Signs of The End: A Baha'i View

[InvestigateTruth]

I see no prophesy for Bahuhala at all. Glory of God is quite vague to be used as any proof at all, not to mention He was not born with this name, He took it for himself. not very prophetic.

Bahaullah could not have written this letter to the Bab, for the Bab had been dead at this time. It was certainly written to Abdul Baha according to Bahai writings

peace.
In Maftoon, page 15, Bahaullah writes to his son Abdul Baha, "This s a letter from Allah, the Honoured and the Wise (Bahaullah) to Allah the Gracious, the Aware (Abdul Baha)." This is interesting - one God greets another one!

Well this was from your old one, and I will answer to this, from Bible.

Firstly, The Bab had also revealed in the same manner:

"This is a letter from God, the Help in Peril, the Self-Subsisting, unto God, the Almighty, the Best Beloved,...."
Bahá'í Reference Library - Selections From the Writings of the Báb, Pages 6-8


Moreover, the one that you have copied here as follow:

"This s a letter from Allah, the Honoured and the Wise (Bahaullah) to Allah the Gracious, the Aware (Abdul Baha)."

This Translation is not from a Baha'i source. It is possible the original is in the persian language somewhere.

But, the comment in the bracket as (Bahaullah) to (Abdul Baha) is an addition and is fake.


To understand this type of revelation, first we need to understand the Bible at least:


"For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries." 1 Corin. 14:2


The meaning is this; These verses are revealed from God. and It is written to God. In another Words, although appearantly and outwordly these are written to men, but in reality, these are written to God, For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God.

Question: Can God write Letters for Himself?
How come when God asked Abraham to sacrifice His Son, that was not strange, but when God writes a letter to Himself, they find it strange?



I hope it is clear.
Peace.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

I had replied to you in depth and Then saw your heated response to me in another thread, so I deleted my post so not to add fuel to the fire I see happening. In no way do I intend to cause anger or be angered, yet it happens as Things of God are indeed important to both of us.I would like to leave this thread now and not debate further in this topic. I will agree to disagree, walk away and would appreciate If you not bait me further to respond here. Thank you and may we part in peace, hugz

You are always welcome to chat!

 

[BruceDLimber]

I see no prophesy for Bahuhala at all. Glory of God is quite vague to be used as any proof at all, not to mention He was not born with this name, He took it for himself....

Actually, no!

The title was awarded to Him by the Bab (Whom we see as the immediately preceding Divine Messenger).

(The correct spelling, BTW, is Baha'u'llah. If it'll help, "baha" means "glory" while "Allah" of course means God; the stuff in the center forms an "of" prepositional phrase, yielding "Glory of God.")

There are many, many prophecies about the Advent of Baha'u'llah and the Baha'i Faith, but I'm afraid we're not allowed to post citations to them here. If you'd care to visit us on some Baha'i site, we'll be most happy to tell you about them! (For example, you can find me on Planet Baha'i.)

I find it silly to suggest that all bible believers misunderstand or fail to interpret God's word for us and we must hold on to the Books for many centuries till God sends us someone to unseal them.

But this appears to mean you're denying the "sealing of the books" in Daniel that InvestigateTruth mentioned to you. Is this indeed the case?

Peace,

Bruce

 

[Lady B]

Actually, no!

The title was awarded to Him by the Bab (Whom we see as the immediately preceding Divine Messenger).

(The correct spelling, BTW, is Baha'u'llah. If it'll help, "baha" means "glory" while "Allah" of course means God; the stuff in the center forms an "of" prepositional phrase, yielding "Glory of God.")

There are many, many prophecies about the Advent of Baha'u'llah and the Baha'i Faith, but I'm afraid we're not allowed to post citations to them here. If you'd care to visit us on some Baha'i site, we'll be most happy to tell you about them! (For example, you can find me on Planet Baha'i.)




But this appears to mean you're denying the "sealing of the books" in Daniel that InvestigateTruth mentioned to you. Is this indeed the case?

