I'd avoid labeling it supernatural and just go with "we don't understand". We don't know if supernatural is even the appropriate term for it.
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Something from nothing, the big bang, science has it all.
- Thread starter Desert Snake
- Start date
FearGod
Freedom Of Mind
FearGod
Freedom Of Mind
Ben Dhyan
Veteran Member
Hi metis....and just how did this dense small volume of mass have its genesis?
metis
aged ecumenical anthropologist
Yo ben,
No one knows for certain, and there are various hypotheses that cosmologists have, although there's no guarantee even any of them are correct. There are some cosmologists who believe we may find some help trying to understand this because of the study of the "afterglow" (radiation given off at the BB itself). I know one cosmologist (Leonard Susskind, who is so optimistic that he said we may actually know what caused it within about 10 years, and that was almost 10 years ago.
OTOH, we may never find out what caused it.
or:
Density, mass per unit volume
or:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Density_(disambiguation)
The volume must be controlled in any comparative analysis.
I still think you're mixing some parameters there.
I think I get the idea,
but I'm not sure about the quantitative relationships that you presented.
Look at the containment parameters, what could be the smallest entity ?
Probably I'm lost in the shuffle, nothing new there, but still unsure of meaning.
~
'mud
Density, mass per unit volume
or:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Density_(disambiguation)
The volume must be controlled in any comparative analysis.
I still think you're mixing some parameters there.
I think I get the idea,
but I'm not sure about the quantitative relationships that you presented.
Look at the containment parameters, what could be the smallest entity ?
Probably I'm lost in the shuffle, nothing new there, but still unsure of meaning.
~
'mud
Ben Dhyan
Veteran Member
How can there be a cause?, A cause would imply a duality...cause and effect....and the cause agency had to exist prior to the genesis of the primordial dense small volume of mass. So then the question would be....how did this causal agency have its genesis?
It is beyond me how science could ever put forward a theory for existence of the cosmos for it to come into existence from non-existence, and have otherwise intelligent people take it on faith to believe it.....no questions asked?
metis
aged ecumenical anthropologist
In a word, "infinity", which is even older than I am.
As far as theistic causation is concerned, sounds nice but it has lots of problems attached to it that are not only unanswerable, but pretty illogical based on what we experience in science. IOW, there simply is no precedence for it.
Can't explain as I gotta go.
oldbadger
Skanky Old Mongrel!
No............ The Big Bang was (is!) a tiny part of God!No, God blew himself up in the big bang.
David M
Well-Known Member
When I grew up, which was nearly 50 years ago we were taught that the vacuum of space definitely did not contain "nothing". Back then it was known that it certainly contained some matter.
Ben Dhyan
Veteran Member
I'm not talking about particles...I am talking about dark energy/zpe omnipresence in which the particles exist...
David M
Well-Known Member
You stated that you were taught that it contained nothing, if you were imprecise in your statement that is down either to you or your teachers who taught you that there was "nothing".
And lets face it, Dark Matter dates back to the 1930's, Quantum foam to the 1950s and the existence of zpe to the start of the 20th Century. So none of these are exactly new concepts.
Ben Dhyan
Veteran Member
The very word vacuum means void, empty....still....look it up. When I read stuff on astronomy, space was considered a vacuum...and no, we weren't taught about dark matter, zpe, qm, casimir effect, etc.. in the 50's.. Even now, the average person of my age is surprised to learn the vacuum of space or between atoms is not empty...
Jumi
Well-Known Member
Of course not. The basic educational systems always lag by decades and frankly many of these things are such that children don't have motivation to learn who just want a regular job and aren't that deeply interested in nature. The ones that go to University and study physics will learn, but they still need to catch up to things not already textbook material if they want to know what the current research points to.
Rick O'Shez
Irishman bouncing off walls
No............ The Big Bang was (is!) a tiny part of God!
No, God left the gas on and the devil lit a match.
oldbadger
Skanky Old Mongrel!
....... there..... I knew it....... there is a God after all....No, God left the gas on and the devil lit a match.
Rick O'Shez
Irishman bouncing off walls
Shad
Veteran Member
The same "self created" principle you invoke can be applied to the universe which we have vastly more evidence for while there is only inferred views of God, via the evidence which is applicable to the universe. Now if this principle is sound then God is unnecessary to explain the universe and redundant