Sister Beck's Talk

[Bishka]

Make sure Bishka and Nutshell know that this is not just for women.

And this is why we feel this way.

People talking down to us, thinking we are stupid.

It was obvious it wasn't just for women, it said for ALL MEMBERS of the church.


So I'm curious what y'all feel about the rest of us who don't fit in the box? (Such as bisexuals/gays/lesbians, drinkers, people who watch rated-R movies, women in the church who want to study theology, etc)

 

[nutshell]

Make sure Bishka and Nutshell know that this is not just for women.

I should actually thank you for this post. You've validated everything I've been saying all along.

 

[Scott C.]

So I'm curious what y'all feel about the rest of us who don't fit in the box? (Such as bisexuals/gays/lesbians, drinkers, people who watch rated-R movies, women in the church who want to study theology, etc)

Define "box" in this context and then I'll try to answer.

 

[Bishka]

Define "box" in this context and then I'll try to answer.

The good little "homemakers," the one's that aren't being "truthful" with themselves, the ones that would rather have slightly messy house, etc, etc. It's not that hard to define.

 

[Scott C.]

The good little "homemakers," the one's that aren't being "truthful" with themselves, the ones that would rather have slightly messy house, etc, etc. It's not that hard to define.

But you gave the example of a lesbian. Do you see lesbians and messy housekeepers as being equally outside of the box?

 

[Scott C.]

Uh... I'm not sure exactly what prompted you to make this particular recommendation, but the next time I'm in Deseret Book, I'll look for it.

My brain was having random thoughts when this came out.

 

[Bishka]

But you gave the example of a lesbian. Do you see lesbians and messy housekeepers as being equally outside of the box?

You know what, forget it.

Until this little thread was revived, I was almost over this whole issue.

Please, let it die!

 

[Starfish]

Sis. Beck was called to her position by our prophet. It's likely she was called and set apart by Pres. Hinckley personally. She represents one of the Lord's servants. Her words, like all words spoken at General Conference, should be listened to and learned from. If we humbly go to the Lord for understanding, we will gain a greater appreciation for what she was saying.

 

[Bishka]

Sis. Beck was called to her position by our prophet. It's likely she was called and set apart by Pres. Hinckley personally. She represents one of the Lord's servants. Her words, like all words spoken at General Conference, should be listened to and learned from. If we humbly go to the Lord for understanding, we will gain a greater appreciation for what she was saying.

Did you not even understand what I posted?

 

[zookeeper]

This is not what Beck was talking about. The problem is that she set a goal to strive for - it's that she made it sound like it's the only goal.

So you're upset about how it sounded to you? You're upset about your own interpretation? Is all of this stress worth that? I occasionally hear something that sounds off to me. But those are the times I half to take a step back, trust in our prophet, and ask myself how I can learn from what I've heard. Of course I don't apply this to anyone in the church expressing ideas. But in General Conference, especially, I think there's got to be an elevated respect for counsel from our leaders.

 

[nutshell]

So you're upset about how it sounded to you? You're upset about your own interpretation? Is all of this stress worth that? I occasionally hear something that sounds off to me. But those are the times I half to take a step back, trust in our prophet, and ask myself how I can learn from what I've heard. Of course I don't apply this to anyone in the church expressing ideas. But in General Conference, especially, I think there's got to be an elevated respect for counsel from our leaders.

I'm not stressed out and it's more than an interpretation: it was the plain language of her talk. I don't respect sexism. And no on is infallible - even during conference.

 

[tnutz]

I'm not stressed out and it's more than an interpretation: it was the plain language of her talk. I don't respect sexism. And no on is infallible - even during conference.

Nutshell, I read another one of your posts, where you were explaining your "Nonliteral Mormon" beliefs, and stated that you felt Joseph Smith was a "nut job". So I realize that I am wasting my time arguing with you. You are not searching for truth, but simply reasoning your own stance. I would like to be there when you tell the Lord that the Prophet he chose to restore His Church, the man who has done more for us than any other man, save the Lord himself, was a "nutjob". Good luck with that, and good luck to you. I hope you and Bishka don't think, reason, or rationalize yourselves away from the Church.

 

[nutshell]

Nutshell, I read another one of your posts, where you were explaining your "Nonliteral Mormon" beliefs, and stated that you felt Joseph Smith was a "nut job". So I realize that I am wasting my time arguing with you. You are not searching for truth, but simply reasoning your own stance. I would like to be there when you tell the Lord that the Prophet he chose to restore His Church, the man who has done more for us than any other man, save the Lord himself, was a "nutjob". Good luck with that, and good luck to you. I hope you and Bishka don't think, reason, or rationalize yourselves away from the Church.

I perfectly accept the fact that the Lord may choose nutjobs to accomplish his work. I don't see what the big deal is. Was he a prophet? Yes. Did the Lord use him to restore the gospel? Yes. What's the problem?

