Walter and Debbie
Active Member
Hello 3rdAngel, you are welcome.Hey Walter and Debbie thanks for sharing your views with us.
Love, Walter
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Hello 3rdAngel, you are welcome.Hey Walter and Debbie thanks for sharing your views with us.
For Christians unbelief in Gods' Word is sin.Of course to be legitimate one has top answer where the Hebrews got their seven day week from. And are we paying fan fiction or are we being serious?
Unbelief in what? Nowhere in the Bible does it tell you that the Bible is perfect.For Christians all unbelief is sin.
Unbelief in what? Nowhere in the Bible does it tell you that the Bible is perfect.
Your name sounds familiar are you from Christian Forums?Hello 3rdAngel, you are welcome.
Love, Walter
None of these show how I am wrong that they do not show evidence of Jesus being called God or Jesus calling himself God.I believe I showed you what I believed you posted was wrong here; see post # 370; post # 371; post # 374; post # 375; post # 381; post # 386; post # 389: post # 439; post # 440; post # 442 and post # 448. If you would like to see why from the scriptures just look at my responses to each one of your posts listed above.
Take care
None of these show how I am wrong that they do not show evidence of Jesus being called God or Jesus calling himself God.
I think you don’t have any evidence that Jesus IS God do you just keep reposting a list of your compilation of misquotes and misunderstandings of scriptures.
For instance, John saying that Jesus revealed the Father, the Father who is almighty God, DOES NOT SAY that Jesus is God. It says that Jesus REVESLED GOD… this is true from Jesus’ own mouth wherein he says ‘Father, I have given them the words yoh gave me to give them and they have received them’ (paraphrased).
What is the link between Jesus revealing the Father: ‘The Son who is closest to the Father - he has revealed Him’ (p.s. Who is the ‘Him’ and who is being revealed?) and Jesus being called ‘Firstborn Son of God’ (p.s. ‘Firstborn’, not ‘First Born’… purposely confusing similar words!)
Answer: ‘Closest to the Father’ is the same as ‘FirstBorn’. It means ‘He who the Father loves the most because that one pleases the Father greater than all other Sons’:
(Note: Therefore there are Sons in whom God is NOT SO pleased!!)
- ‘This is my son in whom I am well pleased!’
- “Here is my servant, whom I uphold, my chosen one in whom I delight; I will put my Spirit on him, and he will bring justice to the nations.”
So, how is Jesus God, if he is FIRSTBORN of God… if he were God there would be absolutely no need for such a affirmation (How can God by ‘most beloved’ BY GOD?
And, as a ridiculous nonsense: The Jews ‘THOUGHT that Jesus was calling himself God’ means that Jesus WAS GOD??? And then Jesus saying ‘I did not call myself God - I said only that God is my Father’ STILL MEANS that Jesus was calling himself God???
Wow! So Jesus saying: “I did not say I was God” means “I am God”…
Oh, and of course, anytime Jesus says, ‘I am’ it means he is saying that he is God, right?
So ‘I am God’ means he was saying: ‘God God’?
You really haven’t thought things through, have you. You just regurgitate something you have ready typed up!!
- ‘Before Abraham was God’
Jesus says that TRUE worship was no longer to be on or in a corporate establishment.According to the bible it is the seventh day of the week not any day of the week...
- Exodus 20:10 But the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God...
You need to show WHY they are in error!Yes everyone of these posts are in error post # 370; post # 371; post # 374; post # 375; post # 381; post # 386; post # 389: post # 439; post # 440; post # 442 and post # 448. If you would like to see why from the scriptures proving this just look at my responses to each one of your posts listed above. You did not address any of my responses to you.
Already did show why you were in error (See post # 503)You need to show WHY they are in error!
You asked me where you were in error. I posted you where you were in error and explained why in post # 503 linked.None of these show how I am wrong that they do not show evidence of Jesus being called God or Jesus calling himself God.
The above are your words claiming there is no scripture of the Apostles calling Jesus God then we have Gods' Word disagreeing with your words that say verbatim Jesus is God. For example..I think you don’t have any evidence that Jesus IS God do you just keep reposting a list of your compilation of misquotes and misunderstandings of scriptures.
