Possibly, but that would be the perception nevertheless.
That's funny. Don't know where you got that from.
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Supreme Court to Decide Whether to Kick Trump Off Ballot
- Thread starter We Never Know
- Start date
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
It is quite clear that Trump did abet those trying to overthrow the US government. According to the US Constitution that means he is ineligible to run again. When one argues that because some people cannot be honest or are not that bright or are extremely ignorant and think that enforcing the law on the books in this matter would perceive justice as corruption indicates a hatred for justice.
Even if we ignore the violent Jan 6 insurrection,
there is the greater crime of Trump attempting
a coup by threatening the GA Secretary Of State
if he didn't "find" the needed votes, & ordering
Pence to overturn the election.
And then there were numerous Trump minions
who pretended to be electors, intending to
fraudulently cast votes for him. They're currently
being prosecuted here.
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
People need reminding that there is not yet a conviction.
Lack of conviction doesn't change the reality that
we all, even MAGAs, can see...
- Trump threatened the GA SOS to "find" needed votes.
- Trump ordered Pence to over-turn the election.
Where we disagree is whether this constitutes treason.
MAGAs are in denial about this.
I guess you missed the January 6th Committee's presentation and report to the DOJ. You'll get another chance to have that question answered with the criminal trials. Or, if you're in a hurry, Google "Willard Hotel command center"
Sure it did. It was textbook terrorism: "the unlawful use of violence and intimidation, especially against civilians, in the pursuit of political aims." That's EXACTLY what was attempted.
Disagree again. This was textbook insurrection: "a violent uprising against an authority or government."
Incompetence at attempting a coup isn't a defense. It remains a crime however little chance the insurrection had at succeeding. How about those fake electors and stolen classified documents? How incompetent were those hare-brained schemes, which had zero chance of succeeding, either. Nevertheless, they remain crimes.
Not on that day, January 6th, but Trump was closer to succeeding in stealing the election and the White House than you imply. It was a handful of people that thwarted him - people in Philadelphia, Georgia, Arizona, and Pence.
No, the rule book is being thrown at Trump. He was indicted for breaking the laws, which will lead to his incarceration and impoverishment following verdicts in first-world courts functioning as they were intended.
The ongoing lies of election fraud, which he surely knew wasn't true. That fed these people and their fervor, and poor judgment. Many who were convicted for the Jan 6 attack said they felt duped by Trump. They believed him and his lies. And did you forget the speech Trump gave that morning? Have you forgotten how Trump wanted the armed people to be let into his audience that morning, but secret service wouldn't let them in? Trump wanted to go to the Capitol after his speech but the secret service refused that too, due to the danger. Trump also did not call off the rioters until way late in the day, even though many, including his daughter, were begging him to Tweet something. Instead he Tweeted supporting messages. He's also promised to pardon all of them if he is re-elected.
This is what the USA is facing.
www.nytimes.com
I know polling can be unreliable, but this is a frightening set of data. These states rejected Trump in 2020, but now as he faces serious legal jeopardy he is more popular? If citizens elect this guy then America deserves what it gets. Conservatives are like drug addicts who have to hit bottom before they realize they have a problem. Unfortunately they will take the USA, and many gloabl allies, down with them.
Or could this be a way to pressure Biden to drop out and open the door for a more appealing Democrat?
Trump Leads in 5 Critical States as Voters Blast Biden, Times/Siena Poll Finds (Published 2023)
Voters in battleground states said they trusted Donald J. Trump over President Biden on the economy, foreign policy and immigration, as Mr. Biden’s multiracial base shows signs of fraying.
I know polling can be unreliable, but this is a frightening set of data. These states rejected Trump in 2020, but now as he faces serious legal jeopardy he is more popular? If citizens elect this guy then America deserves what it gets. Conservatives are like drug addicts who have to hit bottom before they realize they have a problem. Unfortunately they will take the USA, and many gloabl allies, down with them.
Or could this be a way to pressure Biden to drop out and open the door for a more appealing Democrat?
