The Little Horn of Revelation

[sooda]

Alexander was a Macedonian. The Doric Spartans came from Macedonia. Conquered doesn't mean the same thing to everyone. Some say he only passed through Palestine on his way to Egypt. Some say he went out of his way to stop off at Jerusalem and bow to the temple. Some say that the Greeks say nothing about Alexander and Jerusalem. Some say that Alexander was pretty much like Rome, in that he let them keep their laws and added Macedonian overlords to the mix... taking taxes which were then called tribute. (shrug) Not much of a bondage.

I've heard about the Decapolis, but the Greeks isn't a history I care to investigate. People play fast and loose with ancient history, confusing Pelasgian Javan with its Indo-Iranian Greek supplanters.

On the other hand, if Ridgeway is right (in 'The Early Age of Greece'), the Greeks came from Halstadt, had iron weapons, and made Celtic jewelry. IMO, that pretty much makes them relatives to the Cymry, unless they copied what they found. But Davies' theory (in 'Celtic Researches') is that Riphath is Slavic, Ashkenaz is Cymry, and Togarmah is the Germans... which makes Riphath the Greeks, if you go by who owned the land. The Ligurians were the original Latins, who moved the Iberians east and had Turdetani and Turduli, and Celtica and Celto-Iberia. And Latin is the language we find on the monuments in Britain. Even the Belgae kings had Latin names. But the Druids used the Greek letters, and so did Gaul.

It gets even stranger, when you read that the Cymry match the description of the Pelasgians. And that the Pelasgians had Zeus and the Oak Trees, just as the Druids did (Cook, 'Zeus, Jupiter and the Oak').

THIS is the tip of the iceberg, as to why I question the identity of the Greeks.

You sound terribly scattered.

Why did you bring up "bondage"? Is that your invention?

 

[OtherSheep]

You sound terribly scattered.

Why did you bring up "bondage"? Is that your invention?

One man's scattered is another man's growth. You can't grow without changing, IMHO. One new piece to the puzzle, means discarding or moving other pieces... and a new search to fill in the void. I edited the post to which you've replied, BTW... maybe that will help you to see what I see?

The Revelation says by the sword or by captivity... this theme runs throughout Prophecy. Obviously, "by the sword" needs no more warning, since we are told that those who live by the sword will die by the sword... and they loved not their lives unto death.

But captivity/bondage will come to those who have led away captive... this speaks to those nations who have actually done that to other nations. It's these nations that are the metals of Daniel and probably the horns of Revelation. Babylon, Persia, Greece and Rome have done so, according to Daniel... and according to secular history, as well. The Ionians fled from the Greeks to Asia Minor... and faced the Persians there.

So... given this theory... which nations have removed other peoples from their lands? By this day and time, all of them. But, since Revelation speaks of the time of Jacob's trouble, it's probably about whomever Jacob turns out to be. And those who have enslaved or removed them.

This is why I want to know who's really who, what's really where.

 

[sooda]

One man's scattered is another man's growth. You can't grow without changing, IMHO. One new piece to the puzzle, means discarding or moving other pieces... and a new search to fill in the void. I edited the post to which you've replied, BTW... maybe that will help you to see what I see?

The Revelation says by the sword or by captivity... this theme runs throughout Prophecy. Obviously, "by the sword" needs no more warning, since we are told that those who live by the sword will die by the sword... and they loved not their lives unto death.

But captivity/bondage will come to those who have led away captive... this speaks to those nations who have actually done that to other nations. It's these nations that are the metals of Daniel and probably the horns of Revelation. Babylon, Persia, Greece and Rome have done so, according to Daniel... and according to secular history, as well. The Ionians fled from the Greeks to Asia Minor... and faced the Persians there.

So... given this theory... which nations have removed other peoples from their lands? By this day and time, all of them. But, since Revelation speaks of the time of Jacob's trouble, it's probably about whomever Jacob turns out to be. And those who have enslaved or removed them.

This is why I want to know who's really who, what's really where.

Its not that complicated..


B414 -- The History of the Levant from Alexander the Great ...
www.theology.edu/b414.htm
Alexander the Great was ruler of Macedonia and later ruler of Greece and the entire civilized world (from the Tiber to the Tigris -- as one writer has said). Alexander ruled from 336-323 BC.