Then we have the Gods' word disagreeing with your words written through John you claim doers not call Jesus God here...For instance, John saying that Jesus revealed the Father, the Father who is almighty God, DOES NOT SAY that Jesus is God. It says that Jesus REVESLED GOD… this is true from Jesus’ own mouth wherein he says ‘Father, I have given them the words yoh gave me to give them and they have received them’ (paraphrased). What is the link between Jesus revealing the Father: ‘The Son who is closest to the Father - he has revealed Him’ (p.s. Who is the ‘Him’ and who is being revealed?) and Jesus being called ‘Firstborn Son of God’ (p.s. ‘Firstborn’, not ‘First Born’… purposely confusing similar words! Answer: ‘Closest to the Father’ is the same as ‘FirstBorn’. It means ‘He who the Father loves the most because that one pleases the Father greater than all other Sons’:
So this says Jesus is not God how? - It doesn'tThis is my son in whom I am well pleased!’ “Here is my servant, whom I uphold, my chosen one in whom I delight; I will put my Spirit on him, and he will bring justice to the nations.” (Note: Therefore there are Sons in whom God is NOT SO pleased!!)
So, how is Jesus God, if he is FIRSTBORN of God… if he were God there would be absolutely no need for such a affirmation (How can God by ‘most beloved’ BY GOD?
Jesus said to the Jews He was in existence before Abraham calling Himself I AM. To the Jew the reference to being before Abraham and the name I AM was a reference to God's name from Exodus 3:13-14 of God speaking to Moses in the burning bush.And, as a ridiculous nonsense: The Jews ‘THOUGHT that Jesus was calling himself God’ means that Jesus WAS GOD??? And then Jesus saying ‘I did not call myself God - I said only that God is my Father’ STILL MEANS that Jesus was calling himself God???
No! You keep on trying to do ‘proof by contradiction’!You asked me where you were in error. I posted you where you were in error and explained why in post # 503 linked.
The above are your words claiming there is no scripture of the Apostles calling Jesus God then we have Gods' Word disagreeing with your words that say verbatim Jesus is God. For example..
John states that Jesus is God here...
John makes it very clear what he is talking about Jesus being God again here...
- JOHN 1:1-4; 14 1, 1, IN THE BEGINNING WAS THE WORD, AND THE WORD WAS WITH GOD, AND THE WORD WAS GOD. 2, THE SAME WAS IN THE BEGINNING WITH GOD. 3, ALL THINGS WERE MADE BY HIM; AND WITHOUT HIM WAS NOT ANY THING MADE THAT WAS MADE. 4, In him was life; and the life was the light of men. [10] He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him. [14], AND THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH, AND DWELT AMONG US, AND WE BEHELD HIS GLORY, THE GLORY AS OF THE ONLY BEGOTTEN OF THE FATHER, FULL OF GRACE AND TRUTH.
The Apostles Thomas also believed Jesus was God here...
- 1 JOHN 5:20 20 And we know that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true; and we are in him who is true, in his Son JESUS CHRIST HE IS THE TRUE GOD AND ETERNAL LIFE.
As does the writer of Hebrews quoting God here...
- JOHN 20:28 28 Thomas answered him, “MY LORD AND MY GOD!”
Peter knew Jesus was God and states so here...
- HEBREWS 1:8 But UNTO THE SON HE SAYS, “YOUR THRONE, O GOD, WILL LAST FOR EVER AND EVER; A SCEPTER OF JUSTICE WILL BE THE SCEPTER OF YOUR KINGDOM.
Paul also shows his belief that Jesus is God here...
- 2 PETER 1:1 Simeon Peter, a servant and apostle of Jesus Christ, to those who have obtained a faith of equal standing with ours by the righteousness of OUR GOD AND SAVIOR JESUS CHRIST
- TITUS 2:13 13 waiting for our blessed hope, the appearing of the glory of OUR GREAT GOD AND SAVIOR JESUS CHRIST
The Jews continued to seek to kill Jesus because he they claimed Jesus was claiming himself to be God here...
- PHILIPPIANS 2:5-6 5, Let this mind be in you, which was also in CHRIST JESUS: 6, WHO BEING IN THE FORM OF GOD, THOUGHT IT NOT ROBBERY TO BE EQUAL WITH GOD
The Angel even calls Jesus God here..
