The Jehovah's witnesses and the rest. What's the stumper?

[metis]

If we as Catholics supposedly don't teach and follow the scriptures, let me show the order of the mass:
Order of Mass
In the Roman Rite, the Mass is made up of two principal parts: the Liturgy of the Word and the Liturgy of the Eucharist. It begins with the Introductory Rites and ends with the Concluding Rites.

Another way of dividing a Mass is into its "ordinary" parts—those texts which, with some variations, are part of the Mass on a daily basis—and its "proper" parts—the texts of prayers and selection of Scripture readings proper to the specific feast, feria or other occasion being observed.

Introductory Rites

• Entrance
• Greeting
• Penitential Act
• Glory to God

Liturgy of the Word

• First Scripture Reading
• Responsorial Psalm
• Second Scriptural Reading (on Sundays and solemnities)
• Gospel Acclamation
• Gospel Reading
• Homily (must be based on the Gospel and at least one other reading)
• Profession of Faith (on Sundays, solemnities, and special occasions)
• Universal Prayer

Liturgy of the Eucharist

• Presentation of the Gifts and Preparation of the Altar
• Prayer over the Offerings
• Eucharistic Prayer
  • Preface
  • Holy, Holy, Holy
  • First half of prayer, including Consecration
  • Mystery of Faith
  • Second half of prayer, ending with Doxology
• The Lord's Prayer
• Sign of Peace
• Lamb of God
• Communion
• Prayer after Communion

Concluding Rites

• Optional announcements
• Greeting and Blessing
• Dismissal

Gee, for a people who supposedly don't follow the scriptures, we seem to spend a lot of time on them at every single mass.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

And Jesus said "judge ye not...", but apparently you never made it that far in your reading.

Of course where 'personal judgement' of another is concerned we are Not to impute a wrong or a bad motive to another.
However, we are Not to judge God's judgement on matters as recorded in Scripture.

 

[exchemist]

no , not really. when i was looking up Mary worship, the words were all ready there. its been pointed out to you that the church is misleading you. what are you going to do about it ?
Rev. 18:4
"And I heard another voice out of heaven say: “Get out of her, my people, if you do not want to share with her in her sins, and if you do not want to receive part of her plagues."
if you are not one of his people,,,,,,,,stay right where you are.

What has a reference in Revelation about the Roman Empire of the time got to do with any of this?

You - or rather "ya" - said ya had not coined the term extreme veneration in this discussion, and then ya admitted ya had. I suggest ya make ya mind up.

But, to be serious for a moment, nobody in the church is "misleading" me, I do assure you: I make up my own mind what doctrines I consider reasonable. But this is not about me, it's about your ideas about what Catholics believe, some of which are incorrect. Metis and I are trying to set you straight on that.

Neither of us care about what faith you choose to follow, but we both think it would do ya a favour if ya could at least try to understand Catholicism correctly. That's all.

 

[cataway]

What has a reference in Revelation about the Roman Empire of the time got to do with any of this?

You - or rather "ya" - said ya had not coined the term extreme veneration in this discussion, and then ya admitted ya had. I suggest ya make ya mind up.

But, to be serious for a moment, nobody in the church is "misleading" me, I do assure you: I make up my own mind what doctrines I consider reasonable. But this is not about me, it's about your ideas about what Catholics believe, some of which are incorrect. Metis and I are trying to set you straight on that.

Neither of us care about what faith you choose to follow, but we both think it would do ya a favour if ya could at least try to understand Catholicism correctly. That's all.

ok ....................you are "misleading" yourself . is that supposed to be all right? if i were to see some one walking into what i know could injure them should i stand watching like one cow watching another cow?? i think not .
Is it not the responsibility of all Christians to “readjust” or to open the eye's of some one about to take a “false step”?
the road to life is ''not'' broad and spacious. in fact it can be down right difficult .yet easer if some one says look out for this or for that.

 

[exchemist]

ok ....................you are "misleading" yourself . is that supposed to be all right? if i were to see some one walking into what i know could injure them should i stand watching like one cow watching another cow?? i think not .
Is it not the responsibility of all Christians to “readjust” or to open the eye's of some one about to take a “false step”?
the road to life is ''not'' broad and spacious. in fact it can be down right difficult .yet easer if some one says look out for this or for that.

Two things may be getting confused here.

1) What @metis and I have said to you about Catholicism can easily be verified from independent sources. So we are not misleading ourselves about what it teaches (though we may be oversimplifying a bit I suppose).