He conquered the Persian s who had earlier conquered Palestine and thus Alexander became "lord" of the Jews.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

The Book of Revelation is not written in order, as Daniel plainly shows. The horns represent power, and are sovereign because of their crowns. When the three horns are rooted out, their power and sovereignty is gone. The little horn is a power, but the three who sponsored her are not powerful or even sovereign.
________________________
Here's the debatable questions: Who are the three uprooted horns? Who's the little horn?
_____________________________________________________

The three little horns were the kingdoms of France, Spain, and England. The little Horn is the United States of America.

Before....the Three Big Horns

After.....the Little Horn the rooted up the Three Big Horns

There are other clues, the Little Horn became the most powerful, the USA has became the most powerful power on the planet, first atomic bomb, first men on the moon, the whole world fears the power of the USA.

ps...this by no means implies that the peoples of the USA are bad, but its rulers may be religiously mistaken...

 

[sooda]

The three little horns were the kingdoms of France, Spain, and England. The little Horn is the United States of America.

Before....the Three Big Horns

After.....the Little Horn the rooted up the Three Big Horns

There are other clues, the Little Horn became the most powerful, the USA has became the most powerful power on the planet, first atomic bomb, first men on the moon, the whole world fears the power of the USA.

ps...this by no means implies that the peoples of the USA are bad, but its rulers may be religiously mistaken...

Hogwash.. Where on earth do you get such bad theology?

Titus was a little horn.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

It's all happening now friend, as Revelation explains, everyone in the world will be deceived by the beast, except those whose names are written in the Lamb's Book of Life before the creation of the world. Iow, if you do know what and who you REALLY are in the context of all that is, then you will probably believe in the mentally projected reality that the beast has created, ie, the present global economic and social structure that you are incarnate in and totally identify with. The reality I speak of is not a human conceived reality, it is THAT which the human mind can never conceive of because it is not based in time as the human mind experiences.

 

[sooda]

It's all happening now friend, as Revelation explains, everyone in the world will be deceived by the beast, except those whose names are written in the Lamb's Book of Life before the creation of the world. Iow, if you do know what and who you REALLY are in the context of all that is, then you will probably believe in the mentally projected reality that the beast has created, ie, the present global economic and social structure that you are incarnate in and totally identify with. The reality I speak of is not a human conceived reality, it is THAT which the human mind can never conceive of because it is not based in time as the human mind experiences.

Only if Hal Lindsey or Time Lahaye wrote Revelation.

 

[sooda]

One man's scattered is another man's growth. You can't grow without changing, IMHO. One new piece to the puzzle, means discarding or moving other pieces... and a new search to fill in the void. I edited the post to which you've replied, BTW... maybe that will help you to see what I see?

The Revelation says by the sword or by captivity... this theme runs throughout Prophecy. Obviously, "by the sword" needs no more warning, since we are told that those who live by the sword will die by the sword... and they loved not their lives unto death.

But captivity/bondage will come to those who have led away captive... this speaks to those nations who have actually done that to other nations. It's these nations that are the metals of Daniel and probably the horns of Revelation. Babylon, Persia, Greece and Rome have done so, according to Daniel... and according to secular history, as well. The Ionians fled from the Greeks to Asia Minor... and faced the Persians there.

So... given this theory... which nations have removed other peoples from their lands? By this day and time, all of them. But, since Revelation speaks of the time of Jacob's trouble, it's probably about whomever Jacob turns out to be. And those who have enslaved or removed them.

This is why I want to know who's really who, what's really where.

The sword in the mouth of Jesus is truth of his word.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Sooda, before I reply seriously, I need to know if you take the Book of Daniel and Revelation as being prophecy?

 

[tayla]

The Book of Revelation is not written in order, as Daniel plainly shows.

The book of Revelation is fiction, not prophecy. Perhaps it is a descriptions of actual visions by the author. But it is not prophetic.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Dmap, and you know it is not prophecy how?

 

[Aupmanyav]

24:14 And this Gospel of the Kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

It is being preached but what to talk of others, even the citizens of the Kingdom make fun of it.

.. the whole world fears the power of the USA.

There are many nations who do not fear USA. North Korea, Iran, Russia, China, .. On the contrary perhaps USA fears them.

.. except those whose names are written in the Lamb's Book of Life before the creation of the world.

If it is written from before the creation of the world, then there is nothing much that people can do about it.

