=Something Bad Jesus Did=

[IF_u_knew]

My Dear Ben... I have given much consideration to the things you, as well as the other posters have stated. It was not until I came back and read the last couple of posts that I was able to understand where my heart is at concerning this; because believe me, I do in my heart feel disgust at the way that woman was humiliated.

I do not think that it is ever okay to humiliate another person who is in honest need of something and you, as well as I can see that this *does* in fact go against the teachings of Tanakh. I do agree with you on that point. And I came to understand the point you were trying to make because of the following two posts:

His actual reaction to her humble reply was;

Matt.15:28 Then Jesus answered, "Woman, you have great faith! Your request is granted." And her daughter was healed from that very hour.

That doesn't sound like exasperation to me, it sounds like admiration.

There a numerous possible explanations for why he initially rejected her; maybe he was trying to use the situation to demonstrate the value of humility to his followers?

I know from personal experience and intimate knowledge that G.d does not use humiliation tactics. The tone is not one of admiration at all when he declares she has faith. If Jesus was a prototype of a king, than what he did was very much a bullying tactic. He humiliated her... he did not humble her... she humbled herself; and I do not agree that *THAT* was necessary.

Being a king does not afford one rights as a human being over another... it rather is a responsibility to serve those who come in his path. One who is representative of G.d does *not* uplift themselves to debase another. He made her a laughing stock for those around her... and knowing G.d, it is what does not sit well with me. He is not like that and Jesus failed Him in that sense.

And the following post is what I find sad about Christianity as it is taught....

Ben I do agree with you up to a point. The children was the lost sheep of Israel. The whole point was to show that the gospel was to be given first to the Jews. The woman realized this and was willing to settle for the crumbs from the table. While acknowledgeing this the woman was rewarded for her faith, for she knew any part even a small portion was better than nothing and being without hope. Anything that Jesus offered, even a mere crumb was precious in her sight......

In the Greek the term "dogs" meant a pet dog in the home, We, the dogs, the Gentiles are reaping the crumbs from the Jewish table.....

If I can't sit by my master's side or be on his lap, then this dog will be content to lay at His feet........uppy:

While this seems to *sound* good... it in actuality shows the crooked perspective of G.d that so many hold to. When that line becomes straight and you see Him for Who He is, you are humbled, but humiliation is certainly not something that you will feel. You are created in His image.. G.d is not a Master... He is a Father. He proved this by giving us free will. He did not make you to grovel and beg... that is the idols most of you worship that keep you in that mind set and away from being the truly wonderful and free person I know that most are.

To admit you are a dog is to deny the great gift you were given called intelligence and to set yourself up for being controlled by someone who *would* seek to humiliate, manipulate, and use you. G.d does not guide His children through humiliation tactics. He guides them through Reason and great Love. You surrender that when you take on the above attitude.

In the end.. I went straight to the Source because I was tired of being told I should feel ashamed and guilty for questioning; I was tired of being given LESS THAN crumbs despite that my heart was desperately searching Him. So, in that sense, I very much agree with you Ben. It really gets to me to hear the kind of talk as the above. I will say this; blind faith really did lead to humiliation and feeling debased (I was just never one to be satisfied with crumbs and being controlled). Knowledge = Life. To me, the latter was more desirable and seemed more a Testament of the True Nature of G.d. Sure enough, it is Truth. Remember... the what we know in Christianity was very much about political power. It is no wonder they would use subtle manipulation tactics to keep people under their thumb.

 

[Quagmire]

I know from personal experience and intimate knowledge that G.d does not use humiliation tactics.

And I know from personal experience that he does. I also know that whether we're humiliated or humbled (instructed) by what comes our way is our choice. It has nothing to do with what someone else does or says to us.

The tone is not one of admiration at all when he declares she has faith.

How do you read this (and have you?)?

"Woman you have great faith! Your request is granted".

If Jesus was a prototype of a king, than what he did was very much a bullying tactic. He humiliated her... he did not humble her... she humbled herself; and I do not agree that *THAT* was necessary.