- JOHN 10:30-33 30 I and the father are one. 31 The Jews picked up stones again to stone him. 32 Jesus answered them, “I have shown you many good works from the Father; for which of them are you going to stone me?” 33 The Jews answered him, “It is not for a good work that we are going to stone you but for blasphemy, BECAUSE YOU, BEING A MAN, MAKE YOURSELF GOD.”
As shown above there is many scriptures from the Apostles all stating that Jesus is God. The Apostles believed that Jesus was God.
- LUKE 1:35 “The angel replied, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the baby to be born will be holy, and HE WILL BE CALLED THE SON OF GOD”
Then we have the Gods' word disagreeing with your words written through John you claim doers not call Jesus God here...
- 1 JOHN 5:20 20 And we know that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true; and we are in him who is true, in his Son JESUS CHRIST HE IS THE TRUE GOD AND ETERNAL LIFE.
So this says Jesus is not God how? - It doesn't
- JOHN 1:1-4; 14 1, 1, IN THE BEGINNING WAS THE WORD, AND THE WORD WAS WITH GOD, AND THE WORD WAS GOD. 2, THE SAME WAS IN THE BEGINNING WITH GOD. 3, ALL THINGS WERE MADE BY HIM; AND WITHOUT HIM WAS NOT ANY THING MADE THAT WAS MADE. 4, In him was life; and the life was the light of men. [10] He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him. [14], AND THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH, AND DWELT AMONG US, AND WE BEHELD HIS GLORY, THE GLORY AS OF THE ONLY BEGOTTEN OF THE FATHER, FULL OF GRACE AND TRUTH
Jesus as God who came to live as a man....
- ROMANS 8:29 29, For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
According to Romans 8:29 is in context to Jesus being the first man to live a perfect life by believing and following God's Word and being our example that we are to follow in.
- JOHN 1:1-4; 14 1, 1, IN THE BEGINNING WAS THE WORD, AND THE WORD WAS WITH GOD, AND THE WORD WAS GOD. 2, THE SAME WAS IN THE BEGINNING WITH GOD. 3, ALL THINGS WERE MADE BY HIM; AND WITHOUT HIM WAS NOT ANY THING MADE THAT WAS MADE. 4, In him was life; and the life was the light of men. [10] He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him. [14], AND THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH, AND DWELT AMONG US, AND WE BEHELD HIS GLORY, THE GLORY AS OF THE ONLY BEGOTTEN OF THE FATHER, FULL OF GRACE AND TRUTH
Jesus said to the Jews He was in existence before Abraham calling Himself I AM. To the Jew the reference to being before Abraham and the name I AM was a reference to God's name from Exodus 3:13-14 of God speaking to Moses in the burning bush.
Take care dear friend.
- Exodus 3:13-14 Moses said to God, “Suppose I go to the Israelites and say to them, ‘The God of your fathers has sent me to you,’ and they ask me, ‘What is his name?’ Then what shall I tell them?”God said to Moses, “I AM WHO I AM. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: ‘I AM has sent me to you.’”
No! You do not SHOW where I am in error. You simply keep saying that I am in error… that is not PROOF.Already did show why you were in error (See post # 503)
Hello 3rdAngel, yes, both .com and .netYour name sounds familiar are you from Christian Forums?
Those verse do not support what you claimed at all. One can still be a Christian and know that parts of the Bible are not true.We cannot receive Gods' salvation if we do not believe and follow what Gods' Word says according to the scriptures.
- Ephesians 2:8 We are saved by Gods grace through faith
- Romans 14:23 Whatsoever is not of faith is sin
- Hebrews 11:6 Without faith it is impossible to please God.
Take Care.
Hello 3rdAngel, yes, both .com and .net
Walter
Your response here...3rdAngel said: ↑
We cannot receive Gods' salvation if we do not believe and follow what Gods' Word says according to the scriptures.
- Ephesians 2:8 We are saved by Gods grace through faith
- Romans 14:23 Whatsoever is not of faith is sin
- Hebrews 11:6 Without faith it is impossible to please God.