Peace,

Bruce

no, I am denying the Bahai interpretation of the seal in Daniel. Is is clearly not saying the Bible is sealed and no man can understand it. If anything it goes against you and says the canon is closed and will be no more prophets after. No way you will ever convince any Bible believeing person that Bahaullah alone holds the meaning of God's word, You may as well give that up entirely.:thud:

 

[BruceDLimber]

no, I am denying the Bahai interpretation of the seal in Daniel. Is is clearly not saying the Bible is sealed and no man can understand it.

Then what exactly do you think it's saying?

No way you will ever convince any Bible believeing person that Bahaullah alone holds the meaning of God's word, You may as well give that up entirely.

We've never, ever said Baha'u'llah alone has this truth!

Many Bible-believing people have already accepted Baha'u'llah's teachings.
And we've brought millions of others to the recognition and love of both Christ and the Bible.

I stipulate it's not the way you might have done it, but the fact remains.

Peace,

Bruces

 

[Lady B]

Then what exactly do you think it's saying?



We've never, ever said Baha'u'llah alone has this truth!

Many Bible-believing people have already accepted Baha'u'llah's teachings.
And we've brought millions of others to the recognition and love of both Christ and the Bible.

I stipulate it's not the way you might have done it, but the fact remains.

Peace,

Bruces

au contrare ! the representative for Bahai'ism I have been debating here in Rf has indeed said multiple times that Bahaullah has been given the true interpretations of the Holy scriptures and that all others (us and religious leaders ) interpret them wrongly. Look through the threads, for I do not have time today.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

au contrare ! the representative for Bahai'ism I have been debating here in Rf has indeed said multiple times that Bahaullah has been given the true interpretations of the Holy scriptures and that all others (us and religious leaders ) interpret them wrongly. Look through the threads, for I do not have time today.

Dear LadyB,

What Bruce is saying is correct, and what I said is correct.
He is saying many of those Christians have been able to understand the Bible correctly, then they believed in Baha'u'llah.
I am saying that the source of knowledge was Baha'u'llah.
Once Baha'u'llah unsealed the Bible, that knowledge was spread, and once those who are free from bias learned them, they became believers.

 

[Lady B]

Dear LadyB,

What Bruce is saying is correct, and what I said is correct.
He is saying many of those Christians have been able to understand the Bible correctly, then they believed in Baha'u'llah.
I am saying that the source of knowledge was Baha'u'llah.
Once Baha'u'llah unsealed the Bible, that knowledge was spread, and once those who are free from bias learned them, they became believers.

Exactly ! You have stated and continue to state that it is only because Bahaullah unsealed our scriptures where it was impossible for us to do so. rediculous!

 

[InvestigateTruth]

Exactly ! You have stated and continue to state that it is only because Bahaullah unsealed our scriptures where it was impossible for us to do so. rediculous!

Then, you still need to answer the question Bruce asked you.
The Bible says, it is sealed, and in the chapter of revelation it says, only the promised one is worthy to open its seal. What does this mean to you?

Please also note that, there is a difference between "unsealing the Book" and "understanding the Book"

The first is only done by the Promised One. He would be the one who entirely explains the mysteries of the Book.
Others may have understood the Bible to a certain level, even prior to Baha'u'llah, but they never revealed its mysteries explicitly. But those were very rare people, who had free spirit, and were pure in heart and had chastity of soul.

"The understanding of His words and the comprehension of the utterances of the Birds of Heaven are in no wise dependent upon human learning. They depend solely upon purity of heart, chastity of soul, and freedom of spirit. " - Baha'u'llah

 

[InvestigateTruth]

Revelation 3:12:​

"...and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name."​

In Islamic belief God has 99 names, and in some Islamic traditions it is believed that there is a special hidden 100th name which is the greatest. In Bahá'í belief the Greatest Name is Bahᒠ(بها&#1569, translated as "glory" or "splendour".[7]

Bahá'í sources state that the 100th name was revealed as "Bahá’" (an Arabic word بهاء meaning "glory, splendor" etc.), which is the root word for Bahá'u'lláh and Bahá'í. [10][11]