Too bad you weren't there to set him straight.

Being a king does not afford one rights as a human being over another... it rather is a responsibility to serve those who come in his path. One who is representative of G.d does *not* uplift themselves to debase another. He made her a laughing stock for those around her... and knowing G.d, it is what does not sit well with me. He is not like that and Jesus failed Him in that sense.

If other people's opinion, or concern for your own image, is what you bow down to, you have a cruel god indeed.

 

[DallasApple]

Jesus never made anyone a "laughing" stalk.

Jesus put Himself forward..to be "laughed at"...And congratulations..you are doing a good job at that.

I can here the crowds laughing now..

Love

Dallas

 

[IF_u_knew]

And I know from personal experience that he does. I also know that whether we're humiliated or humbled (instructed) by what comes our way is our choice. It has nothing to do with what someone else does or says to us.

wow... sometimes, in these places in the New Testament, I find myself in catch 22 kinds of thinking.. which is why I tend to keep my eyes and ears open to only the Tanakh because there is where I hear my Love's voice the clearest. I honestly am under the impression that the New Testament is meant to bring about confusion, no? It seems to be so. If this was the goal, then it has succeeded which is evidenced by the situation we find our world in today.

Fine... let us just that this is Jesus' thinking... to test her "faith." Look at the response though by one of our fellow posters and tell me, is that really a good position to be in? To be "happy" to be considered a dog status and worthy of only crumbs; because I quite disagree with her and think she is worthy of much more than she gives herself credit for. The woman in this story was not happy with being called such.. she was able to place aside the humiliation in order to achieve her heart's desire. I little doubt that it was that type of test though that he had in mind... or why would Jesus not have said so in order to ease the humiliation? Look above this post and you will see woman who is fine and quite happy with being considered a dog and calling her Father, Master. Do you not think that it grieves G.d's heart that she would view Him as being that way? I can assure you it does.. because it grieves my heart that she seems content to settle and forgo all that He is wanting her to have.

How do you read this (and have you?)?

"Woman you have great faith! Your request is granted".

Have *I* read it? Friend, it was force fed down my throat by those who treated me very much the same way this woman was treated any time that I questioned why my heart was still longing for more... still feeling like there was a call coming from somewhere else.. to understand; the Voice of Reason.

In that sense, I can see the story being beneficial in that it will test those who are looking to settle for the crumbs and set them apart from those who *will* not settle for anything but the heart of G.d. What she went through in that one day is something I have endured day after day for the better part of my life. But, in the end, I found that it was NEVER G.d who was calling me one worthy of only the scraps... it was man who was benefiting from my lack of knowledge.. and it would have been my fault to have accepted that proclamation and trusted that a man was right; that I was not worthy. Then, whatever I was led to, would have ultimately been my own fault.

See, Jesus mislabeled what it was she had.. Faithfulness (NOT FAITH) that was rooted in Love for her Daughter and allowed her to endure the humiliation that GROWN *men* inflicted on her, a woman (again, more testimony to how the power of the woman exceeds the power of a man). It had little to do with a blind faith and the groveling that took place before the image... she endured what she did, not to the credit of Jesus, but to the credit of her Love. So, does that justify Jesus' harsh words and attitude? I think it reads rather plainly when one "sees" the picture rather than trying to justify the man. At what point does G.d opt for our suffering until a show of "blind faith" is made? NEVER! It is not the character of G.d.

Too bad you weren't there to set him straight.

It is truth. I have never had a problem for standing up for those who are mistreated and abused; I am extremely sensitive to the sufferings that go on around the world because people buy into the lie that this is what Life is meant to be. It is only this way because you are deceived that your reward is in another time and place and so you endure in your ignorance; forever waiting on someone to come and rescue you. My question is this.. if Jesus were to come back today, how do you know that this will not be the way you are handled? Too many abuses going on in churches right now because this type of thinking has been impressed on the minds of the people and thus, the most grievous part of it all, many living in this darkness view G.d as mean and oppressive.. quick to anger and left sided judgments through humiliations and sufferings.. when He is quite the opposite.

