Stuff Republicans say.

[Midnight Rain]

I'm not doing that. I'm looking at the party today.
If political parties don't exist, then it would be hard to make a sweeping accusation of racism against Pubs too.

Yes we can. I stated that we can look at the laws passed by a particular congress where the republican party held a vote together as a political organization. That is a case in which we can isolate a political party. But that political party no longer exists soon as the next congress is in, and then the one after that and after that. And from there we have to look at what was uniform across the party or at least very very very prominent but was not prominent in other congressmen/women of that group. You have to be careful to view an individual as an individual but the accumulative individuals across a single line of a political faction is the only way we can measure a "political party". Well maybe not the "only" way but probably the best way that creates a productive conversation.

Yes, but only the flavor has changed, eg, racial discord panderers like Jesse Jackson & Al Sharpton.

Now we are talking the media. The Media is nothing but a tool used by corporations at the moment to cause sensationalism in the voter population to paint a false picture of the real world today. It is a functional mind control system that helps people to believe what we want them to believe. All while making a buck along the way

there is something going on with the edit option. It keeps auto quoting me at the end of my post.

 

[Revoltingest]

Jackson & Sharpton use the media, but they're nonetheless powerful party aparatchiks. And they were just some of the examples. But racism is the tip of the iceberg (of sins) in both parties.

 

[Midnight Rain]

Jackson & Sharpton use the media, but they're nonetheless powerful party aparatchiks. And they were just some of the examples. But racism is the tip of the iceberg (of sins) in both parties.

I can agree to that. I was simply remarking that Racism is a far more Republican problem than Democrat. The Democrats have their own set of terrible problems.

 

[Revoltingest]

I can agree to that. I was simply remarking that Racism is a far more Republican problem than Democrat.

We'll have to agree to disagree about that.

 

[Midnight Rain]

We'll have to agree to disagree about that.

Seems so.

 

[YmirGF]

I can agree to that. I was simply remarking that Racism is a far more Republican problem than Democrat. The Democrats have their own set of terrible problems.

Only in as much as the Democrats have fabricated and overplayed the race card, tarring and feathering the Republicans in the process.

 

[Midnight Rain]

Only in as much as the Democrats have fabricated and overplayed the race card, tarring and feathering the Republicans in the process.

It is true that the democratic campaigns have hoisted themselves as the champions of equality while painting the republican counterparts as racist or bigoted. However this is a huge grey area that becomes difficult to defend or attack as there is no single 'democrat" or "republican" opinion on race issues. There is platforms but even then it pales. An example of racism or sexism in the laws or bills proposed or struck down by the standing members of the political parties in congress would be the best way to attack or defend a position on the race issue.

"The general tone" is so hard to nail down. Its obvious that more people assume Republicans to be racist and in all honesty this is probably accurate. The republican party is has far more lower income white families in the south where racism kindling is most common. As a member of the south I know it exists and it sickens me. It isn't a majority but the majority of what exists probably exists in the republican party. However the racial issues that you and rev are bringing to the table is ever more difficult to define and quantify racial tensions from the African American and Latino American communities which we have to determine if that is a fight for equality as is assumed by the democrats or is it prodding at racial tensions or both? And to what degree?

 

[esmith]

The linked article is a little strong but it puts across the idea of what is meant by those that say the Democrats platform exhibits a form of racism that assumes that the poor (mostly white) and minorities (mostly black, but rapidly losing ground) can not help themselves and needs the government to provide for them. As one part of the article states

Welfare reform was not an assault on poor people of color. Rather, it was about lifting people (of any race or creed) out of poverty. Conservatives such as Newt Gingrich, Ronald Reagan, and even Calvin Coolidge, always believed the success of a welfare program should be judged by how many people no longer need it. While Newt Gingrich worked on reform that would limit welfare payments, Democrats looked at ways to make poverty more comfortable. Ninety-nine weeks of unemployment (today’s standard) is not designed to promote self-sufficiency; but it is certainly a populist and pandering attempt for votes. Wouldn’t a truly successful nation have little need for government-funded lunch programs, long-term unemployment benefits, and taxpayer-funded entitlements?

