Shiva v's Vishnu

[Metempsychosis]

Are Smarta Advaitan?

Yes.

ISKCON doesn't really mar anything as they are a legit Vaishnava organization.

Pleas read 'Bhagavat Gita As it is' by Prabupada.It is a shoddy work.

THere is a difference between Sri Ramanajuacharya ,Sri Raghavendra, and sectarians people like Prabupada.Remember all are Vaishnavas.I am also from the same background.

I cant say the same about Chaitanya Mahaprabu.

Besides they're a minority anyway so they don't really change the stats that dramatically.

These stats are rubbish because Shiva is Vishnu

To all the YOUNG MEMBERS
Always have unquestioning faith in your "Ishtadev".

Dont follow this..First of all,question reincarnation.

 

[Nunjima]

Thanks for all your replies, I guess it was pretty much how I saw it, I just wanted to hear what hindu's had to say about it. Vishnu is Shiva and Shiva is Vishnu, (and Ganesh and Jesus Christ and Allah etc)

I meditated in the two great temples in Trichy, Tamil Nadu, one is dedicated to Shiva and one to Vishnu. In both places the meditation was intense but they definately had diferent qualities to them, like Shiva and Vishnu have diferent energies or "bhavas"

 

[Metempsychosis]

Thanks for all your replies, I guess it was pretty much how I saw it, I just wanted to hear what hindu's had to say about it. Vishnu is Shiva and Shiva is Vishnu, (and Ganesh and Jesus Christ and Allah etc)

I meditated in the two great temples in Trichy, Tamil Nadu, one is dedicated to Shiva and one to Vishnu. In both places the meditation was intense but they definately had diferent qualities to them, like Shiva and Vishnu have diferent energies or "bhavas"

Shaivism(shaiva siddanta) is indigenous to that region.Have a nice time.

Regards,

 

[Andal]

Yes.

Pleas read 'Bhagavat Gita As it is' by Prabupada.It is a shoddy work.

THere is a difference between Sri Ramanajuacharya ,Sri Raghavendra, and sectarians people like Prabupada.Remember all are Vaishnavas.I am also from the same background.

I cant say the same about Chaitanya Mahaprabu.

I have read it and whether or not one agrees with it doesn't make it any more or any less Hindu.....Unless I misunderstood what you're saying here. What exactly is wrong with Sri Chaitanya? The only people I hear who have a problem with him are Dvaitans because he broke from Sri Madhvacharya's lineage.

These stats are rubbish because Shiva is Vishnu

This itself seems like a sectarian view. I'm not sure if some of the great Vaishnava thinkers would agree... as a side note I don't have a solid belief on this either way, just making conversation.

Aum Hari Aum!

 

[Metempsychosis]

I have read it and whether or not one agrees with it doesn't make it any more or any less Hindu.

Obviously.

....Unless I misunderstood what you're saying here.

Ya ,u misunderstood.

What exactly is wrong with Sri Chaitanya? The only people I hear who have a problem with him are Dvaitans because he broke from Sri Madhvacharya's lineage

Yes,I had problems with Prabupada and not with Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabu.

This itself seems like a sectarian view.

Yes,religion itself is a sect.

I'm not sure if some of the great Vaishnava thinkers would agree... as a side note I don't have a solid belief on this either way, just making conversation.

Prabupada,wasn't one among the great Vaishnava thinkers.There is difference between talking about ones philosophy,and absolutely denigrating others who follow different dogmas.He goes to the extent of calling advaitins as liars and cheats.I can understand when Islam mocks Hinduism.But I cannot understand how Sri prabupada mocks a sect(advaita) of his own religion..

 

[Onkara]

Namaste
I have read that it is one of the 10 sevaparada (offence relating to worship) in Acintya Bhedabheda to regard the name and attributes of Siva as independent of those of Vishnu.

 

[Riverwolf]

Thats true.Can you find a siva murti in ISKCON?

There isn't an ISKCON temple near where I live.