Lamb with the book. Very funny.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

There are many nations who do not fear USA. North Korea, Iran, Russia, China, .. On the contrary perhaps USA fears them.

If it is written from before the creation of the world, then there is nothing much that people can do about it.

Lamb with the book. Very funny.

Which country in the world started the most wars in last 70 years in an attempt to gain global hegemony. if said countries are not afraid of US military power and ambitions, then they are crazy, which they are not, which is why they try their best to create a sufficiently strong deterrent to make it MAD (mutual assured destruction). As for the US being afraid, considering the MAD status quo, it depends on the leader as to their sanity, if a crazy evil president comes along, then all bets are off.

The Lamb represents Christ, the Book of Life represents the eternal spiritual reality. Judgement will determine who transcends the mortal worlds. Names written before this world's creation means those souls who have realized what and who they REALLY are in the context of all that is.

But my friend Aupmanyav, as an atheist, why are you wasting my time commenting on my posts concerning religious prophecy. You are an atheist, I get it, you don't need to say a thing, I am not here to try and persuade anyone to believe what I understand as to the meaning, but I am here to hopefully have an exchange with someone interested in the meaning of the religious prophecy, and in this instance have a reasonable understanding of the Revelation and Daniel prophecies.

 

[Aupmanyav]

.. which is why they try their best to create a sufficiently strong deterrent to make it MAD (mutual assured destruction).

The Lamb represents Christ, the Book of Life represents the eternal spiritual reality. Judgement will determine who transcends the mortal worlds. Names written before this world's creation means those souls who have realized what and who they REALLY are in the context of all that is.

But my friend Aupmanyav, as an atheist, why are you wasting my time commenting on my posts concerning religious prophecy.

You can't blame countries for caring for their security and sovereignty. You already have a good President. Of course, George Bush Jr. was better. He actually got you in a war. I hope before his presidency is over, Trump also will be something equally notable.

All lambs that we meet, we will before we die. There is no judgment and no immortality. Don't sell snake-oil. All the imagined claims in your posts invite an atheist to comment.

Your statement that the whole world is afraid of USA, started it. USA/Nixon tried to frighten India by sending a naval force at the time of Bangladesh war, that did not stop creation of Bangladesh.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Marketing atheism is a big ask, enjoy. But I'm not interested...

 

[Wandering Monk]

Don't you just love the ridiculous idea of prophecy? If God really wanted us to know the future, why did he wrap these predictions in all this confusing imagery? Why no just be clear: name, date, detailed accurate futurecast?

Apparently he doesn't care that people would have umpteen interpretations of what he is supposed to have said about the future. I am sure there will be several posts here suggesting that God only intended that his 'elect' should understand, then claim they are part of that 'elect.'

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Because God wants to separate the sheep from the goats.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Why does God make some goats and others sheep. Funny God.
“The Lord has blinded their eyes and hardened their hearts - so that their eyes cannot see, and their hearts cannot understand, and they cannot turn to me and have me heal them.” John 12:40

 

[Brickjectivity]

The book of Revelation is fiction, not prophecy. Perhaps it is a descriptions of actual visions by the author. But it is not prophetic.

Its not prognostic. I think it is prophetic but doesn't predict future events. Its message is overall is to be patient. As noted its not written in order, and I suspect it is saying the same things repeatedly in different shades. There are seven churches, seven seals, seven angels, seven bowls and seven trumps. These allude to the concept of waiting for the completion of Jesus work, Jesus who is named after Joshua that leader who patiently circles Jericho seven times. Its all about waiting and says as much repeatedly every time it says "This calls for patience on the part of the saints." The saints are the ones who suffer to bring about the end result which is described in symbols. The point of the seven here I think is that we don't know how long just as Joshua doesn't know how many times he must circle Jericho.

I will only add that its ridiculous and irresponsible to teach people that there is a 7,000 year plan. Anybody who teaches that ought to sit on a tack.

 

[sooda]

Sooda, before I reply seriously, I need to know if you take the Book of Daniel and Revelation as being prophecy?

No and neither does Judaism.. Danel was a character in Ugarit writings .. Daniel was NOT a real person. He was a literary device.

The various authors started with history during the Babylonian exile and got together and wrote encouragement to the Jews in 165 BC during the Maccabean Revolt and the rule of Antiochus IV Epiphanes.