The Brutal Math Of Poverty

[Alceste]

Just a brief detour back to WWII, just to remove my foot from my mouth. The Americans were involved with the Allied invasion of France, as it turns out. Last thing I want to do is disrespect somebody else's grandpa!

 

[Father Heathen]

You make your own luck.

Except for the luck regarding what environment you're born into.

 

[rojse]

Except for the luck regarding what environment you're born into.

Be fair, Father Heathen. People like Paris Hilton worked extremely hard to be rich spoilt brats with few life skills.

 

[Alceste]

Except for the luck regarding what environment you're born into.

And...

Economists have known for a long time that it pays to be tall. Multiple studies have found that an extra inch of height can be worth an extra $1,000 a year or so in wages, after controlling for education and experience. If you're 6 feet tall, you probably earn about $6,000 more than the equally qualified 5-foot-6-inch shrimp down the hall.

As beauty is rewarded, so ugliness is penalized. Ugly women earn about 5 percent less than other women, and ugly men earn about 10 percent less than other men. That's right; the market punishes men more than women for being unattractive. Moreover, men's looks haunt them at every stage of their careers: Better-looking men get more job offers, higher starting salaries, and better raises. For women, good looks will get you better raises but usually not better job offers or starting salaries.

But while men suffer more for being ugly, women—and specifically white women—suffer more for being fat. In a paper from last year, Professor John Cawley found that an extra 65 pounds typically cost a white woman 7 percent of her wages. To put this another way, if you're a seriously overweight white woman, losing 65 pounds is likely to be as lucrative as an extra year of college or three extra years of work experience.

It pays to be tall. - By Steven E. Landsburg - Slate Magazine

http://www.slate.com/id/111445/

This week I decided to analyze the data in a different way, restricting the analysis to respondents with the same highest level of educational attainment.
Here is the shocking conclusion: in the recent years of the GSS (1991 to 2004), for people whose highest level of educational attainment is a bachelor’s degree, there is a negative correlation between intelligence and income. In the 1998 to 2004 data, each point higher on the Wordsum test causes a $1,200 decrease in income.

Half Sigma: Higher intelligence causes lower income (for people with bachelor's degrees), part III


I guess I was wrong about being lucky with that high IQ! Good thing I'm a tall mesomorph - probably all balances out in the end.

 

[Magic Man]

And by the way I'm not flag waving, I'm being told that some countries choose not to put a bunch of resources into their military. I'd say Europe is still quite happy America chose to get involved...for you to sit there and act like our involvement was so unecessary and uneeded is an insult and a disgrace to veterans.

Now the question is why do you see a connection between that first sentence and the second one? Sure, Europe was glad America got involved in WWII. I'm guessing they would have been happy that any other country that wanted to help got involved. How do you see that reflecting on the fact that some countries spend a lot less on military? I'll answer for you: It doesn't.

Canada chooses not to put as much money into the military as the U.S. because they don't need it as much. They don't invade countries for no reason like we do, and they don't **** people off like we do, so there's less chance of them getting attacked. Even if they do get attacked, they know that several other countries will have their back. Simple.

EDIT: OK, sorry, now back to poverty.

 

[Magic Man]

And...

It pays to be tall. - By Steven E. Landsburg - Slate Magazine

Hey, Gorgeous, Here's a Raise! - By Steven E. Landsburg - Slate Magazine

Half Sigma: Higher intelligence causes lower income (for people with bachelor's degrees), part III


I guess I was wrong about being lucky with that high IQ! Good thing I'm a tall mesomorph - probably all balances out in the end.

Yeah, well, I don't know about you, but I actually decided to be white, medium build, at least modestly attractive and 6'2". Doesn't everybody decide those things for themselves?

 

[DallasApple]

And...

It pays to be tall. - By Steven E. Landsburg - Slate Magazine

Hey, Gorgeous, Here's a Raise! - By Steven E. Landsburg - Slate Magazine

Half Sigma: Higher intelligence causes lower income (for people with bachelor's degrees), part III


I guess I was wrong about being lucky with that high IQ! Good thing I'm a tall mesomorph - probably all balances out in the end.

Hmm..thats very interesting.My DIL was just told by her boss she needs to "rethink her wardrobe" and NO is not because her boobs are hanging out.And she is an "operator" she does not meet the public.she is though about 65 lbs overweight and was wearing there "approved" dress style clothing.

Here is the kicker..her boss(male by the way) told her that the clothes were not the problem ..but that maybe she shoud start buying "man sized shirts".

I told her honey..Im not trying to be brutal ..but I think he was telling you that you are fat ..and should lose some weight.

She looked at me and said thats exactly what I thought.

Whatever..

Love

Dallas

 

[DallasApple]

Thats how I got my break..My female boss hired only young attractive "girls" to work for her.And not it wasnt the sex industry..We did secretarial work and answered phones and took orders for computer replacement parts to be shipped all around the country.

But I had a brain to go with my youth and size 3 body.I got "advanced" into the "male only" computer sales area..Because I picked up the terms and learned what I was talking about.

If I had been "fat" I would have never gotten that job in the first place.

The problem was having to put up with the blatant and disgusting sexual harrasment.I have so many exapmles it would blow your mind.And it wasnt someone saying .."hey thats a pretty dress"..Or you look nice today"..

I had 50 year old men when I was 17 passing me notes asking me if they could be my "sugar daddy".The same gorwn man I had to deal with for BUSINEESS reason and when approching him hie sucked on his lips and looked me up and down with a grin while I was trying to get INFORMATION need for my job.