2) If on the other hand, you accept we have stated the teaching correctly, but you want now to argue that the teaching is itself wrong, then that is another conversation. (Misinterpreting a verse from that old man's acid trip of Revelation is a poor start, on your part.)

 

[URAVIP2ME]

................. (Misinterpreting a verse from that old man's acid trip of Revelation is a poor start, on your part.)

Because John wrote the gospel according to John ' after ' he wrote Revelation does Not add up to that old man's acid trip of Revelation.
As with the rest of the Bible, Revelation also has corresponding cross-reference verses to other Bible books.
Revelation basically means a revealing. As far as the book of Revelation it is a revealing about the Bible's happy climax.- Revelation 22:2
Revelation was given and written in very-vivid word pictures, No acid tip.
As the people of ancient Babylon migrated away from ancient Babylon they took with them their religious practices and ideas and spread them world wide into a greater religious Babylon or as Revelation says: Babylon the Great.
This is why we see so many similar or overlapping religious ideas and practices spread throughout the world today.
Thus, the command of Revelation 18:4 to ' get out of her ' (Babylon the Great) is a reference to get out of any religion conflicting with Scripture.
Because of Babylon the Great thinking she sits as some sort of religious 'queen' ( Revelation 18:7 B ) the world's religions think they are permanent.
So, it will come as quite a shock when the political 'kings' surprisingly turns on the religious world.
Hold on to your hat because there is No misinterpreting of 1 Thessalonians 5:2-3 that when the powers that be will be saying, " Peace and Security..." that is going to be the precursor to the coming 'great tribulation' of Revelation 7:14,9 before Jesus, as Prince of Peace, takes the action to usher in global Peace on Earth among persons of goodwill. This is a reason why we are all invited to pray the invitation of Rev. 22:20 for Jesus to come ! And he will !

 

[Dogknox20]

I believe that is baloney.

The Churchi s the body of Christ but it is not limited to the RCC. The fact is that the RCC has had members that were not really a part of the body but just part of the institution. I would guess that there are thousands like that even today.

I don't suppose you ever tried to figure out what the keys were , did you?

Peter was just one of many shepherds. He was not even the founder of the Roman church and considering he wasn't the leader of the church in Jerusalem I believe it is safe to say he wasn't the leader of the church in Rome either.

Muffled right off the bat... I must remind you; "Jesus built only one Church he has ONLY ONE body"! Yes Peter was NOT the founder of the Catholic Church "Jesus was the founded"! Jesus handed the Keys to heaven directly to Peter the ROCK! Jesus built his holy church ON ROCK not on sand.. Jesus' Holy Catholic Church will never fail! "The gates of hell will NOT prevail"!

The Church Jesus built can only be; the One Holy Catholic Apostolic Church it is the ONLY Church with roots going all the way back to Peter and thus Jesus! ALL....
Muffled all other churches were started by men.. Luther, Smith, King Henry, Russel, White, Calvin.. etc etc etc THOUSANDS of man made churches all CLAIM they have the ONLY Truth but not even two believe the same things!
All man made churches claim "Jesus failed to establish a church" all claim they MUST come to Jesus' rescue and "RE-FORM" what Jesus lost! AS IF...
Muffled as if Satan had somehow overpowered Jesus and Satan TOOK Jesus' holy body from Jesus!

Jesus is addressing this to HIS CHURCH... Matthew 28:20 teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I commanded you: and lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world.

Muffled I am with you always, even unto the end of the world This means Jesus will never leave his Holy Catholic Church built on ROCK!
Muffled I am with you always, even unto the end of the world This means Jesus is STILL with his One Holy Catholic Apostolic Church today! It means there is no need to "RE-FORM" Jesus' church!
It means ALL the thousands of Man made churches are not needed, it means they MUST reject the scriptures God' holy word to remain outside of Jesus' Holy Catholic body!!