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SkepticThinker
Veteran Member
I see a lot of people calling out "kangaroo court" who don't seem to know what it means.
PureX
Veteran Member
That isn't how a constitutional republic works. Even the Supreme Court has to adhere to the dictates of the Constitution. In fact, that's their job. The US is not a pure democracy because a pure democracy is just 'mob rule'. Instead we have a constitutional republic within which the minority is protected from the majority and the individual is protected from the state. The mob does not get to rule because the Constitution overrules them. And protect everyone else from them.
The Supreme Court's job will be to determine if the Constitution forbids Trump from running for public office, or from holding public office. It is clear to me that by his own intention and attempt to deny the American people their right to political process as designed by the Constitution that he has failed to uphold the oath he took when sworn in, to uphold the Constitution. And he is therefor no longer eligible to hold public office, ever again.
Could be.
I don't disagree with you. My post was about the perception by Trump voters if they are denied the ability to vote for their preferred candidate. Like it or not, they are substantial in number. I do believe it would be better for the country as a whole if he were to simply lose the election rather than being taken off the ballot by a court. That action imo would just add more division to an already dangerously divided country.
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
People need to be reminded that a conviction is not necessary.
Sgt. Pepper
All you need is love.
According to Section Three of the Fourteenth Amendment (read it here), a criminal conviction is not a prerequisite for disqualification from office.
Little Dragon
Well-Known Member
People who argue that the voters should decide and not some court, whether Trump should be barred or not.
Forget that their republic is built upon a constitution.
Would these same people say let the voters decide if an 18 year old wanted to be president? or if a foreign born US national, wanted to become president? Since the constitution bars those people from becoming president also.
That argument is thus effectively anti constitutional and by default, anti American.
Just saying.
Forget that their republic is built upon a constitution.
Would these same people say let the voters decide if an 18 year old wanted to be president? or if a foreign born US national, wanted to become president? Since the constitution bars those people from becoming president also.
That argument is thus effectively anti constitutional and by default, anti American.
Just saying.
Clearly you are one of those people .. or .. if not .. then please explain to us what a Kangaroo court means !?
SkepticThinker
Veteran Member
kangaroo court
noun
1: a mock court in which the principles of law and justice are disregarded or perverted
2: a court characterized by irresponsible, unauthorized, or irregular status or procedures
Definition of KANGAROO COURT
a mock court in which the principles of law and justice are disregarded or perverted; a court characterized by irresponsible, unauthorized, or irregular status or procedures… See the full definition
kangaroo court
QUICK REFERENCE
An unofficial court held by a group of people in order to try someone regarded, especially without good evidence, as guilty of a crime or misdemeanour.
Little Dragon
Well-Known Member
You mean ignoring the constitution in order to appease a cult mob?
Not sure that's a terribly good idea.
Setting that kind of precedent.
SkepticThinker
Veteran Member
Don't forget this too:
Georgia election indictment highlights wider attempts to illegally access voting equipment
The new indictment alleging a conspiracy by former President Donald Trump and his allies to overturn the results of the 2020 presidential election in Georgia includes charges against several people accused of illegally accessing voting equipment in one rural county.
There was no insurrection -- there was no violent uprising againt the Gov't -- - as such a thing doesn't exist .. fallacious personification .. How does one act violently against the Gov't ? and as told you previously .. there was no legitimate chance of achieving the goal of taking over the Gov't by violent protest of a Gov't building .. this is pure nonsense on steroids .. and no mens rea .. so no crime.
Your claim that all protests that become violent is "Terrorism" is made up nonsense on steroids .. Police state authoritarianism .. that has turned this absolutely ridiculous and absurd claim into reality. Thats the thing about Totalitarianism -- everything becomes a lie.
why are you talking about Trump on something completely unrelated ? some kind of TDS going on that you just have to talk about him.
Show me "Men's Rea" - for insurrection .. that there was some intent to take over the entire US Gov't via the capital protest -- and good luck friend
