it isn't an either/or. There are bisexuals as well.

 

[Darkstorn]

Thankfully, I've never been sexually abused so the issue has never come up.

What has that got to do with
homosexuality?

Incidentally, that you bring it up to begin with is suspect. I don't believe you.

 

[Maximilian]

I don't need to. Neither of those people you quoted were homosexual. At best, bisexual. Homosexual practices don't make for a homosexual.

Other option: They are lying. Either to themselves or to everyone else.

Third option: Neither person exists. They are an invention by liars.

It seems you're intent on converting me without presenting any concrete evidence that support your sect's views and in spite of clear evidence which refutes it. How am I supposed to do that?