 

[exchemist]

Because John wrote the gospel according to John ' after ' he wrote Revelation does Not add up to that old man's acid trip of Revelation.
As with the rest of the Bible, Revelation also has corresponding cross-reference verses to other Bible books.
Revelation basically means a revealing. As far as the book of Revelation it is a revealing about the Bible's happy climax.- Revelation 22:2
Revelation was given and written in very-vivid word pictures, No acid tip.
As the people of ancient Babylon migrated away from ancient Babylon they took with them their religious practices and ideas and spread them world wide into a greater religious Babylon or as Revelation says: Babylon the Great.
This is why we see so many similar or overlapping religious ideas and practices spread throughout the world today.
Thus, the command of Revelation 18:4 to ' get out of her ' (Babylon the Great) is a reference to get out of any religion conflicting with Scripture.
Because of Babylon the Great thinking she sits as some sort of religious 'queen' ( Revelation 18:7 B ) the world's religions think they are permanent.
So, it will come as quite a shock when the political 'kings' surprisingly turns on the religious world.
Hold on to your hat because there is No misinterpreting of 1 Thessalonians 5:2-3 that when the powers that be will be saying, " Peace and Security..." that is going to be the precursor to the coming 'great tribulation' of Revelation 7:14,9 before Jesus, as Prince of Peace, takes the action to usher in global Peace on Earth among persons of goodwill. This is a reason why we are all invited to pray the invitation of Rev. 22:20 for Jesus to come ! And he will !

Many modern scholars would not agree that John the Evangelist and John of Patmos were the same person. Revelation is written in a totally different, over-the-top, dreamlike, style from the thoughtful, theological style of St. John's Gospel. (Hence my description of Revelation as an old man's acid trip.)

Revelation appears to contain numerous references to the Roman Empire, and to the emperors Nero and Domitian in particular. The latter was emperor at the time the author is thought to have been exiled - by the Roman State - to Patmos. All this "whore of Babylon etc" stuff seems to relate to the empire: he seems very bitter about the Roman Empire and to rail against it wildly.

But Revelation is notoriously obscure, lending itself to being used by various extreme Protestant sects to attach a variety of fanciful and spurious meanings to it. It is noteworthy that the only strands of Christianity to make great use of use of Revelation are sects like the 7th Day Adventists and sundry nutty millenarians.

 

[cataway]

"But Revelation is notoriously obscure," .

that may be true to you. the JW's are the only ones with a handle on that book.
you can and should expect your religion and many ,many others to be all but gone ,even removed . maybe yet in your life time .
religions have been a problem for governments for a long time ,they always run into conflict with each other . some times helping some times hindering what big government wants to do . you your self may of had misgivings on what government should do. perhaps you have even heard form the pulpit opinions being voiced on what should be done , or even who should be running a country .
Oh yes ................,it will bother you when she is gone .yet, it will happen.

frankly, i dont care if you dont like it.

 

[metis]

JW's believe in what the Governing Body of that denomination tells them to believe, and any dissenting from their teachings can get them into trouble.

The Book of Revelation was written for a purpose, and that purpose was to encourage the Church that was under siege by the Roman Empire ("Babylon the Great") to stay the course and keep the faith. The book references events and groups back at the end of the 1st century, but written in very symbolic ways. Why was it done that way? Some theologians believe it would be written in terms that the early Church would understand but not those outside the Church. IOW, like an "underground paper", which we've seen used in other locations at other times by other groups.

So, with Revelation, the basic message is sorta like "Stay the course, keep the faith, and God has your back whereas even death isn't the end for you".

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Many modern scholars would not agree that John the Evangelist and John of Patmos were the same person. Revelation is written in a totally different, over-the-top, dreamlike, style from the thoughtful, theological style of St. John's Gospel. (Hence my description of Revelation as an old man's acid trip.)
Revelation appears to contain numerous references to the Roman Empire, and to the emperors Nero and Domitian in particular. The latter was emperor at the time the author is thought to have been exiled - by the Roman State - to Patmos. All this "whore of Babylon etc" stuff seems to relate to the empire: he seems very bitter about the Roman Empire and to rail against it wildly...........................

What do modern scholars have to do with what is already recorded in Scripture _________Support for the Biblical is found in the corresponding or parallel cross-reference verses and passages and Not in scholars or other belief systems.
Revelation is Not out of harmony with the rest of Scripture.

Please post one reference about the Roman Empire that you have in mind.

Note: the ' whore of Babylon ' is world wide because earth's kings (political ) commit fornication with her according to Revelation 17:2
This ' whore ' sits on MANY waters as per Revelation 17:1 and those figurative ' waters ' are peoples/nations according to Revelation 17:15

 

[URAVIP2ME]

JW's believe in what the Governing Body of that denomination tells them............................
The Book of Revelation was written for a purpose, and that purpose was to encourage the Church that was under siege by the Roman Empire ("Babylon the Great") to stay the course and keep the faith...................

