The Gospel of John Claims that Jesus is God

[kjw47]

Let's not confuse your Governing Board with Jesus. The two are not the same.




That's not what the bible teaches, is it?

So also the tongue is a small member, yet it boasts of great things. How great a forest is set ablaze by such a small fire! ...James 3:18

Keep your tongue from evil and your lips from speaking deceit. Psalm 34:13

Not many of you should become teachers, my brothers, for you know that we who teach will be judged with greater strictness James 3:1​

Unity,not conformity of mind and thought kjw. You confuse unity and conformity as easily as you confused your Governing Board with Jesus. In fact, had your teachers practiced what they actually teach they would have "conformed" with "Christendom", never strayed from its teachings, and there would be no Jehovah Witnesses today, so none of what you say now makes any sense whatsoever.

So what was the end result of your conformity of thought? Here's just one example:

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You attempted to put words that weren't true smack dab in the middle of Jehovah's mouth! But I suppose it's no big deal because, as you said above, "Lip service accomplishes little".

The truth is, your Organization has not repented of this sin, and since you have "Unity of thought no division" then you haven't repented either. But what does the bible say?

Be not a witness against your neighbor without cause, and do not deceive with your lips. Proverbs 24:28

Lying lips are an abomination to the Lord, but those who act faithfully are his delight. Proverbs 12:22

You shall not swear by my name falsely, and so profane the name of your God: I am the Lord. Leviticus 19:12​

The "Creator's promise", the lie your Organization falsely swore Jehovah made, was not a "mistake" or "error" kjw. It was a purposeful, intentional act, just like their refusal to repent is also a purposeful, intentional act. Until your Organization repents of its profanity it remains in its sin.Of course, if your Organization has repented, please direct me to the article. I'll gladly post it here. But we all know your Organization has never apologized for anything, and in perfect lockstep conformity Jehovah Witnesses tell us there is nothing to apologize for.

This is why we strongly suggest Witnesses not be so quick to peer down their collective nose. No one's asking your Organization to be perfect, just a little less haughty.

I know the GB isn't Jesus. Jesus is my king. So your assumption is false. The GB are the these teachers( Matthew 24:45) Yet Jesus is head of the congregation. Ahead of the teachers he appointed. No they aren't perfect. Satans #1job = attack Jesus seed, relentlessly. He already has the rest. Truths have been revealed, here in these last days( Daniel 12:4) at the proper time. So in reality, this would apply to the teachers Jesus appointed as well-Luke10:16)

 

[Oeste]

I know the GB isn't Jesus. Jesus is my king. So your assumption is false. The GB are the these teachers( Matthew 24:45) Yet Jesus is head of the congregation. Ahead of the teachers he appointed.

Why would Jesus appoint teachers that would try to place lies into Jehovah's mouth?

No they aren't perfect. Satans #1job = attack Jesus seed, relentlessly. He already has the rest. Truths have been revealed, here in these last days( Daniel 12:4) at the proper time.

Why on earth should we believe that it was Jehovah's promised to bring in the new world prior to the 1914 generation passing away? How did this come to be a "revealed truth"?

So in reality, this would apply to the teachers Jesus appointed as well-Luke10:16)

A prophet cannot add or detract from God's word kjw. Only Satan would do that and pronounce it "truth". A prophet is to speak only what God tells them to speak. If they are unwilling or unable to do that, then they shouldn't speak at all.

There shall not be found among you anyone who burns his son or his daughter as an offering, anyone who practices divination or tells fortunes or interprets omens, or a sorcerer a medium or a necromancer or one who inquires of the dead, for whoever does these things is an abomination to the Lord. Deuteronomy 18:10-11​

Remind us...didn't your Governing Board interpret World War 1 as an omen or sign of the end?

 

[kjw47]

Why would Jesus appoint teachers that would try to place lies into Jehovah's mouth?



Why on earth should we believe that it was Jehovah's promised to bring in the new world prior to the 1914 generation passing away? How did this come to be a "revealed truth"?



A prophet cannot add or detract from God's word kjw. Only Satan would do that and pronounce it "truth". A prophet is to speak only what God tells them to speak. If they are unwilling or unable to do that, then they shouldn't speak at all.

There shall not be found among you anyone who burns his son or his daughter as an offering, anyone who practices divination or tells fortunes or interprets omens, or a sorcerer a medium or a necromancer or one who inquires of the dead, for whoever does these things is an abomination to the Lord. Deuteronomy 18:10-11​

Remind us...didn't your Governing Board interpret World War 1 as an omen or sign of the end?

It wasn't the proper time for certain truths to be known. some were hidden until these last days( Daniel 12:4) and revealed-- at the proper time-Matthew 24:45- through these appointed teachers.
Errors have been corrected. The men who made the errors are dead. its 2019, the light is bright.

 

[metis]

It wasn't the proper time for certain truths to be known. some were hidden until these last days( Daniel 12:4) and revealed-- at the proper time-Matthew 24:45- through these appointed teachers.

