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Sin=natural
- Thread starter BIG D
- Start date
It's also "natural" to be wholly selfish. It's also "natural" to react violently to a perceived threat, whether one actually exists or not.
While I wouldn't call every entry on your list bad, nor would I call everything that many people call sinful, well, sinful (sex before marriage, homosexuality, feeling negative emotions, etc.), just because something is "natural" doesn't make it morally okay.
Discipline, for example, is all about going against what initially feels natural for the sake of a superior and/or successful outcome.
EDIT: Besides, don't forget that many things that are actually illegal were originally considered sinful, as well, such as murder, theft, assault, etc.
While I wouldn't call every entry on your list bad, nor would I call everything that many people call sinful, well, sinful (sex before marriage, homosexuality, feeling negative emotions, etc.), just because something is "natural" doesn't make it morally okay.
Discipline, for example, is all about going against what initially feels natural for the sake of a superior and/or successful outcome.
EDIT: Besides, don't forget that many things that are actually illegal were originally considered sinful, as well, such as murder, theft, assault, etc.
Yes, it's natural for humans to make mistakes. People are born into this world with zero knowledge and have to work their way from there with varying degrees of help from parents, friends, communities, etc.
Quick-fix religious pills won't fix them, and forgiveness from above is a deception. Making mistakes is a good way to learn and grow. It's important to try to be conscious of one's actions so that one can reduce the number of mistakes one makes over time and becomes better and wiser.
Quick-fix religious pills won't fix them, and forgiveness from above is a deception. Making mistakes is a good way to learn and grow. It's important to try to be conscious of one's actions so that one can reduce the number of mistakes one makes over time and becomes better and wiser.
Skwim
Veteran Member
Yeah, please forgive me for being the person your god decided I would be. Gee, it all makes sense now.
it is natural because we live in a fallen nature. and it is our fault because we chose to sin against god through our representatives adam and eve.
We chose to sin through our ancestors?
Dirty Penguin
Master Of Ceremony
There is no such thing as sin.
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
Well, yes, according to Christian doctrine. Christianity teaches that we are all sinners, and we all have the urge to sin. We are all flawed, and need Jesus salvation to escape eternal damnation.
But of course if you don't believe in Christianity then there really isn't any reason to get worked up over it.
Levite
Higher and Higher
The problem with fundamentalist conceptions of sin is that they are unreasonable. Fortunately, most religious observers to not conceive of sin so broadly.
At least in Judaism, it is no sin to get angry. It may be a sin to allow that anger to overwhelm your behavior to such a degree that you harm someone or publicly insult them, but one cannot force oneself to feel other than how one feels.
Jealousy, technically, is not prohibited. The tenth commandment, which is usually translated as "Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife, etc." is not technically about the feeling of jealousy: the expression lo tachmod, translated typically as "thou shalt not covet..." really means not a feeling of envy or jealousy, but a desire to acquire something, not an emotion, per se, but a motivation, something preparatory to an action. It's less about feeling an emotion than in allowing that emotion to grow into a plan of action, the motivation for some transgressive act.
As for hatred, this is really based on a misunderstanding of the commandment in Leviticus lo tisnah et achichah bilevavechah hocheyach tochiyach et amitechah velo tisa alav cheyt, which is usually translated "Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him," but translated more precisely, with correct use of idiom and context, should read, "Do not bear grudges against your fellows: rather, you must surely confront them, and thus not come to sin through them."
So what is really meant by that is not that it is a sin to feel hatred, but that it is dangerous to nurse grudges in secret: one ought to confront someone with whom one feels a grievance, air the grievances, and work things out; because if this is not done, unresolved grudges will surely lead to things which would be sinful-- violence, publicly humiliating someone, thievery, adultery, etc. Judaism really never tries to legislate emotions or thoughts, only actions.