According to the Bible Revelation was Not written for the first century (Revelation was written at the end of the first century)
The setting or the time frame for Revelation 1:10 is set for our day, our time frame.
A person can find what Jehovah's Witnesses believe about Revelation at www.jw.org

 

[metis]

Note: the ' whore of Babylon ' is world wide because earth's kings (political ) commit fornication with her according to Revelation 17:2
This ' whore ' sits on MANY waters as per Revelation 17:1 and those figurative ' waters ' are peoples/nations according to Revelation 17:15

That's really not true as I've previously posted.

World leaders that did not and have not undermined the faith were not cited as being evil, which is why Paul said that "authority" must be respected, even though the greater authority was and is God through Jesus' teachings. This approach is compatible with the respect for authority found in Torah whereas, for example, David was held in very high esteem, as was Cyrus, a non-Jewish leader, who allowed Jews to leave Babylon to return back to eretz Israel.

 

[metis]

According to the Bible Revelation was Not written for the first century (Revelation was written at the end of the first century)

Which is what I said: "The book references events and groups back at the end of the 1st century...". I never stated nor implied that it is was only for the first century-- actually quite the opposite if one reads on through my entire post

The setting or the time frame for Revelation 1:10 is set for our day, our time frame.

The lessons that can and should be learned can apply to any day and age as this is why the Bible was written in the first place-- to spread the Word.

 

[cataway]

JW's believe in what the Governing Body of that denomination tells them to believe, and any dissenting from their teachings can get them into trouble.

The Book of Revelation was written for a purpose, and that purpose was to encourage the Church that was under siege by the Roman Empire ("Babylon the Great") to stay the course and keep the faith. The book references events and groups back at the end of the 1st century, but written in very symbolic ways. Why was it done that way? Some theologians believe it would be written in terms that the early Church would understand but not those outside the Church. IOW, like an "underground paper", which we've seen used in other locations at other times by other groups.

So, with Revelation, the basic message is sorta like "Stay the course, keep the faith, and God has your back whereas even death isn't the end for you".

[heavy on the sarcasm] do you mean to say there's is a rule book ! ?
Pff & Pfft

it would seem you really don't have a clue who the JW's are . have you listen to church rhetoric for so long that you now believe the lie's you have been told ? its sad really sad

 

[metis]

[heavy on the sarcasm] do you mean to say there's is a rule book ! ?
Pff & Pfft

it would seem you really don't have a clue who the JW's are . have you listen to church rhetoric for so long that you now believe the lie's you have been told ? its sad really sad

The information comes from not only my study from non-religious sources but also from two sets of families who lived both next to me and across the street from me who left the JW's, including discussing with them why they left.

As far as my Church is concerned, I never heard even one statement from any priest or bishop against the JW's, nor read about the JW's in any any Catholic book, thus your assumption that I have learned this from them is simply a dishonest fabrication from you, and you've done this before. If the mark of your faith is to be dishonest, this is not only on you but on the Governing Body that teaches you such dishonesty is somehow morally acceptable. Lying in the name of "Jehovah"-- ain't that just "cute" of you.

Also, the question in your first question that says "[heavy on the sarcasm] do you mean to say there's is a rule book ! ?
Pff & Pfft" is so utterly nonsensical. Revelation, much like the entire Bible, is a book of faith that includes how we should be believing and living. You don't get that?

[continued next post]

 

[metis]

@cataway here:
The Governing Body is said to provide "spiritual food" for Jehovah's Witnesses worldwide.[62][63][64] Until late 2012, the Governing Body described itself as the representative[49][65] and "spokesman" for God's "faithful and discreet slave class" (Jehovah's Witnesses who profess to be anointed) who are collectively said to be God's "prophet"[66] and "channel for new spiritual light".[67][68] The Governing Body does not consult with the other anointed Witnesses whom it was said to represent when formulating policy and doctrines or approving material for publications and conventions; the authority of the Governing Body was presumed to be analogous to that of the older men of Jerusalem in cases such as the first-century circumcision issue.[69] The majority of Witnesses who profess to be anointed have no authority to contribute to the development or change of doctrines.[70][71][72] Anointed Witnesses are instructed to remain modest and avoid "wildly speculating about things that are still unclear," instead waiting for God to reveal his purposes[72] in The Watchtower.[73]

In 2009, The Watchtower indicated that the dissemination of "new spiritual light" is the responsibility of only "a limited number" of the "slave class", asking: "Are all these anointed ones throughout the earth part of a global network that is somehow involved in revealing new spiritual truths? No."[69] In 2010 the society said that "deep truths" were discerned by "responsible representatives" of the "faithful and discreet slave class" at the group's headquarters, and then considered by the entire Governing Body before making doctrinal decisions.[74] In August 2011, the Governing Body stated that "we have no way of knowing the exact number of anointed ones on earth; nor do we need to know", and that it "does not maintain a global network of anointed ones."[75] At the 2012 Annual Meeting of the Watch Tower Society, the "faithful and discreet slave" was redefined as referring to the Governing Body only and the terms are now synonymous.[76] -- Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses - Wikipedia

If you disagree with the above, then please provide evidence of such.

