McBell
Unbound
Fair enough.
I am speaking about the "health care system" in the USA
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Should socialized health care deny/delay treatment to smokers and the obese?
- Thread starter MD
- Start date
I am speaking about the "health care system" in the USA
Yes, we're in debt because the government is stupid and mismanages the money. Plus, the rich and large corporations don't pay their fair share.
McBell
Unbound
Yes.
It is a symptom for other things as well, but long cancer is a symptom of smoking.
No idea where you got that impression.What? Are you saying that we shouldn't focus on treating lung cancer but focus on smoking cessation?
Glad I addressed and defeated OP.
All the other posts are dealing with another topic. One I would speak to, but some of you all honestly wouldn't stand a chance if you hold to beliefs of "smoking causes cancer." So, I'll not embarrass you in this thread and rest comfortably knowing I spoke specifically to what OP brought up.
All the other posts are dealing with another topic. One I would speak to, but some of you all honestly wouldn't stand a chance if you hold to beliefs of "smoking causes cancer." So, I'll not embarrass you in this thread and rest comfortably knowing I spoke specifically to what OP brought up.
This is the fundamental reason I despise RomneyCare/ObamaCare/ACA.
It doesn't address the most basic problem with our capitalist health care system. The system is a money making system, healthy citizens is a byproduct and secondary concern. That is not how 1st world health care systems work.
Tom
Perditus
へびつかい座
I wish I could remember where I read it, but I learned recently that a multi-billion dollar corporation only paid $55 dollars in taxes last year.
Imagine what kind of health care we would all receive if entities like this company paid their fair share of taxes.
This topic is of special significance to me because I am one of those people whose weight wasn't lifestyle based. I am active and eat healthy, it just so happens I also have large cysts growing on my ovaries and complications from too much of the wrong type of hormones caused hypothyroidic symptoms including weight retention and weight gain.
If someone had denied me speedy coverage because of my weight, it may have taken even longer to find out the real problem. Because once I was treated with more than diet and exercise plans, that is, with the correct hormone medication, I dropped weight significantly. I still have a ways to go, and I can't wait until I can afford a hysterectomy. But in the mean time I just finished a 18 mile relay race last week. I was able ti get there, in part, because my doctor believed me when I said I am living healthy and it's still not working.
If someone had denied me speedy coverage because of my weight, it may have taken even longer to find out the real problem. Because once I was treated with more than diet and exercise plans, that is, with the correct hormone medication, I dropped weight significantly. I still have a ways to go, and I can't wait until I can afford a hysterectomy. But in the mean time I just finished a 18 mile relay race last week. I was able ti get there, in part, because my doctor believed me when I said I am living healthy and it's still not working.
SkylarHunter
Active Member
Fair point but it's not black and white.
People should be educated in order to make the right food choices, they should be given access to those foods at affordable cost and the food industry should have to be completely restructured in order to place people's health ahead of profit before anyone treats an obese person like a pariah. It is a very complex subject that can't be seen from only one angle.
Oh they say insurance will cover it. But they usually mean the surgery itself. I just had an endoscopic surgery a couple years ago that was 'covered.' I'm still paying the anesthesiologist, the hospital fee and my post-op check in bills. It truly is pretty f'd up.
Perditus
へびつかい座
I agree. For-profit health care is absolutely insane.
Have you noticed that most of the healthiest foods are absurdly expensive?
I spend a small fortune on fruits and nuts and soy milk.
This is the kind of crap that makes me angry.
I have friends in Mississippi. Bob was having heart issues and was being treated. One evening his pain ramped up enough for Linda to take him in to the hospital. He needed a test that hospital could not do, so they sent him to a nearby big hospital. Despite him having no particular crisis, the doctor ordered an ambulance from the one company that wasn't covered by their insurance, while Linda was saying "I got him here, I'll drive him there!". Instead, Bob waited 40 minutes for the ambulance which Linda followed in her SUV.
Cost them $1200. Out of pocket.
Later Linda found out that the ambulance service was owned by the doctor's brother. I thought she might kill somebody.
Tom
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
Such attitudes I believe are a result of the very poor and downright dishonest discussions we socially have about drugs. We love to be scared of drugs, we love to hate those who use them, but we have no idea what a drug really is, or are even aware that a variety of drugs, especially caffeine, are both socially accepted and very widely abused (many I do believe are not even aware that caffeine is a drug). We don't know about drugs, we don't learn about them, but we'll go on about how "bad choices" led to addiction without giving a thought to the fact that many addicts were given opiates by their doctors, and the addiction is not the result of choices but poorly managed pain management. With alcoholism, we see the staggering drunk who made "bad decisions" in life, but we really don't want to see the pain that lead the drunk to turn to the bottle or the misery and agony they suffer from their addiction. We also don't want to see social circumstances, such as how a ton of people in Indiana smoke, and I used to smoke myself as means to help get myself socializing. And though we hate drugs, we do things such as glamorize this "ideal rock star life," which does include a ton of drugs and many tragic fatal overdoses.
Really, it's sickening and disgusting that anyone could summarize addiction as "bad decisions."
Rick O'Shez
Irishman bouncing off walls
I must have missed that, your post seem mostly a rant about the rights of smokers.
It was partially that given that the language of OP appeals to that. But if you read the post, you'd see I quoted from the article linked in OP and that speaks specifically to how the actual policy works, rather than the (how) emotional appeal, found in OP, is framing it.
Perditus
へびつかい座
I agree that this is a huge problem. I'm rabidly opposed to the culture of celebrity worship. Those people are no different than any of us. Their foibles, however, are lionized and they're generally given a pass.
Personally, I feel a major adjustment of the social structure is necessary to bring attitudes in line with reality.
Celebrities play for a living. Is that really something we should emulate?
SkylarHunter
Active Member
I agree. For-profit health care is absolutely insane.Have you noticed that most of the healthiest foods are absurdly expensive?
I spend a small fortune on fruits and nuts and soy milk.
Yes, it makes me so mad. If you want to eat healthy it costs a fortune and you have to cook. I love cooking but it takes time. Many people don't have enough money and time and that's not their fault. Those people are not the villains, their're victims of a broken system.
We all have a personal responsibility and people need to make the necessary efforts to be healthy but there are many factors that need to be taken into consideration.