As for sex, in Judaism it's not a sin, per se. Adultery is a sin; rape is a sin; polygamy is more or less forbidden; incest and bestiality are sins; using sex as a form of idolatry is a sin; and Jews are highly encouraged to express their sexuality within the confines of marriage. But, technically, sex prior to marriage is not a sin, although it is treated that way these days in the Orthodox community. Outside of the Orthodox community, homosexuality is not regarded as a sin, though that is also encouraged to be expressed within the confines of a monogamous, committed relationship. But in general, it's not sex per se that is sinful, it is the context of whom one is having sex with, under what circumstances, and perhaps for what reason. But not the act, in and of itself.
Personally, I see nothing wrong with the idea that our passions are okay, but we should be careful and aware of them, so as not to be ruled by them, because it is those who are entirely impulsive, ruled completely by their passions, that inevitably engage in actions that are transgressive.
zenzero
Its only a Label
Friend BIGD,
Sin or virtue are two sides of the same coin and it all depends on the minds view.
A child may do so many things but still one can never label it as sinned so the same act by an adult could be labelled sinful; why?
But once the mind itself if transcended one becomes child like again and then the question of sin or virtue remains no more meaning they are terms which are mind related and no-mind never evaluates such things.
Love & rgds
Sin or virtue are two sides of the same coin and it all depends on the minds view.
A child may do so many things but still one can never label it as sinned so the same act by an adult could be labelled sinful; why?
But once the mind itself if transcended one becomes child like again and then the question of sin or virtue remains no more meaning they are terms which are mind related and no-mind never evaluates such things.
Love & rgds
Thesavorofpan
Is not going to save you.
Well yes it is quite natural to be angry, jealous, and hate people, but nothing ever comes good out of that. While fornication has pros and cons
Everyone has sin. There's no denying. Hell your probably sinning right now.
But this original sin no longer has a hold over us when we accept Christ Jesus as our Saviour. If we are sincere about it our Past sin (inherited from A & E) are forgiven Rom.3v25. From accepting Jesus onwards we are responsible for our own sins and deal with them through repentance and consequent obedience to Christ Acts 18v30; Heb.5v9.
This is the overall process we must be willing to believe in order to get out of our sinful human situation.
Erebus
Well-Known Member
Agreed. Enjoy your sinning and don't feel ashamed of who and what you are
With a little common sense, it's possible to live a life actively sinning without destroying yourself.Also If I recall correctly, a fellow named Jesus already paid for our sins. Sin is on the house folks!
Since you believe in Jesus you obviously believe in the NT.
Have you read ROM. 6 ; ???
Nerthus
Wanderlust
I need forgiveness for getting angry over someone hitting my child (for example)?!
I don't think people who behave in a natural manner and get angry, jealous or selfish need to be sent to eternal torture for not saying sorry.
This is where I stand. I don't believe that any of the behaviours in the OP are sins in the religious sense at all, they are simple human behaviour. Why on earth should I repent for that, especially when it was supposedly God who created me to have those emotions?!
Agreed. Enjoy your sinning and don't feel ashamed of who and what you are
Also If I recall correctly, a fellow named Jesus already paid for our sins. Sin is on the house folks!
I try not to enjoy the anger part though
As offspring of Adam and Eve, we were all born in sin. From birth on, the inclination of our heart is toward badness. If e do not curb those wrong tendencies, we may in time become accustomed to such a way of life. It may even seem "normal" because others around us are doing similar things. But the Bible identifies what is right and what is wrong from God's view point, in view of how he made man and his purpose for mankind. If we listen to our Creator and lovingly obey him, life will take on a richness of meaning that we never knew before, and we will have the prospect of eternal life on a paradise on earth....in Psalms 34:8 God invites us.
chinu
chinu
Yes! it is right to say that Sinners = Naturel.
But,Sin = What do you not expect for yourself from OTHERS.
If,Sin = Naturel, then be ready to "BEAR" it on yourself first.
Those who have realized that their houses are also made of glasses, never try to break the glasses of other's house.
_/\_Jasdir.
Blackheart
Active Member
Of course Sin is natural. So is arsenic with similar results!
Erebus
Well-Known Member
I don't believe in Jesus as the son of God. I think it's possible that he existed, but I don't know for certain and even if he did I certainly don't believe he was anything more than a human.
I was being humorous