It is a Vaishnava sect who have men like Sri Prabupada,who make propaganda against advaita.

I noticed...

That does bug me, that ISKCON literature is so vehemently against advaita.

http://www.experiencefestival.com/a/Ishta-deva/id/503754

All smartans are advaitins ,I dont know whether all advaitins are smartans are not.

Thanks.

 

[Onkara]

That does bug me, that ISKCON literature is so vehemently against advaita.

Hi Riverwolf
Why do you think that is? My impression is that it lies with the relationship between Brahaman and Krishna. Adviata places Brahman as Godhead whereash ISKON and Vaishnavas see Krishna as Godhead.

Onkarah.

 

[Andal]

Hi Riverwolf
Why do you think that is? My impression is that it lies with the relationship between Brahaman and Krishna. Adviata places Brahman as Godhead whereash ISKON and Vaishnavas see Krishna as Godhead.

Onkarah.

This is true, Vishnu/ Krishna is God head not Brahman. Brahman is an energy of God but the divine personality is beyond that.

And lets be serious here guys, there is tons of sectarian debate, argument, and conflict. Not everyone has to agree with Advaita. If this or that guru wants to speak out against Advaita, or Dvaita, or Dvaitadvaita, Vishishtadvaita, or Acintya Bhedabheda, then that's their business.

I am far more concerned with what my guru says than what someone else's says.

Aum Hari Aum

 

[Riverwolf]

This is true, Vishnu/ Krishna is God head not Brahman. Brahman is an energy of God but the divine personality is beyond that.

And lets be serious here guys, there is tons of sectarian debate, argument, and conflict. Not everyone has to agree with Advaita. If this or that guru wants to speak out against Advaita, or Dvaita, or Dvaitadvaita, Vishishtadvaita, or Acintya Bhedabheda, then that's their business.

I agree. I, personally, follow dvaitadvaita, but I try not to hold it against someone who disagrees. It's just irritating when these people belittle people who follow other paths.

Too bad I don't have a guru to listen to, though...

 

[Madhuri]

I agree. I, personally, follow dvaitadvaita, but I try not to hold it against someone who disagrees. It's just irritating when these people belittle people who follow other paths.

Too bad I don't have a guru to listen to, though...

God is the guru within you and all around you. if you learn to listen then you have the greatest guru there is

 

[nameless]

God is the guru within you and all around you. if you learn to listen then you have the greatest guru there is

if not able to listen to inner guru, inner guru would take the form of outer guru.

 

[Madhuri]

if not able to listen to inner guru, inner guru would take the form of outer guru.

Good point. But if outer guru is not available, contact inner guru

 

[nameless]

Good point. But if outer guru is not available, contact inner guru

i think there is no scarcity for outer guru if one has real hunger to know the truth, he is waiting for your permission to appear before you. Nothing is impossible, just have to make a sincere wish/try, naturally rest will happen.

Effort to contact inner guru is appreciated, but not that easy though. You should be someone like buddha to succeed in that, still possible.. Usually people who succeeds in that path are inborn with such talent, probably the continuation of previous spiritual life. (in my opinion ).

 

[Metempsychosis]

There isn't an ISKCON temple near where I live.
I noticed...

That does bug me, that ISKCON literature is so vehemently against advaita.

It is understood that prabupada was not a realised person.They want prove the superiority of Bhakti marga over everything else.

Justs see the name they give for God:Supreme Pesonality of Godhead.
This name itself is used to denigrate advatins or impersonalists.

Actually,when I was a Beginner,I thought the mayavadins he has referring to were 'witches' .Only after reading about advaita ,I understood that mayavadin meant advaitains.

Hi Riverwolf
Why do you think that is? My impression is that it lies with the relationship between Brahaman and Krishna. Adviata places Brahman as Godhead whereash ISKON and Vaishnavas see Krishna as Godhead.
Onkarah.