If other people's opinion, or concern for your own image, is what you bow down to, you have a cruel god indeed.

I DO have very deep feelings. I am *quite* sensitive in fact; yes, when people say that I do not know my LORD because I do not know (worship) a man, and then they proceed to insult me personally, a creation of the ALMIGHTY.. that in essence is insulting Him. My extreme sensitivity was the only way that I was able to see beyond the lies and follow the call put out on my heart. I endured and though I have been granted True Knowledge via my Love's ACTUAL Word, I am not left without wounds, I assure you. But this is not a reflection of G.d being cruel.. these wounds are here because of man and the deceptions, lies, biting insults, and all around hatred for the choice I made to shed the faith of their image. And they continue to unknowingly inflict them any time that I speak my heart and what is Truth (not MY truth... but His Truth). I am called Satan's spawn (which is quite ironic in fact, considering), blasphemous, evil, and not accepted by my LORD. These things leave wounds, yet I do not see how they are coming from G.d since it is man declaring them and not G.d. And in all honesty, though it does cut deep with me, what cuts deeper is seeing it being done to others around me who are precious in His sight and have shed the idols to take the journey. I will defend them whole heartedly from the attacks thrown their way.... Luckily I was stubborn enough to have not needed a defender and to take on the burden that man inflicted and still tries to inflict on me for not buying into the blind faith.

The woman was not a dog and the least Jesus could have said is, "Lady, I was wrong for saying such and you deserve my most humblest apology for being a piece of ..."

 

[Quagmire]

wow... sometimes, in these places in the New Testament, I find myself in catch 22 kinds of thinking.. which is why I tend to keep my eyes and ears open to only the Tanakh because there is where I hear my Love's voice the clearest. I honestly am under the impression that the New Testament is meant to bring about confusion, no? It seems to be so. If this was the goal, then it has succeeded which is evidenced by the situation we find our world in today.

Fine... let us just that this is Jesus' thinking... to test her "faith." Look at the response though by one of our fellow posters and tell me, is that really a good position to be in? To be "happy" to be considered a dog status and worthy of only crumbs; because I quite disagree with her and think she is worthy of much more than she gives herself credit for. The woman in this story was not happy with being called such.. she was able to place aside the humiliation in order to achieve her heart's desire. I little doubt that it was that type of test though that he had in mind... or why would Jesus not have said so in order to ease the humiliation? Look above this post and you will see woman who is fine and quite happy with being considered a dog and calling her Father, Master. Do you not think that it grieves G.d's heart that she would view Him as being that way? I can assure you it does.. because it grieves my heart that she seems content to settle and forgo all that He is wanting her to have.

Have *I* read it? Friend, it was force fed down my throat by those who treated me very much the same way this woman was treated any time that I questioned why my heart was still longing for more... still feeling like there was a call coming from somewhere else.. to understand; the Voice of Reason.

In that sense, I can see the story being beneficial in that it will test those who are looking to settle for the crumbs and set them apart from those who *will* not settle for anything but the heart of G.d. What she went through in that one day is something I have endured day after day for the better part of my life. But, in the end, I found that it was NEVER G.d who was calling me one worthy of only the scraps... it was man who was benefiting from my lack of knowledge.. and it would have been my fault to have accepted that proclamation and trusted that a man was right; that I was not worthy. Then, whatever I was led to, would have ultimately been my own fault.

See, Jesus mislabeled what it was she had.. Faithfulness (NOT FAITH) that was rooted in Love for her Daughter and allowed her to endure the humiliation that GROWN *men* inflicted on her, a woman (again, more testimony to how the power of the woman exceeds the power of a man). It had little to do with a blind faith and the groveling that took place before the image... she endured what she did, not to the credit of Jesus, but to the credit of her Love. So, does that justify Jesus' harsh words and attitude? I think it reads rather plainly when one "sees" the picture rather than trying to justify the man. At what point does G.d opt for our suffering until a show of "blind faith" is made? NEVER! It is not the character of G.d.