So, you believe that God purposely hides things from us so as to make us ignorant? To me, that simply doesn't pass the "smell test".

 

[Oeste]

It wasn't the proper time for certain truths to be known.some were hidden until these last days( Daniel 12:4)

So God told them it was a great time to spread untruths in His name because the proper truth had to be hidden?

Errors have been corrected. The men who made the errors are dead.

So the people who tried to stick this lie into Jehovah’s mouth are all dead?:

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Didn’t you help distribute this false “truth” as “the truth”? Didn’t you peddle this door to door as nourishing food from Jehovah or were you not preaching at the time?

This was in your magazines until 1995 kjw, and you're telling us the people who taught this error are all dead??? Do you now speak to us beyond the grave?

its 2019, the light is bright.

So why couldn’t Jehovah Witnesses be honest with us in 1995, and just tell us “Look, it's only 1995 and our light isn’t too bright right now, but if you come back in another 24 years it’ll be a lot brighter!". Wouldn't that have been better than teaching things that weren't true, or putting words into Jehovah's mouth that He did not speak?

Also, can you explain how an untruth like the one above gets brighter? Doesn’t that require more untruth?

 

[Muffled]

Yours is a false belief that is not supported by the scriptures. Matthew 1.

I believe you should try to understand the English language. What a person is called is not necessarily the person's name.

Mat.1:21 She will bear a son, and you shall call his name Jesus, for he will save his people from their sins.”

 

[Muffled]

They shall call his - name- not him, his name. His Father made his name above other names. The Father is the only source of power. Jesus was a Mortal, made lower than the angels while on earth( Hebrews 2:7-9) God did it all through him( Acts 2:22)- Jesus gives all credit to his Father. John 5:30)

I believe they will call Jesus "God with us" because He is.

 

[Muffled]

BELIEVE JESUS--John 20:17, Rev 3:12

I believe you do not have a valid response for what I said.

 

[kjw47]

So, you believe that God purposely hides things from us so as to make us ignorant? To me, that simply doesn't pass the "smell test".

To keep satan and his angels in darkness. The bible teaches even Gods own angels desired to know. 1Peter 1:12)--Not until these last days did truth become abundant. Daniel 12:4)

 

[kjw47]

I believe they will call Jesus "God with us" because He is.

Yes Jesus is his Fathers image(Collosians 1:15) It was his Father who did the things through Jesus!Acts 2:22) That is how God was with us. And one could see the Father in Jesus( John 5:30) 100% the Fathers will. As do true followers( Matthew 7:21-23)

 

[kjw47]

Why would Jesus appoint teachers that would try to place lies into Jehovah's mouth?



Why on earth should we believe that it was Jehovah's promised to bring in the new world prior to the 1914 generation passing away? How did this come to be a "revealed truth"?



A prophet cannot add or detract from God's word kjw. Only Satan would do that and pronounce it "truth". A prophet is to speak only what God tells them to speak. If they are unwilling or unable to do that, then they shouldn't speak at all.

There shall not be found among you anyone who burns his son or his daughter as an offering, anyone who practices divination or tells fortunes or interprets omens, or a sorcerer a medium or a necromancer or one who inquires of the dead, for whoever does these things is an abomination to the Lord. Deuteronomy 18:10-11​

Remind us...didn't your Governing Board interpret World War 1 as an omen or sign of the end?

He mistook Harmageddon for this that occurred-Rev 6- The war in heaven( white horse) set this off. And peace was taken from the earth, ww1--he receives his crown= Jesus, yet Michael took the ride at the war in heaven. Jesus is on the white horse at Har-mageddon.

 

[Oeste]

e mistook Harmageddon for this that occurred-Rev 6-

Who is this "He" and why is "He" speaking words Jehovah did not ask him to speak?

 

[metis]

To keep satan and his angels in darkness. The bible teaches even Gods own angels desired to know. 1Peter 1:12)--Not until these last days did truth become abundant. Daniel 12:4)

Which defies Jesus' teaching that he would guide his Church until the end of time, thus leading to the power of the Holy Spirit given at Pentecost almost 2000 years ago.

 

[kjw47]

Who is this "He" and why is "He" speaking words Jehovah did not ask him to speak?

No mortal on earth knew the explanation for revelation until the proper time. Errors were taught by every supposed christian teacher on earth on the matters of revelation until God revealed them at the proper time. Those that God showed revealed truths to, at the proper time, made correction.

 

[kjw47]

Which defies Jesus' teaching that he would guide his Church until the end of time, thus leading to the power of the Holy Spirit given at Pentecost almost 2000 years ago.

He has guided his church. All through history their have been witnesses of YHVH(Jehovah)Isaiah 43:10, Isaiah 44:8) Rev 1:5)--The great apostasy( son of peredition) stood up (2 Thess 2:3) before the religion Jesus began stood back up here in these last days and corrected the errors brought in centuries ago by the great apostasy)

 

[gnostic]

My thinking is hindered by the fact that I have no reason to trust. For me, aside from the four Gospels, I have reservations about Paul as an Apostle. Not attacking your views at all.