Yes they do dear friend. We cannot have salvation without faith in Gods' Word. Faith is the condition, that is believing and following Gods' Word is the condition to receiving Gods' promises of everlasting life. None of us receive God's promises if we choose to continue in our sins and unbelief according to the bible because whatsoever is not of faith is sin according to the scriptures (Romans 14:23) and without faith we cannot please God (Hebrews 11:6) and if we choose to continue in our sins of unbelief we are in danger of the judgement to come according to Hebrews 10:26-27.Those verse do not support what you claimed at all. One can still be a Christian and know that parts of the Bible are not true.
Is it wrong to call God a liar? Can God lie?
Lets be honest dear friend. Everything you have been posting has been responded to with detailed scripture responses. You refuse to address the content of my posts and scriptures that are in disagreement with you. You were shown a general outline list of your posts to me in post # 503. All of your posts that have any scripture in them (not many) have been addressed showing why they are in error with detail scripture responses to you that you ignore here from post # 366 linked; post # 397 linked; post # 399 linked; post # 403 linked; post # 445 linked; post # 457 linked; and post # 507 linked. Now instead of ignoring my linked posts to you how about you address the content of these posts showing from scripture why you disagree with them? As proven in the linked posts above it you are in error in regard to not one but many things in regard to the scriptures. It is you that makes the claim to error but cannot show me where the error is in the scriptures shared in my linked responses to you that are in disagreement with you because you do not respond to the content in these posts.No! You do not SHOW where I am in error. You simply keep saying that I am in error… that is not PROOF. Outline ONE THING that I said and give your PROOF - don’t just quote another false belief!!
Yes God's name is YHWH and God has many names in the bible. As posted earlier, Jesus said to the Jews He was in existence before Abraham calling Himself I AM. To the Jew the reference to being before Abraham and the name I AM was a reference to God's name from Exodus 3:13-14 of God speaking to Moses in the burning bush. That is why they went to kill him because they knew Jesus was calling himself GodFor instance: ‘God did not say, “My name is I AM”. He said, “My name is YHWH”. “YHWH” is THE NAME: ‘I AM’ is the MEANING OF THE NAME!
Its not a Revelation verse. Once again there is nothing in this scripture anywhere that says Jesus is not God. (see oneness of God study already provided). Lets look at the scripture as it reads...Also, the revelation verse: Who is it who is being revealed by the Son: who is it who is ‘True’? “And we know that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true; and we are in him who is true, in his Son JESUS CHRIST (.STOP.) HE IS THE TRUE GOD AND ETERNAL LIFE ‘Father, ….. This means eternal life, that they believe IN YOU, THE ONLY TRUE GOD….
Your response here...3rdAngel said: ↑ You asked me where you were in error. I posted you where you were in error and explained why in post # 503 linked.
The above are your words claiming there is no scripture of the Apostles calling Jesus God then we have Gods' Word disagreeing with your words that say verbatim Jesus is God. For example..
John states that Jesus is God here...
John makes it very clear what he is talking about Jesus being God again here...
- JOHN 1:1-4; 14 1, 1, IN THE BEGINNING WAS THE WORD, AND THE WORD WAS WITH GOD, AND THE WORD WAS GOD. 2, THE SAME WAS IN THE BEGINNING WITH GOD. 3, ALL THINGS WERE MADE BY HIM; AND WITHOUT HIM WAS NOT ANY THING MADE THAT WAS MADE. 4, In him was life; and the life was the light of men. [10] He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him. [14], AND THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH, AND DWELT AMONG US, AND WE BEHELD HIS GLORY, THE GLORY AS OF THE ONLY BEGOTTEN OF THE FATHER, FULL OF GRACE AND TRUTH.
The Apostles Thomas also believed Jesus was God here...
- 1 JOHN 5:20 20 And we know that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true; and we are in him who is true, in his Son JESUS CHRIST HE IS THE TRUE GOD AND ETERNAL LIFE.
As does the writer of Hebrews quoting God here...
- JOHN 20:28 28 Thomas answered him, “MY LORD AND MY GOD!”
Peter knew Jesus was God and states so here...
- HEBREWS 1:8 But UNTO THE SON HE SAYS, “YOUR THRONE, O GOD, WILL LAST FOR EVER AND EVER; A SCEPTER OF JUSTICE WILL BE THE SCEPTER OF YOUR KINGDOM.
Paul also shows his belief that Jesus is God here...