It is truth. I have never had a problem for standing up for those who are mistreated and abused; I am extremely sensitive to the sufferings that go on around the world because people buy into the lie that this is what Life is meant to be. It is only this way because you are deceived that your reward is in another time and place and so you endure in your ignorance; forever waiting on someone to come and rescue you. My question is this.. if Jesus were to come back today, how do you know that this will not be the way you are handled? Too many abuses going on in churches right now because this type of thinking has been impressed on the minds of the people and thus, the most grievous part of it all, many living in this darkness view G.d as mean and oppressive.. quick to anger and left sided judgments through humiliations and sufferings.. when He is quite the opposite.

I DO have very deep feelings. I am *quite* sensitive in fact; yes, when people say that I do not know my LORD because I do not know (worship) a man, and then they proceed to insult me personally, a creation of the ALMIGHTY.. that in essence is insulting Him. My extreme sensitivity was the only way that I was able to see beyond the lies and follow the call put out on my heart. I endured and though I have been granted True Knowledge via my Love's ACTUAL Word, I am not left without wounds, I assure you. But this is not a reflection of G.d being cruel.. these wounds are here because of man and the deceptions, lies, biting insults, and all around hatred for the choice I made to shed the faith of their image. And they continue to unknowingly inflict them any time that I speak my heart and what is Truth (not MY truth... but His Truth). I am called Satan's spawn (which is quite ironic in fact, considering), blasphemous, evil, and not accepted by my LORD. These things leave wounds, yet I do not see how they are coming from G.d since it is man declaring them and not G.d. And in all honesty, though it does cut deep with me, what cuts deeper is seeing it being done to others around me who are precious in His sight and have shed the idols to take the journey. I will defend them whole heartedly from the attacks thrown their way.... Luckily I was stubborn enough to have not needed a defender and to take on the burden that man inflicted and still tries to inflict on me for not buying into the blind faith.

The woman was not a dog and the least Jesus could have said is, "Lady, I was wrong for saying such and you deserve my most humblest apology for being a piece of ..."

WOW! A sermon, and a biography, but no real answers to my questions.

I'm done.

 

[IF_u_knew]

WOW! A sermon, and a biography, but no real answers to my questions.

I'm done.

Is it that I did not answer them in the way that you had wanted me to answer? I will admit to being frustrated often and wonder why I even show consideration in taking the time to answer people's questions to me when I am met with being disregarded and a denial to the fact that I *did* answer, biting remarks, and then "I'm done." I can not imagine asking others questions and then having them give me something real only to disregard them. It is rude behavior to be honest. I am assuming that it is was because I answered them honestly from my heart and I sincerely would like to know why even bother asking me? .. *sighs*

 

[Quagmire]

Is it that I did not answer them in the way that you had wanted me to answer?

That's right; I wanted you to answer them in a way that actually addressed the point, and in 500 words or less.

I will admit to being frustrated often and wonder why I even show consideration in taking the time to answer people's questions to me when I am met with being disregarded and a denial to the fact that I *did* answer, biting remarks, and then "I'm done." I can not imagine asking others questions and then having them give me something real...

I'm having a hard time imagining what "real" would look like from you.

...only to disregard them. It is rude behavior to be honest.

It is rude behavior to sidestep people's questions with self-indulgent hyperbole.

I am assuming...

Yes you are.

... that it is was because I answered them honestly from my heart and I sincerely would like to know why even bother asking me? .. *sighs*

It is because, once again, you haven't answered them at all;

If I asked you what time it was, and you said, "Look at my new watch! Isn't it nice?" You've responded, but you haven't actually answered the question.