Total article is at : Two Centuries of Racism - Brought to You by the Democrat Party - Michael Schaus - Townhall Finance Conservative Columnists and Financial Commentary - Page full

 

[Shadow Wolf]

The linked article is a little strong but it puts across the idea of what is meant by those that say the Democrats platform exhibits a form of racism that assumes that the poor (mostly white) and minorities (mostly black, but rapidly losing ground) can not help themselves and needs the government to provide for them. As one part of the article states

Total article is at : Two Centuries of Racism - Brought to You by the Democrat Party - Michael Schaus - Townhall Finance Conservative Columnists and Financial Commentary - Page full

The reasons we have the welfare we do today is because private job firms are not hiring enough or paying enough. If you work full time, you should make enough to not have to depend on the government for survival. If you work full time, it should be your employers responsibility to make sure that his/her employees make enough to survive, especially if this employer happens to be a million-or-billion dollar company. It's really hard to blame the government over this, when it is private companies who pay very little who are the ones who send people to the welfare office.

 

[esmith]

The reasons we have the welfare we do today is because private job firms are not hiring enough or paying enough. If you work full time, you should make enough to not have to depend on the government for survival. If you work full time, it should be your employers responsibility to make sure that his/her employees make enough to survive, especially if this employer happens to be a million-or-billion dollar company. It's really hard to blame the government over this, when it is private companies who pay very little who are the ones who send people to the welfare office.

The reason firms are not hiring people is that the demand for their product does not justify hiring more . The wages paid are based on numerous parameters,three of the major factors are skills required to do the job. demand for those skills and location of the job. You and a majority that subscribe to the idea that every job must pay a living wage has a major flaw. The only problem is what one considers a "living wage". The area of the country one lives in has a major impact on income requirements. A person living Honolulu (#1 in COL tied with NYC) must make considerable more from Most Overpriced City groceries in Honolulu cost 55.6% more than the national average; utilities 67.9% more. Now back to the "living wage" that the progressives seem to harp on. What is considered a "living wage". Well, one could assume that would mean food and shelter only plus means of transportation to ones place of work. Now does this include a big screen TV with cable, smart phones for members of the household, high speed internet and various other products that are not necessary to "survive". There are many well paying jobs that are going unfilled due to the lack of skills to fill them and the fault lies totally with the populations that are unemployed. If one wants to succeed in today's world requires motivation and hard work coupled with a desire. Take a real close look at those that are unemployable (except for the most menial jobs) or do not have the necessary education to obtain the necessary skills. One of the major factors contributing to poverty is single parent households. According to Single Motherhood the birth rate for single mother has increased along the lines of the poverty rate Single Mother Families and Poverty. It is a established fact that the poverty level is highest among minorities Poverty Rate and the black community is suffering the most. Why is that? Well maybe the following gives a good reason for this Criticizing Black Culture

So your argument that it is the fault of private companies that people are on welfare doesn't really hold water. It is the fault of individual that doesn't get an education, is not motivated , and is not responsible for his or her actions that put them on the welfare rolls. Blaming the business owner for a persons own failure doesn't work.

 

[tytlyf]

Total article is at : Two Centuries of Racism - Brought to You by the Democrat Party - Michael Schaus - Townhall Finance Conservative Columnists and Financial Commentary - Page full

But the southern democratic conservative party during the civil war era isn't the democratic party today. You know that confederate flag that conservatives love? That's a democratic flag. You know that republican president that freed the slaves? He was a progressive and not a conservative.

 

[Dirty Penguin]

My post was about sanctimony & irony, while you seem to suggest excuse making, which would be an incorrect inference.

Not at all. I'm in a thread dedicated to what republicans say. It's not my fault republicans say some racist stuff. But as usual...someone is quick to say...(well the other side does it too)...but no one ever denied that.....and your inference on excuse making is incorrect. Had the dem article been placed in the thread dedicated to what dems say thread and I weighed in then your charge of sanctimonious or excuse making might make since but since we correctly pointed out racist stuff republicans say in a thread dedicated to what republicans say I don't see what argument you or esmith have.