 

[Bishka]

I hope you and Bishka don't think, reason, or rationalize yourselves away from the Church.

Are you really that worried about us?

And why include me, I'm not the non-literal Mormon, nutshell is.

Worry about your own salvation and then when you have that all figured out perfectly, then you can worry about mine.

 

[Bishka]

Did you not even understand what I posted?

Apparently not.

So you're upset about how it sounded to you? You're upset about your own interpretation? Is all of this stress worth that? I occasionally hear something that sounds off to me. But those are the times I half to take a step back, trust in our prophet, and ask myself how I can learn from what I've heard. Of course I don't apply this to anyone in the church expressing ideas. But in General Conference, especially, I think there's got to be an elevated respect for counsel from our leaders.

Nutshell, I read another one of your posts, where you were explaining your "Nonliteral Mormon" beliefs, and stated that you felt Joseph Smith was a "nut job". So I realize that I am wasting my time arguing with you. You are not searching for truth, but simply reasoning your own stance. I would like to be there when you tell the Lord that the Prophet he chose to restore His Church, the man who has done more for us than any other man, save the Lord himself, was a "nutjob". Good luck with that, and good luck to you. I hope you and Bishka don't think, reason, or rationalize yourselves away from the Church.

 

[Sola'lor]

It would be pretty hard to the best at anything, but that should not keep you from trying. What is wrong with trying to be the best you can be?

That's exatcly what I've been saying. We should to the best we can and always strive to make our best better.

 

[nutshell]

The criticism of Beck's talk is unrelated to the fact that we should be striving to make ourselves better. That's a given. But telling women it's there special assignment to cook and clean is far from inspiring them to make themselves better.

 

[Sola'lor]

Well we just had this Worldwide Leadership Broadcast about Raising a Righteous Posterity. Guess who was part of the broadcast.... Sister Beck! I'm curious if anyelse here attended the broadcast. They had a section where Elder Oaks, Sister Tanner, Sister Beck and another Sister were sitting at a table and having a discussion. I think many of the things Sister Beck said expounded unpon this talk that everyone hates so much. Basically the jist I got was that she DOES understand that there are women from many different backgrounds and lifestyles. She DOES understand that women are not perfect. But she was explaining the perfect model of a woman's role in an LDS family should be. She wasn't saying that every woman needs to be like this right NOW! BUt that this is what the perfect model is. In one part it was said that we should guide our families based on a perfect model rather than other family examples. If we use a perfect model as our example then we can avoid the mistakes of less perfect models. Not that we have to be like this regardless of our situation but that we should be guided by a perfect example and apply it to the best we can in our situation.

Also judging by what was said in the broadcast it was clear that if Sis. Beck's talk had been given with men as the focus many of the things would have b identical. Including the part about washing dishes being part of the sacred calling. I think the main problem that is going on here is that Sis. Beck's talk was focused on women. So many women took this to mean that since Sister Beck said that wmoan should do these things it was part of their responsibility alone.

After watching this broadcast I am now sure that Sis. Beck's talk is perfectly correct and that if it had been directed to men it would have said nearly the exact same thing.

Here's one quote I remember from the broadcast(it's not exact), "Husbands won't always be the providers, and Mother's won't always be nurturers."

Husbands and wives should work together to fulfill their sacred duties as parents.

So to everyone who hates Sis. Beck's talk I say:

Relax, take a breath, untwist your underwear, and use those parts of Sis. Beck's talk that best apply to your situation and try and fulfill it to the best you can. Also realise that she wasn't excluding men from most of the responsibilities mentioned in her talk!

 

[Starfish]

I also watched the broadcast and, because of the discussions in this forum, I really tuned in when Sis. Beck commented on this subject. I agree with Sola'lor, but this is exactly how I felt after the talk last October. She gave us an worthy ideal to progress towards, always recognizing that our best may seem to fall short.

A couple of days ago, Oprah did a show about how cluttered and dirty homes can affect our health. It talked about how the people who live in an out-of-control messy house, tend to be out of control in many other areas of their lives. After their home was clean, organized and decluttered, the people were emotionally able to take on a better diet and exercise regimen. For me, this can also involve my spiritual life.

"Organize yourselves; prepare every needful thing, and establish a house, even a house of prayer, a house of fasting, a house of faith, a house of learning, a house of glory, a house of order, a house of God." (D&C 109:8)

So, to me, Sis. Beck's counsel is admonishing women to do their best to create that house of order for herself and her family, that invites the best in our spiritual growth. Obviously this counsel is for men as well.

If my house is a mess, my self-esteem is affected. If God is correct in telling me that I am a child of his, my self-esteem should reflect that. I just think it all ties in somehow.

 

[nutshell]

So it's men's special callings to cook and clean too?