Probably duality itself means one thing is right, another is wrong.It may mean one is superior over other.But even this applies only unrealised dvaitins.Actually,all these philosophies are simultaneously true,because they thes same things in different perspective.The Nirguna brahman and Saguna Brahman(krishan,Siva,etc) are flip sides of each other,they are one and the same.

Now,this may be just my view.

 

[nameless]

Actually,when I was a Beginner,I thought the mayavadins he has referring to were 'witches' .Only after reading about advaita ,I understood that mayavadin meant advaitains.

when i read prabhupada books, me too thought like that, the usage of term 'mayavadi' by prabhupada is of wrong sense, maya means fake, so mayavadi is understood here as those who propagates fake ideas. But in the proper sense advaitins are called 'mayavadis' for the reason they propagate the idea of fakeness of duality, which was a some sort of threat to vaishnava thought.

Anyway, each sects has its own importance, hence has duty to rescue their thought, prabhupada criticizing advaitins must be for that reason, but it is true that prabhupada was too harsh on advaitins.

A Swami Vivekananda Quote

"Take up one idea. Make that one idea your life - think of it, dream of it, live on that idea. Let the brain, muscles, nerves, every part of your body, be full of that idea, and just leave every other idea alone. This is the way to success that is way great spiritual giants are produced."

 

[Satsangi]

This question is for all Advaitins- how do u see Lord Krishna or any other Avatar? Are they same as any other human? If so, why did the Acharya of Advaitins- Shri Adi Shankara say- Bhaj Govindam moodh mateh........? Do advaitins see a "realized" person same as God? If u say yes, then God becomes Saakar and if u say no, then u are seeing duality.......think and answer.

I am not trying to argue out the Advaitins, I have the highest of regards for Shri Adi Shankara who by the way argued out the Buddhists. Obviously Adi Shankara favored the Hinduism which in some people's opinion have "lesser values" than Buddhism. Adi Shankara always followed his Varnashram Dharma, made his Shishyas follow Varnashram Dharma. Even after meeting the Chandala (Siva himself) and accepting defeat from Him, he continued to follow the Varnashram Dharmas. Can any Advaitin explain this?

Regards

 

[Metempsychosis]

when i read prabhupada books, me too thought like that, the usage of term 'mayavadi' by prabhupada is of wrong sense, maya means fake, so mayavadi is understood here as those who propagates fake ideas. But in the proper sense advaitins are called 'mayavadis' for the reason they propagate the idea of fakeness of duality, which was a some sort of threat to vaishnava thought.

Yes.I got one quote from him
"The Mayavadi impersonalist cannot think of the Absolute's becoming a menial servant of His devotee but actually there is stage in the transcendental plane like that which is inconceivable by the Mayavadi philosophers or which can never be imagined by any mundane wrangler who is always busy to exploit the service of a mundane servant in mammon's relation. "
BTGPY18c: Scholars Deluded -- Prabhupada Back to Godhead Magazine 1944 - 1960

Anyway, each sects has its own importance, hence has duty to rescue their thought, prabhupada criticizing advaitins must be for that reason, but it is true that prabhupada was too harsh on advaitins.

After reading there books,I was clear that advaita is the way for me.He is probably trying to rescue advaita.Thanks Prabupada.

 

[Satsangi]

By the way, do not waste this precious life in following any "isms" or "ists". There is nothing like a Pragat Brahma realized Guru; have a deep desire for such a Guru and you will definitely find such a Guru. Srimad Bhagvatam gives about ?39 qualities of a Saint. Find such a Saint. When u meet a true Guru and live as per his guidance, one day your questions will disappear instantly in His presence; no questions asked. All the isms, ists and logies etc etc will appear empty; the Shashtras will appear to be living in him.

Regards,

Regards

 

[Metempsychosis]

Obviously Adi Shankara favored the Hinduism which in some people's opinion have "lesser values" than Buddhism.

I told that,because I wanted to get idea from Hindus about how they deal with criticism from Ambedkar Buddhism(which obviously is very much naive.)