 

[Dirty Penguin]

Jackson & Sharpton use the media, but they're nonetheless powerful party aparatchiks. And they were just some of the examples. But racism is the tip of the iceberg (of sins) in both parties.

In all parties actually....

 

[Dirty Penguin]

Only in as much as the Democrats have fabricated and overplayed the race card, tarring and feathering the Republicans in the process.

We don't need to do that. There's plenty of written as well as video evidence to substantiate the claim....

 

[Shadow Wolf]

If one wants to succeed in today's world requires motivation and hard work coupled with a desire. Take a real close look at those that are unemployable (except for the most menial jobs) or do not have the necessary education to obtain the necessary skills.

It requires more than that. Let's look at my position, for example. I was born with bad knees, I have been told by a doctor I will be lucky to make it through my 30's without needing knee replacement. This no-fault-of-my-own issue has already effected employment in my 20s. I have Asperger's syndrome, which makes socializing difficult, and out of my 15-or-so jobs only two of them I had to go through an interview (every other interviewed for position I did not get). Many people with Asperger's actually have a harder time finding employment and advancements, and increasing the chances of being able to live independently are goals of therapy. I am also a male-to-female transsexual, which has a tremendous bearing on my employability. These are three no-fault-of-my-own issues that all effect what kinds of jobs I will be able to perform and get.
You also seem to have no idea how hard these "low/no skill" jobs are. You may think it's just flipping burgers, but in reality it is flipping burgers while moving over 100 miles an hour in a very hot and unpleasant atmosphere where you have zero time to go pee during a rush (which can be 3 or 4, or more, hours long), you sweat as much as a roofer, you get burns and cuts all the time, and you have to deal with very rude, obnoxious, and hateful people on a regular basis. Anyone who says those jobs are skillless have never had to deal with these incredibly difficult jobs.
And no, skill has very little to do with wages. At my current job I make over 8 an hour and it's the easiest job I have ever had. Often I have to work much harder for less, or a helluva lot harder for a little more. Teachers, even at the university level, are often screwed on pay. The average psychologist income is less than what my dad's income was at Chrysler. Hollywood actors and professional athletes make millions of dollars a year, roofers on average do not even make 50 grand a year. Top Wall Street investors rake in millions and billions while sitting in a cushioned and climate controlled office, factory workers often make poverty wages working in dusty and miserably hot climates. If hard work and skill is what it took, farmers would be some of the wealthiest among us.

So your argument that it is the fault of private companies that people are on welfare doesn't really hold water. It is the fault of individual that doesn't get an education, is not motivated , and is not responsible for his or her actions that put them on the welfare rolls. Blaming the business owner for a persons own failure doesn't work.

That is not how it works. Step down here, to the real world, where good paying jobs are hard to come by. And what of people who have an education but can't find work? What of responsible people who ended up on welfare because of layoffs or company "downsizing?"

Now does this include a big screen TV with cable, smart phones for members of the household, high speed internet and various other products that are not necessary to "survive"

Actually, you have to have phone and internet service to get by in today's world. Even going without a phone that can access email can have consequences.

Now back to the "living wage" that the progressives seem to harp on.

And you accuse me of bias? How about you learn what a progressive is, rather than harp on about the misguided spoon-fed lamestream media definition of progressive? And I want to emphasize, yes, even left-wing and liberal outlets misuse the term.

It is a established fact that the poverty level is highest among minorities Poverty Rate and the black community is suffering the most. Why is that? Well maybe the following gives a good reason for this Criticizing Black Culture

Criticize what? Jazz? Blues? Their authors? Soul Food? Soul Music? Their scientists? Their doctors? I'll give you that their politicians are fair game, as are everyone's politicians. But what is it about black culture we are supposed to criticize? More white people are on welfare, more white people are on drugs, more white people act like jackasses, and it's not black families that are dissolving, it is American families that are dissolving.