Love

Dallas

 

[Alceste]

Hmm..thats very interesting.My DIL was just told by her boss she needs to "rethink her wardrobe" and NO is not because her boobs are hanging out.And she is an "operator" she does not meet the public.she is though about 65 lbs overweight and was wearing there "approved" dress style clothing.

Here is the kicker..her boss(male by the way) told her that the clothes were not the problem ..but that maybe she shoud start buying "man sized shirts".

I told her honey..Im not trying to be brutal ..but I think he was telling you that you are fat ..and should lose some weight.

She looked at me and said thats exactly what I thought.

Whatever..

Love

Dallas

What an ***. I hope she's planning to ignore it.

 

[DallasApple]

What an ***. I hope she's planning to ignore it.

No she went and bought bigger shirts .I felt so bad for her.She words like a dog.She has 2 jobs.That one I mentioned and another part time at Star Bucks.Apparantly her "fat" is getiing in the way of her stamina and willingness to work long hours.

Love

Dallas

 

[Ciscokid]

Except for the luck regarding what environment you're born into.

Yep, some are dealt a sad hand of cards..........so what are you going to do...pout? Or get off your *** and do something about it?

I don't understand the point of this statement....but then I was in the military...crying "foul" because I had the odds against me would not be an excuse for sitting there and just pouting.

I'm not talking about disadvantaged [medical] people, I'm talking about the folks in the article that this thread is based on.

 

[Ciscokid]

LOL, I know. Basically it went the way it always goes. Somebody (a few people) brought up how well the combination of free market capitalism, high taxes and a strong welfare state works in Denmark, and suddenly some yahoo starts blathering on about how America won WWii all by themselves and if it weren't for them we'd all be speaking German by now and where would Denmark be then and bla bla bla bla bla. It seems some Americans have trouble keeping their militant nationalism in one file and their preferred economic and governance models in another. Can't imagine why that would be.

I know it's a side trip, but I can't let BS like that slide without setting the record straight. My grandfather stormed the beach at Normandy. It's not fair to him to let Americans get away with pretending they won WWII all by themselves.

Anyway, back to poverty! A much more amicable topic.

Who claimed this? If you can quote someone in this thread who stated that it'll ensure me that you're not taking out of your ***.

 

[Alceste]

Who claimed this? If you can quote someone in this thread who stated that it'll ensure me that you're not taking out of your ***.

It's implied in the dragging of WWII (kicking and screaming) into a totally unrelated conversation in the hope of using the US obsession with military spending to demonstrate their system of economic inequality is superior to European models that perform better.

You made that call, not me.

 

[Ciscokid]

It's implied in the dragging of WWII (kicking and screaming) into a totally unrelated conversation in the hope of using the US obsession with military spending to demonstrate their system of economic inequality is superior to European models that perform better.

You made that call, not me.

Ok so you were talking nonsense.

 

[Magic Man]

Yep, some are dealt a sad hand of cards..........so what are you going to do...pout? Or get off your *** and do something about it?

I don't understand the point of this statement....but then I was in the military...crying "foul" because I had the odds against me would not be an excuse for sitting there and just pouting.

I'm not talking about disadvantaged [medical] people, I'm talking about the folks in the article that this thread is based on.

Why do you insist on thsi strawman? How about this: You start a poll and see how many people think that, if you're dealt a bad hand in life, you should just sit around and wait for something good to happen, and how many think you should work hard, especially if you're dealt a bad hand.

It doesn't matter how many times you say it, no one here is advocating just sitting around and hoping for something good. What we are saying, as FH was, is that some people can work hard and not get anywhere because of the bad hand they were dealt, that without some luck, all their hard work is going to get them nowhere.

Any chance you want to respond to what we are saying rather than what you want us to be saying?

Ok so you were talking nonsense.

This would be much more accurate if it had been directed at you.

 

[Father Heathen]

I don't understand the point of this statement....

I'm sure there are a lot of things you don't understand.

 

[Ciscokid]

Why do you insist on thsi strawman? How about this: You start a poll and see how many people think that, if you're dealt a bad hand in life, you should just sit around and wait for something good to happen, and how many think you should work hard, especially if you're dealt a bad hand.

It doesn't matter how many times you say it, no one here is advocating just sitting around and hoping for something good. What we are saying, as FH was, is that some people can work hard and not get anywhere because of the bad hand they were dealt, that without some luck, all their hard work is going to get them nowhere.

Any chance you want to respond to what we are saying rather than what you want us to be saying?

Ok I understand what you're saying, what I'm responding with is that I don't think these people you are referring to are present in this article. They don't appear to be truly working hard at making things better. I may be wrong, I'm just giving my opinion after reading what I read.

This would be much more accurate if it had been directed at you.

I know I'm a pain.

 

[Reverend Rick]

It all boils down to responsibility or the lack there of.

 

[Magic Man]

It all boils down to responsibility or the lack there of.

Yeah, we have to hold these people responsible for not having the intelligence, correct race, correct height, correct gender and for not being brought up in the right class. When will they learn that they have to take responsibility for these things that aren't in any way their fault, so that they can change them and become successful?

 

[Magic Man]

Ok I understand what you're saying, what I'm responding with is that I don't think these people you are referring to are present in this article. They don't appear to be truly working hard at making things better. I may be wrong, I'm just giving my opinion after reading what I read.

That may be, and I'm sure there are a lot of cases where people aren't really working hard and living in poverty. There's also the possibility that for some of them, it's a matter of not knowing how to do things better. They may be working as hard as they can and doing the best they can, but they truly don't understand that they could be doing some things better. It might be a lack of education and it might be a lack of intelligence in some cases.

I know I'm a pain.