 

[Quagmire]

Here, I'll give you an example of what I'm talking about;

I asked you if you read the passage, you said;

Have *I* read it? Friend, it was force fed down my throat by those who treated me very much the same way this woman was treated any time that I questioned why my heart was still longing for more... still feeling like there was a call coming from somewhere else.. to understand; the Voice of Reason.

So in other words, no, you haven't read it.

Having "it" (and in this case no one can be sure what "it" actually is; this passage? The whole theology? The book itself? Who knows) "force fed down your throat" isn't exactly the same thing as having read it, is it?

 

[Charity]

My Dear Ben... I have given much consideration to the things you, as well as the other posters have stated. It was not until I came back and read the last couple of posts that I was able to understand where my heart is at concerning this; because believe me, I do in my heart feel disgust at the way that woman was humiliated.

I do not think that it is ever okay to humiliate another person who is in honest need of something and you, as well as I can see that this *does* in fact go against the teachings of Tanakh. I do agree with you on that point. And I came to understand the point you were trying to make because of the following two posts:



I know from personal experience and intimate knowledge that G.d does not use humiliation tactics. The tone is not one of admiration at all when he declares she has faith. If Jesus was a prototype of a king, than what he did was very much a bullying tactic. He humiliated her... he did not humble her... she humbled herself; and I do not agree that *THAT* was necessary.

Being a king does not afford one rights as a human being over another... it rather is a responsibility to serve those who come in his path. One who is representative of G.d does *not* uplift themselves to debase another. He made her a laughing stock for those around her... and knowing G.d, it is what does not sit well with me. He is not like that and Jesus failed Him in that sense.

And the following post is what I find sad about Christianity as it is taught....



While this seems to *sound* good... it in actuality shows the crooked perspective of G.d that so many hold to. When that line becomes straight and you see Him for Who He is, you are humbled, but humiliation is certainly not something that you will feel. You are created in His image.. G.d is not a Master... He is a Father. He proved this by giving us free will. He did not make you to grovel and beg... that is the idols most of you worship that keep you in that mind set and away from being the truly wonderful and free person I know that most are.

To admit you are a dog is to deny the great gift you were given called intelligence and to set yourself up for being controlled by someone who *would* seek to humiliate, manipulate, and use you. G.d does not guide His children through humiliation tactics. He guides them through Reason and great Love. You surrender that when you take on the above attitude.

In the end.. I went straight to the Source because I was tired of being told I should feel ashamed and guilty for questioning; I was tired of being given LESS THAN crumbs despite that my heart was desperately searching Him. So, in that sense, I very much agree with you Ben. It really gets to me to hear the kind of talk as the above. I will say this; blind faith really did lead to humiliation and feeling debased (I was just never one to be satisfied with crumbs and being controlled). Knowledge = Life. To me, the latter was more desirable and seemed more a Testament of the True Nature of G.d. Sure enough, it is Truth. Remember... the what we know in Christianity was very much about political power. It is no wonder they would use subtle manipulation tactics to keep people under their thumb.

I don't consider my self to be a dog, that was only an example. If I were a dog it would appear that I seem to be coming in contact with a Pit bull that likes going straight for the throat......
I consider myself a Child of God not that I need to make any explanation for my interpretation of the scripture. I'm sorry but I think the woman was rewarded because of her faith. No humiliation at all.
Sorry Ben, I probably won't be participating much anymore, but I will read your posts.
As always....Charity

 

[IF_u_knew]

Here, I'll give you an example of what I'm talking about;

I asked you if you read the passage, you said;



So in other words, no, you haven't read it.

Having "it" (and in this case no one can be sure what "it" actually is; this passage? The whole theology? The book itself? Who knows) "force fed down your throat" isn't exactly the same thing as having read it, is it?

Yes, you are right. Being force fed meant that *I* was not reading it. You have caught exactly what I meant, so I am unsure what the problem is. It was not until I stepped away from the way I was being taught to "read" it that I finally learned how to actually read the Word.. and that is His Voice... speaking to me. I do not hear Him so clearly in the NT; but occasionally, I have one of those moments where an outside voice gets to me and through that comes understanding.