Paul appointed himself apostle.

That’s true.

But the other surviving apostles seemed to accept Paul as one of them...well, that if you believed in the Acts.

 

[gnostic]

In the book of John it's pretty obvious that the author is saying that Jesus is God.

John 1:1 makes that much easily clear. The Word was with God and the Word was God.

Jewish authorship:
The arguments from Arianism that this is speaking of "a" god are flawed for a few reasons. First of all the author is a Jew and that's not a Jewish idea. The author is obviously familiar with the Torah and it's commandments. Including "Hear oh Israel Jehovah our Elohim is one Jehovah." And "Thou shalt have no other elohim before me."

So the concept of two gods is against Judaism and it's silly to think that the Jewish author of John would be promoting the worship of two gods.

Influence from Greek philosophy?
Jewish authorship also casts serious doubt on such ideas as that the author is speaking of the so called "divine logos" of Greek philosophy. If the author is a Jew then what does he have to do with Greek philosophy? So if the author's views on the "Word" can be explained without resorting to Greek philosophy and instead by resorting to Jewish literal; especially the Torah and Tanakh. Then that is what should be done rather than assuming the author is influenced by foreign(gentile, pagan) philosophy.

So in understanding the "Word" that was made flesh we should look to 1st century Jewish ideas of the Word of God.

Context:
Secondly, if the author is really promoting the worship of two gods then we should be able to actually see that in the context. Meaning why would the author just stop with a statement like "The Word was with God and the Word was "a" God"? Especially since this can more easily be translated as "The Word was with God and the Word was God".

Therefore Arianists need more proof to show John actually meant to be speaking of two gods rather than one.

This proof they do not have. In fact when we compare John 10:30 with John 1:1 we see an obvious link. Meaning that the author here is showing us exactly how he views the relationship of the Word with God. Jesus is essentially the Word made flesh, but somehow He is "one" with the Father.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. (John 1:1)
And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth. (John 1:14)
I and my Father are one. (John 10:30)

The truth:
The Jewish concept of "the truth" is that God(Jehovah) is the God of truth. Essentially the truth is God. So when Jesus claims to be " the way, the truth, and the life" It's a claim of divinity. And we further see this in the book of John when Jesus speaks of the "Spirit of truth" that "proceeds from the Father" who they(his disciples) know because He "dwells with them". See: John 14:17, John 15:26, John 16:13. So Jesus is basically claiming here that He is the Spirit of truth that proceeds from the Father (Obviously indwelling human flesh). According to Jesus (in the book of John) He (the Spirit of truth/Jesus) is with them but will be in them. So Jesus says "I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you." (John 14:18)

This is further collaborated in other Jewish writings such as 1st Esdras chapter 4:35-41. God is the "God of truth" and "Great is the Truth and mighty above all things".

The Father revealed in the flesh:
The author of John also makes it kind of obvious that Jesus is claiming to be God revealed in the flesh when Jesus says "Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?" This was in reply to Philip asking Jesus to "show us the Father". (John 14:8-9)

So Jesus the Son of God is "The Word of God" and "the Truth". This is how the Son declares the God that no one can see. (John 1:18) He declares Him just by being. Because He is the "Truth" and the "Word made flesh". In other words, Jesus is all of God that can be seen.

Looking at other writings attributed to John we find that in 1 John 3:1-6 that John makes no distinction between the Father and the Son. But speaks of them as One.

1 John 3 King James Version (KJV)
3 Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.
2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.
3 And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.
4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.
5 And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.

Personally, I think John 1 in regarding to the Word or Logos to be nothing more than allegory...therefore shouldn’t be taken literally.

 

[Oeste]

No mortal on earth knew the explanation for revelation until the proper time.

Then why did the Watchtower lie and claim they knew?

Errors were taught by every supposed christian teacher on earth on the matters of revelation until God revealed them at the proper time.

Baloney. Only the Watchtower claimed that Jehovah promised to bring in paradise before the generation of 1914 passed away, and we told you He promised no such thing.

Every Christian teacher on earth told you there was no such promise, and every Christian teacher on earth was correct. Your Organization's leaders were headstrong and refused to listen.

The only thing that's revealed anything to your Organization is the calendar.

Those that God showed revealed truths to, at the proper time, made correction.

There was never a proper time to show an improper truth kjw47, and unless and until your Organization repents, it remains in its sin.

 

[pearl]

That’s true.

But the other surviving apostles seemed to accept Paul as one of them...well, that if you believed in the Acts.

Yes, he simply was not one of the Twelve. But according to him he did experience the risen Christ who sent him on his mission.

 

[gnostic]

Yes, he simply was not one of the Twelve. But according to him he did experience the risen Christ who sent him on his mission.

If experiencing the “risen Christ” was prerequisite for being an apostle, then Mary Magdalene would be one, since she was the first to be present in his resurrection.