Imam Ja'far al-Sadiq (the sixth Imam), who had stated that the Greatest Name of God was included in either Du'ay-i-Sahar or A`amaal Ummi Dawud.[10] In the first verse of the Du'ay-i-Sahar, a dawn prayer for the Ramadan, the name "Bahá" appears four times: "Allahumma inni as 'aluka min Bahá' ika bi Abháh va kulla Bahá' ika Bahí".[12]


See The Book Zad al-maad, by Muhammad baqir Majlisi

and

Also In the Book Iqbal al-amal, by a Moslem scholar (Tawoosi), see page 33:
http://ucu.free.fr/Files/Les%20benedictions%20Du%20Mois%20de%20Ramadan.pdf ( Here is a translation of the Book in ferench)

 

[BruceDLimber]

I see IT has amplified what we've been telling you, so I won'd repeat any of that here.

One correction or clarificaiton, though:

[T]he representative for Bahai'ism I have been debating here in Rf has indeed said multiple times that Bahaullah has been given the true interpretations of the Holy scriptures and that all others (us and religious leaders ) interpret them wrongly.

IF he indeed said exactly that, then he's overstating because we dont believe that all others are wrong! Many are--perhaps the majority--, but definitely not all!

And the various Divine Messengers have all provided truth, so we don't condemn them, either.

(BTW, I'll be away <and presumably offline> for a week and a half or so, beginning later this week.)

Peace,

Bruce

 

[CG Didymus]

I've avoided responding to this thread, because if I go against the Baha'i Faith, I would lose that argument. How do you argue against a mystical interpretation? You need spiritual eyes to see it, and I'm pretty much as blind as a spiritual bat. What strikes me funny, though, is what the Baha'i Faith does to "normal" "literal" interpretations of Jesus and Christianity is exactly what Christians did to Judaism.
If the Jews say that Jesus didn't fulfill all the promises. If they say that Christians get proofs by taking verses from the Hebrew Bible out of context. What do the Christians say? That Jesus is coming a second time to fulfill everything, and that the Jews don't understand their own Scriptures correctly--they'll say you need the Holy Spirit to have the eyes to see the "true" meaning of the verses. How do you argue against that?
So what do Christians think they believe? I know that Left Behind believing Christians expect a rapture, a beast, and an antichrist before Jesus comes back. They have a rock solid belief that Jesus died and came back to life, that he is God, that there is literally an evil spirit being running around causing us all grief.
For those of us that question how they arrive at all that, it is easy to see they had to pick and choose verses. They had to come up with creative interpretations of verses. But, now that they have those beliefs, anyone that challenges those views is automatically deemed wrong. We are considered blind to their truth, but we all know how blind they are to seeing other people's truths.
I like the Baha'i Faith. It is a 100 times more practical than any form of Christianity. It has a system to unite the world, to get people to put their religious prejudices behind and work together as one. What's crazy, to a born-again Christian, that's a bad thing. Why? Because the beast and the antichrist are the ones that are going to unify the world. World unity is evil!
So, if you haven't done so yet, what is the Baha'i interpretation of Revelation. I think it's important also to discuss the Baha'i view of the devil, since, for the Christian, he is source of all are troubles, and the reason why Jesus needs to come back.

 

[Josh99]

The Baha'i writings speak of Satan and demonic forces but not existing as an evil personage, but rather as our ego and animal nature which is ever ready to do battle against God. Baha'u'llah has given us God's instructions for this day to fortify our spiritual side so we can win that battle.

 

[Josh99]

"If it be faithful to God (the soul of man), it will reflect His light, and will, eventually, return unto him. If it fail, however, in its allegiance to its Creator, it will become a victim to self and passion, and will, in the end, sink in their depths." Baha'u'llah (Gleanings pg 158)

 

[BruceDLimber]

[W]hat is the Baha'i interpretation of Revelation?

Your other question was already answered above.

For this question, I refer you to Riggs' The Apocalypse: An Exegesis, which you can find in the "Books" section of this site:

http://www.bahai-library.org

It contains a verse-by-verse interpretation of the Book of Revelation (and was explicitly approved by the US National Spiritual Assembly of the Baha'is).

Peace,

Bruce

 

[Iti oj]

We are still here.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

We are still here.

That's good. Thank God!