 

[exchemist]

What do modern scholars have to do with what is already recorded in Scripture _________Support for the Biblical is found in the corresponding or parallel cross-reference verses and passages and Not in scholars or other belief systems.
Revelation is Not out of harmony with the rest of Scripture.

Please post one reference about the Roman Empire that you have in mind.

Note: the ' whore of Babylon ' is world wide because earth's kings (political ) commit fornication with her according to Revelation 17:2
This ' whore ' sits on MANY waters as per Revelation 17:1 and those figurative ' waters ' are peoples/nations according to Revelation 17:15

OK, after 5 seconds on the web I find this, on Wiki:

"Many Biblical scholars[6][7] believe that "Babylon" is a metaphor for the pagan Roman Empire at the time it persecuted Christians, before the Edict of Milan in 313. Some biblical scholars recognize that “Babylon” is a cipher for Rome or the Roman Empire but believe Babylon is not limited to the Roman city of the first century. Craig Koester says outright that “the whore is Rome, yet more than Rome.”[8] It “is the Roman imperial world, which in turn represents the world alienated from God.”[9] James L. Resseguie says that Babylon “is not merely a representation of the Roman Empire.” It is “the city of this world” and a cipher for “the tyrannical ways of evil.”[10] Perhaps the phrase is specifically referencing some aspect of Rome's rule (brutality, greed, paganism). Some exegetes interpret the passage as a scathing critique of a servant people of Rome who do the Empire's bidding, interpreting that the author of Revelation was speaking of the Herodians—a party of Jews friendly to Rome and open to its influence, like the Hellenizers of centuries past—and later, corrupt Hasmoneans, where the ruler of Jerusalem or Roman Judea exercised his power at the pleasure of the Roman emperor, and was dependent on Roman influence, like Herod the Great in the Gospel of Luke.

In 4 Ezra,[11][12] 2 Baruch[13] and the Sibylline Oracles,[14] "Babylon" is a cryptic name for Rome.[15] Reinhard Feldmeier speculates that "Babylon" is used to refer to Rome in the First Epistle of Peter (1 Peter 5:13).[16] In Revelation 17:9 it is said that she sits on "seven mountains",[17] typically understood as the seven hills of Rome.[18][19][20][21][22] A Roman coin minted under the Emperor Vespasian (ca. 70 AD) depicts Rome as a woman sitting on seven hills.[23]

According to the International Standard Bible Encyclopedia, "The characteristics ascribed to this Babylon apply to Rome rather than to any other city of that age: (a) as ruling over the kings of the earth (Revelation 17:18); (b) as sitting on seven mountains (Revelation 17:9); (c) as the center of the world's merchandise (Revelation 18:3, 11–13); (d) as the corrupter of the nations (Revelation 17:2; 18:3; 19:2); (e) as the persecutor of the saints (Revelation 17:6)."[24]

According to Eusebius of Caesarea Babylon would be Rome or the Roman Empire:

"And Peter makes mention of Mark in his first epistle which they say that he wrote in Rome itself, as is indicated by him, when he calls the city, by a figure, Babylon, as he does in the following words: «The church that is at Babylon, elected together with you, salutes you; and so does Marcus my son.»(1 Peter 5:13)"[25]"

From this link: Whore of Babylon - Wikipedia

Or, more generally on the subject of Revelation, there is this: Book of Revelation - Summary, Meaning, Study Bible Chapters Online

All you have to do is spend 15 minutes doing a little bit of reading around the subject.