I don't consider my self to be a dog, that was only an example. If I were a dog it would appear that I seem to be coming in contact with a Pit bull that likes going straight for the throat......
I consider myself a Child of God not that I need to make any explanation for my interpretation of the scripture. I'm sorry but I think the woman was rewarded because of her faith. No humiliation at all.
Sorry Ben, I probably won't be participating much anymore, but I will read your posts.
As always....Charity

Well, I am glad that it was only example. One should never think of themselves in such a manner. You are entitled to see it how you would prefer, and of course, I do not try to change minds (just offer out a perspective). As for how you have taken my previous posts, I assure you that you are quite mistaken; though it is hard to convince someone of the truth when they have already made a prior judgment of another in their heart. You are precious in His sight, but please do not forget; I am as well. I was only trying to say that in being able to relate to your post, I could see where Ben was going in the OP. It was not meant to offend, and though I apologize, I must wonder why you seem bent on trying to bring shame to the things I say on this board.

Edited to add: Came back to say, Charity, that I have said much the same as you did above. Only when I said it, it was not an example. I was really made to feel that way. So, when I read what you wrote, it made me reconsider what I was saying. I do think Ben is probably better at making his perspectives heard and so, I hope that you will not quit posting in here because of me. I have stated what I wanted and apologize for the confusion.

 

[Ben Masada]

Ben, actually Jesus does claim to be the Messiah. look at John 4, His conversation with the Samaritan woman. He spells out clearly for her that He is the Messiah.

in Luke 13:28-29 He addresses a Jewish crowd, warning them that they themselves will be cast out of the house of Abraham, but that others from all over the world will come and take their place in God's kingdom.

Jesus also heals and restores Gentiles, and asks them to go forth and tell others about Him. Mark 5:1-20 gives an example.

regarding Jesus' comment, it's grounded in Biblical history. remember the exodus from Egypt, and God's promise to give the land of Canaan over to the Hebrews? remember how the Israelites did not obey God when they went to war against these neighboring peoples, and how God used them to punish His children for refusing to listen to Him? those peoples, remnants of them, remained in the promised land. guests, servants, dogs in the house of the children of Israel. allowed to live there, but not partaking in the blessings of Israel.

for clarity, there's Exodus 23:31-38 and Joshua 9:1-21.

Hi Aiani,

I read the quotation of Joshua 9:1-21 as you suggested and it has nothing to do in terms to understand the case of Jesus with that Canaanite mother. The punishment
to the Gibionites for having cheated on Joshua was be allowed to live as hewers of wood and drawers of water. In a word, servants to the Israelites. Servants are not
considered dogs, or like dogs. They are human beings. Regarding the quotation in Exodus 23:31-38, it does not exist. You must have made a mistake.

Regarding Luke 13:28,29, I see Replacement Theology, a Pauline item to get back to the Jewish authorities for having never allowed him to build a church in Israeli soil. The opposite is true if you read Zechariah 8:23, where it says that the Gentiles will rather take hold of the Jews by the corner of their garment and beg to be allowed to
join for having finally recognized that God is with us.

Regarding Mark 5:1-20, that was an eruption of enthusiasm from the part of a man who had been freed from his mental delusions. He was happy and it was only natural
to spread around what had happened that he was then free.

Now, last but not least, Jesus never claimed to be the Messiah. That part of his conversation with the Samaritan woman was an interpolation of many years, - about
30 - after Jesus had been gone. If Jesus had claimed to be the Messiah, his Apostles would have remembered and preached about it in Jerusalem, where the Sect of the Nazarenes had its headquarters, and they were coexisting peacefully with mainstream Judaism. For 30 long years, as the Sect grew geometrically, making converts even among the Pharesees. Then, when Paul showed up preaching that Jesus was the Messiah, son of God, and that he had resurrected, he was nearly killed by the local Jews for preaching heresy in Jerusalem. How about the Apostles, what did they preach about Jesus? I'll tell this: They were as much surprised about those Pauline news as were the other Jews.