- 2 PETER 1:1 Simeon Peter, a servant and apostle of Jesus Christ, to those who have obtained a faith of equal standing with ours by the righteousness of OUR GOD AND SAVIOR JESUS CHRIST
- TITUS 2:13 13 waiting for our blessed hope, the appearing of the glory of OUR GREAT GOD AND SAVIOR JESUS CHRIST
The Jews continued to seek to kill Jesus because he they claimed Jesus was claiming himself to be God here...
- PHILIPPIANS 2:5-6 5, Let this mind be in you, which was also in CHRIST JESUS: 6, WHO BEING IN THE FORM OF GOD, THOUGHT IT NOT ROBBERY TO BE EQUAL WITH GOD
The Angel even calls Jesus God here..
- JOHN 10:30-33 30 I and the father are one. 31 The Jews picked up stones again to stone him. 32 Jesus answered them, “I have shown you many good works from the Father; for which of them are you going to stone me?” 33 The Jews answered him, “It is not for a good work that we are going to stone you but for blasphemy, BECAUSE YOU, BEING A MAN, MAKE YOURSELF GOD.”
As shown above there is many scriptures from the Apostles all stating that Jesus is God. The Apostles believed that Jesus was God.
- LUKE 1:35 “The angel replied, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the baby to be born will be holy, and HE WILL BE CALLED THE SON OF GOD”
Then we have the Gods' word disagreeing with your words written through John you claim doers not call Jesus God here...
- 1 JOHN 5:20 20 And we know that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true; and we are in him who is true, in his Son JESUS CHRIST HE IS THE TRUE GOD AND ETERNAL LIFE.
So this says Jesus is not God how? - It doesn't
- JOHN 1:1-4; 14 1, 1, IN THE BEGINNING WAS THE WORD, AND THE WORD WAS WITH GOD, AND THE WORD WAS GOD. 2, THE SAME WAS IN THE BEGINNING WITH GOD. 3, ALL THINGS WERE MADE BY HIM; AND WITHOUT HIM WAS NOT ANY THING MADE THAT WAS MADE. 4, In him was life; and the life was the light of men. [10] He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him. [14], AND THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH, AND DWELT AMONG US, AND WE BEHELD HIS GLORY, THE GLORY AS OF THE ONLY BEGOTTEN OF THE FATHER, FULL OF GRACE AND TRUTH
Jesus as God who came to live as a man....
- ROMANS 8:29 29, For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
According to Romans 8:29 is in context to Jesus being the first man to live a perfect life by believing and following God's Word and being our example that we are to follow in.
- JOHN 1:1-4; 14 1, 1, IN THE BEGINNING WAS THE WORD, AND THE WORD WAS WITH GOD, AND THE WORD WAS GOD. 2, THE SAME WAS IN THE BEGINNING WITH GOD. 3, ALL THINGS WERE MADE BY HIM; AND WITHOUT HIM WAS NOT ANY THING MADE THAT WAS MADE. 4, In him was life; and the life was the light of men. [10] He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him. [14], AND THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH, AND DWELT AMONG US, AND WE BEHELD HIS GLORY, THE GLORY AS OF THE ONLY BEGOTTEN OF THE FATHER, FULL OF GRACE AND TRUTH
Jesus said to the Jews He was in existence before Abraham calling Himself I AM. To the Jew the reference to being before Abraham and the name I AM was a reference to God's name from Exodus 3:13-14 of God speaking to Moses in the burning bush.
Take care dear friend.
- Exodus 3:13-14 Moses said to God, “Suppose I go to the Israelites and say to them, ‘The God of your fathers has sent me to you,’ and they ask me, ‘What is his name?’ Then what shall I tell them?”God said to Moses, “I AM WHO I AM. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: ‘I AM has sent me to you.’”
Your post here is non responsive to the content in the post you are quoting from and the scriptures in the post that are disagreement with you. You quoting you is not a response to scripture that is is disagreement with you. Did you want to address the content and the scriptures in the post you are quoting from that are in disagreement with you dear friend? For me only God's Words are true and we should believe and follow them (see Romans 3:4 and Acts 5:29)No! You keep on trying to do ‘proof by contradiction’! You keep on saying that because no one said Jesus WAS NOT GOD then that means he WAS GOD! That is as ridiculous as someone saying that you are a slug because no one ever said that you were NOT A SLUG!