Lemon then listed five essential reforms black men need to make in their lives in order to improve themselves and their communities: hike up their pants, remove the n-word from their vocabulary, take care of their communities, finish high school, and lower the rate of children born out of wedlock.
White people are guilty of all of these things.

More than 72% of children in the African Americans are born out of wedlock,” Lemon said. “Studies show that lack of a male role model is an express train right to prison, and the cycle continues.
A statistic with no source and a total bull**** claim. Just because a father is not present does not mean that magically all males vanish from a child's life.

 

[sun rise]

But the southern democratic conservative party during the civil war era isn't the democratic party today. You know that confederate flag that conservatives love? That's a democratic flag. You know that republican president that freed the slaves? He was a progressive and not a conservative.

The parties have swapped positions on any number of issues - this being one. "Obamacare" is actually a Republican idea enacted in Mass but which they immediately denounced as soon as a Democrat adopted their idea.

 

[Revoltingest]

Not at all.

Yes at all.

I don't see what argument you or esmith have.

I gave only a couple examples of Dem Party racism. If you don't believe those, then I doubt that you'd accept the others. Suffice to say that what I see with Dems is similar to Pubs, except that Dems surpass them in overt racism.

 

[Revoltingest]

In all parties actually....

Not the noble & pure Libertarian Party. The only flaws we have are food stains on our shirts, & really bad haircuts. Well, we also tend to wear shoes long past the point where they're worn out.

 

[esmith]

That is not how it works. Step down here, to the real world, where good paying jobs are hard to come by. And what of people who have an education but can't find work? What of responsible people who ended up on welfare because of layoffs or company "downsizing?"

Guess you have a problem researching before making a statement.
Skills Shortage Means Many Jobs Go Unfilled - WSJ

Actually, you have to have phone and internet service to get by in today's world. Even going without a phone that can access email can have consequences.

I agree that in today's modern world a cell phone could be considered a necessity; however a smart phone is not. A simple "dumb phone" (like I have) will work. There are many places that you can rent computer time for a minimal amount a most public libraries have free internet access. So your argument is somewhat moot.

Criticize what? Jazz? Blues? Their authors? Soul Food? Soul Music? Their scientists? Their doctors? I'll give you that their politicians are fair game, as are everyone's politicians. But what is it about black culture we are supposed to criticize? More white people are on welfare, more white people are on drugs, more white people act like jackasses, and it's not black families that are dissolving, it is American families that are dissolving.

Lemon then listed five essential reforms black men need to make in their lives in order to improve themselves and their communities: hike up their pants, remove the n-word from their vocabulary, take care of their communities, finish high school, and lower the rate of children born out of wedlock.
White people are guilty of all of these things.

More than 72% of children in the African Americans are born out of wedlock,” Lemon said. “Studies show that lack of a male role model is an express train right to prison, and the cycle continues.
A statistic with no source and a total bull**** claim. Just because a father is not present does not mean that magically all males vanish from a child's life.

I place the above all in quotes since you failed to differentiate between my link and your response.
Again you are making statements that you have failed to research. If you would just look for the statistics you will discover that the statement about children born out of wedlock is true. I do not see why you do this unless you get so frustrated with the real facts that you just lash out.
Latest Statistics on Out-of-Wedlock Births | National Review Online
'72 Percent' Documentary Confronts The Black Community's Single-Parent 'Epidemic'
Now take a look at the following information and tell me if this does or does not affect the ability to get out of poverty.
Children in single-parent families by race | KIDS COUNT Data Center

 

[sun rise]

Not the noble & pure Libertarian Party. The only flaws we have are food stains on our shirts, & really bad haircuts. Well, we also tend to wear shoes long past the point where they're worn out.

Your #1 sin is that you believe that the human race is better than it really is and that a lot of laws are not necessary evils. Someday soon that won't be the case, but not today. Libertarianism is a noble but unworkable ideal.