Ben:

 

[Ben Masada]

Jesus never made anyone a "laughing" stalk.

Jesus put Himself forward..to be "laughed at"...And congratulations..you are doing a good job at that.

I can here the crowds laughing now..

Love

Dallas

I don't get you. You say that Jesus put himself forward to be laughed at. How is it now that we are doing a good job at that?

Ben:

 

[Quagmire]

Yes, you are right. Being force fed meant that *I* was not reading it. You have caught exactly what I meant, so I am unsure what the problem is.

I have several theories but I think I'll keep them to myself.

 

[Heneni]

Ben oh ben! How are you these days my dear jewish thorn?

He did give her the crumbs in the end didnt he?

Did jesus for any of the other miracles require anything other than faith?

It would not be different in her case. Thought the odds seemed to be stacked against her. She was a canaanite women, and even after jesus told her that he did not come for her, she said...yes BUT the the dogs eat of the crumbs from the childrens table.

Jesus asked nearly every single person he performed a miracle for that is recorded a question....do you believe? do you believe i can do this? etc...etc... Her faith was also tested, and when her faith was proven she recieved what she asked for. Her test was to feel that she did not deserve it, but she did not get offended she said, she will have the crumbs that fall from the table of the children, and she believed that he was willing to give her the crumbs and let her have it. So she had faith in his goodness and her faith was tested and she came out thumbs up!!! She got what she believed jesus would do for her!



Heneni

 

[AK4]

I assure you that in my whole life as a Jew, I have never heard of a Jew to consider
Gentiles as dogs, but in the NT; and Jesus of all people? Well, I wonder.

Ben:

But your precious talmud and mishnrah does! And even worser statements of the goy or is it goyim (gentiles) (Not to mention what it says of Jesus). But i will let you look that up yourself knowing that you wont respond back to my posts anyway:clap

 

[AK4]

Did anyone notice also how either impressed or surprised (take your pick) Jesus was by this womans faith---


International Standard Version(©2008)
Then Jesus answered her, "Lady, your faith is great! What you want is granted." That very hour her daughter was healed.
New American Standard Bible(©1995)
Then Jesus said to her, "O woman, your faith is great; it shall be done for you as you wish." And her daughter was healed at once.
GOD'S WORD® Translation(©1995)
Then Jesus answered her, "Woman, you have strong faith! What you wanted will be done for you." At that moment her daughter was cured.
King James Bible
Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.
American King James Version
Then Jesus answered and said to her, O woman, great is your faith: be it to you even as you will. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.
American Standard Version
Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it done unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was healed from that hour.
Bible in Basic English
Then Jesus, answering, said to her, O woman, great is your faith: let your desire be done. And her daughter was made well from that hour.
Douay-Rheims Bible
Then Jesus answering, said to her: O woman, great is thy faith: be it done to thee as thou wilt: and her daughter was cured from that hour.
Darby Bible Translation
Then Jesus answering said to her, O woman, thy faith is great. Be it to thee as thou desirest. And her daughter was healed from that hour.
English Revised Version
Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it done unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was healed from that hour.
Webster's Bible Translation
Then Jesus answered and said to her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it to thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was healed from that very hour.
Weymouth New Testament
"O woman," replied Jesus, "great is your faith: be it done to you as you desire." And from that moment her daughter was restored to health.
World English Bible
Then Jesus answered her, "Woman, great is your faith! Be it done to you even as you desire." And her daughter was healed from that hour.
Young's Literal Translation
then answering, Jesus said to her, 'O woman, great is thy faith, let it be to thee as thou wilt;' and her daughter was healed from that hour.

What hasnt been said yet in this thread is whether or not Jesus hurt her feelings, Jesus always called a spade a spade. Look at how He always talked to the pharisees and scribes "You hypocrites, You fools, You snakes". He even called His disciples things like "thickheaded" (paraphrasing).