 

[cataway]

@cataway here:
The Governing Body is said to provide "spiritual food" for Jehovah's Witnesses worldwide.[62][63][64] Until late 2012, the Governing Body described itself as the representative[49][65] and "spokesman" for God's "faithful and discreet slave class" (Jehovah's Witnesses who profess to be anointed) who are collectively said to be God's "prophet"[66] and "channel for new spiritual light".[67][68] The Governing Body does not consult with the other anointed Witnesses whom it was said to represent when formulating policy and doctrines or approving material for publications and conventions; the authority of the Governing Body was presumed to be analogous to that of the older men of Jerusalem in cases such as the first-century circumcision issue.[69] The majority of Witnesses who profess to be anointed have no authority to contribute to the development or change of doctrines.[70][71][72] Anointed Witnesses are instructed to remain modest and avoid "wildly speculating about things that are still unclear," instead waiting for God to reveal his purposes[72] in The Watchtower.[73]

In 2009, The Watchtower indicated that the dissemination of "new spiritual light" is the responsibility of only "a limited number" of the "slave class", asking: "Are all these anointed ones throughout the earth part of a global network that is somehow involved in revealing new spiritual truths? No."[69] In 2010 the society said that "deep truths" were discerned by "responsible representatives" of the "faithful and discreet slave class" at the group's headquarters, and then considered by the entire Governing Body before making doctrinal decisions.[74] In August 2011, the Governing Body stated that "we have no way of knowing the exact number of anointed ones on earth; nor do we need to know", and that it "does not maintain a global network of anointed ones."[75] At the 2012 Annual Meeting of the Watch Tower Society, the "faithful and discreet slave" was redefined as referring to the Governing Body only and the terms are now synonymous.[76] -- Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses - Wikipedia

If you disagree with the above, then please provide evidence of such.

your saying there are some rules in that ?

 

[cataway]

OK, after 5 seconds on the web I find this, on Wiki:

"Many Biblical scholars[6][7] believe that "Babylon" is a metaphor for the pagan Roman Empire at the time it persecuted Christians, before the Edict of Milan in 313. Some biblical scholars recognize that “Babylon” is a cipher for Rome or the Roman Empire but believe Babylon is not limited to the Roman city of the first century. Craig Koester says outright that “the whore is Rome, yet more than Rome.”[8] It “is the Roman imperial world, which in turn represents the world alienated from God.”[9] James L. Resseguie says that Babylon “is not merely a representation of the Roman Empire.” It is “the city of this world” and a cipher for “the tyrannical ways of evil.”[10] Perhaps the phrase is specifically referencing some aspect of Rome's rule (brutality, greed, paganism). Some exegetes interpret the passage as a scathing critique of a servant people of Rome who do the Empire's bidding, interpreting that the author of Revelation was speaking of the Herodians—a party of Jews friendly to Rome and open to its influence, like the Hellenizers of centuries past—and later, corrupt Hasmoneans, where the ruler of Jerusalem or Roman Judea exercised his power at the pleasure of the Roman emperor, and was dependent on Roman influence, like Herod the Great in the Gospel of Luke.

In 4 Ezra,[11][12] 2 Baruch[13] and the Sibylline Oracles,[14] "Babylon" is a cryptic name for Rome.[15] Reinhard Feldmeier speculates that "Babylon" is used to refer to Rome in the First Epistle of Peter (1 Peter 5:13).[16] In Revelation 17:9 it is said that she sits on "seven mountains",[17] typically understood as the seven hills of Rome.[18][19][20][21][22] A Roman coin minted under the Emperor Vespasian (ca. 70 AD) depicts Rome as a woman sitting on seven hills.[23]

According to the International Standard Bible Encyclopedia, "The characteristics ascribed to this Babylon apply to Rome rather than to any other city of that age: (a) as ruling over the kings of the earth (Revelation 17:18); (b) as sitting on seven mountains (Revelation 17:9); (c) as the center of the world's merchandise (Revelation 18:3, 11–13); (d) as the corrupter of the nations (Revelation 17:2; 18:3; 19:2); (e) as the persecutor of the saints (Revelation 17:6)."[24]

According to Eusebius of Caesarea Babylon would be Rome or the Roman Empire:

"And Peter makes mention of Mark in his first epistle which they say that he wrote in Rome itself, as is indicated by him, when he calls the city, by a figure, Babylon, as he does in the following words: «The church that is at Babylon, elected together with you, salutes you; and so does Marcus my son.»(1 Peter 5:13)"[25]"

From this link: Whore of Babylon - Wikipedia

Or, more generally on the subject of Revelation, there is this: Book of Revelation - Summary, Meaning, Study Bible Chapters Online

All you have to do is spend 15 minutes doing a little bit of reading around the subject.

yawn.