Jesus did nothing different than what God did in the OT when He called the Israelites and Jews what they were! The verses are alluding me right now but its there (although theres one where He mentions something about their faith or righteousness is like filthy rags --but the more literal translation is that their faith or righteousness was compared to a bloody menstrual cloth of a woman. He called a spade a spade in the OT also. If_u_knew and others in this thread who believe Jesus is wrong for addressing this lady as a dog and criticise Jesus for calling a spade a spade apparently dont know the OT either and how God addressed the spades back then.


Was God wrong in the OT also or was that some more interpolation from the Jews themselves who wrote it? Something to think about hmmmmm

 

[AK4]

I didnt read the whole thing but this does mention the filthy rags/menstrual cloth that i referenced in my earlier post

Filthy Rags Page Two

 

[IF_u_knew]

If_u_knew and others in this thread who believe Jesus is wrong for addressing this lady as a dog and criticise Jesus for calling a spade a spade apparently dont know the OT either and how God addressed the spades back then.

I had intended on just writing all of this off altogether, but I find it quite inconsiderate to leave people with a false impression of my intent. Here is how I view Jesus as it stands now. There is both a blessing and a curse there. The man Jesus (or the story of that man) was simply that.. a man (a story). Nothing supernatural about it. Thus, if one can not be honest about what Jesus did because they assume he is G.d, then their judgment is obscured and they have given way to trusting man over G.d, since G.d gave us free will (which includes the ability to question). I called it wrong with the knowledge that he *is* was merely a human, and often as humans do.. we make inconsiderate comments based on physical judgments.

I actually see quite a few things that were admittances of Jesus that he was but a human, not to be worshiped. Take the adulteress woman for instance. When Jesus said, "Let him who is without sin cast the first stone," I question why did he not cast the first stone? And personally, despite the harsh reactions I have received for this judgment, it seems to me that he is saying he is but an imperfect man as well who is being perfected in judgment.. I do not condemn Jesus for the wrongs he has done, I just recognize that he admitted to not being perfect by reason of logic rather than blindly accepting the interpretations of other men (which says that you trust men over G.d.. being scared to question the Scriptures is a sign of trusting a book, man, over G.d. The Word can only speak when you shed the fear of man.. including the fear of the man named Jesus). :yes:

 

[bobhikes]

When I read Mathew you paraphrased and your version sounds much worse than what mathew actually wrote.

 

[AK4]

I had intended on just writing all of this off altogether, but I find it quite inconsiderate to leave people with a false impression of my intent. Here is how I view Jesus as it stands now. There is both a blessing and a curse there. The man Jesus (or the story of that man) was simply that.. a man (a story). Nothing supernatural about it. Thus, if one can not be honest about what Jesus did because they assume he is G.d, then their judgment is obscured and they have given way to trusting man over G.d, since G.d gave us free will (which includes the ability to question). I called it wrong with the knowledge that he *is* was merely a human, and often as humans do.. we make inconsiderate comments based on physical judgments.

I actually see quite a few things that were admittances of Jesus that he was but a human, not to be worshiped. Take the adulteress woman for instance. When Jesus said, "Let him who is without sin cast the first stone," I question why did he not cast the first stone? And personally, despite the harsh reactions I have received for this judgment, it seems to me that he is saying he is but an imperfect man as well who is being perfected in judgment.. I do not condemn Jesus for the wrongs he has done, I just recognize that he admitted to not being perfect by reason of logic rather than blindly accepting the interpretations of other men (which says that you trust men over G.d.. being scared to question the Scriptures is a sign of trusting a book, man, over G.d. The Word can only speak when you shed the fear of man.. including the fear of the man named Jesus). :yes:

Once again as someone already addressed you before in this thread you dont answer the question presented before you! Its no different than your mentor. And your belief in free will show more of your ignorance.

But im being to harsh again and not pointing out the obvious!

You want to talk about Jesus start another thread. We are talking bout in this thread something else.

Truth is harsh.