The Resurrection of Jesus Christ

[Darkstorn]

Very resurrected. That's the account by multiple NT authors.

But that account is suspect. I believe they were all charlatans.

You need evidence, not just an opinion.

Why? If you get to have only opinions and zero evidence, why can't we do the same?

 

[Spartan]

It only sicks because you don't know enough about the available evidence to put up a decent debate.

But then, if you did actually know the available evidence you would have kept quiet ...... Christians don't know there was a resurrection, they just have faith that there was.

I know a lot more than you do. I've posted evidence for the resurrection (see Post # 98). If you had anything you'd present some evidence to back up your skepticism. But you don't have anything.

 

[Spartan]

But that account is suspect. I believe they were all charlatans.

Yeah, but you don't have any evidence for that, do you now?!

 

[Darkstorn]

But you don't have anything.

Correction: YOU don't have anything.

Yeah, but you don't have any evidence for that, do you now?!

Yes i do.

And no, you can't have it until you post evidence for a resurrection.

 

[Spartan]

The resurrection of Jesus is a story that has come to be an inspiration to millions. It is an inspiration because it tells of how a common man, not an emperor or caesar became a God or was always God because he was the least among humanity....

It is evident that fantastic stories can inspire millions without being literally true.

If you're saying the resurrection is not true then the OP requires you to provide some evidence for that.

 

[Spartan]

Correction: YOU don't have anything.



Yes i do.

And no, you can't have it until you post evidence for a resurrection.

See Post # 98 for evidences.

 

[Darkstorn]

If you're saying the resurrection is not true then the OP requires you to provide some evidence for that.

Yes but the OP sucks and is not an authority on what is a convincing argument.

I don't follow your silly rules: Unless you follow them yourself first. Which you haven't. So i feel YOU are a charlatan yourself.

See Post # 98 for evidences.

Those were NOT evidence for a resurrection.

Whereas i do have some evidence of some Christians purposefully advocating a falsehood in order to further their theology:

Of Pandas and People - Wikipedia

Which means, everything they have ever said is at best suspect, at worst intentional falsehoods to trick people.

 

[oldbadger]

Tsk tsk... This should help you out on those alleged pagan "resurrections," none of which can be linked to Jesus. There's zero evidence for any linkage.

23 Reasons Why Scholars Know Jesus Is Not A Copy Of Pagan Religions.



By the skeptic's common practice of discarding or attempting to marginalize ALL historical references to Jesus, they unwittingly would have people believe in a massive and complicated conspiracy by mostly common, uneducated fishermen, etc., to advance a false narrative about Christ. Let's review who would probably have to be in this unwitting conspiracy of theirs and be labeled as liars, charlatans, etc.

1. Most or all of the disciples, including early unbelievers such as James and Thomas. Skeptics would, in effect, be assigning acts of deception to these men in spite of there being no narrative or history of dishonesty on their part.

2. The women at the tomb. First-century testimony of any kind that a resurrection never occurred is absent in history.

3. Luke, the physician and author of his Gospel. He wasn't a disciple. He wrote that he carefully investigated "everything" from the beginning. There's no evidence he just focused on the words and accounts of the apostles alone. What's more, he continues his narrative with the Book of Acts, with additional miracles and people (including Paul, a person initially hostile to Christianity) claiming to have had experiences with Christ. Plus, Paul's companions on the road to Damascus "heard the sound" of Paul's experience with Jesus. So Luke would have to be a liar, fool, or charlatan also.

4. Eusebius and Josephus and others who wrote about Jesus had to be lying, mistaken, or also in on the conspiracy to defraud the populace.

5. We need to add Paul to the conspiracy, since he wrote of the resurrection of Jesus in his epistles, and since he wrote most of the New Testament. Paul originally was a persecutor of Christians and was arguably culpable in at least one murder of a Christian. According to Luke, Paul had an experience with Jesus on the road to Damascus.

6. Let's also add in all the other eyewitnesses of miracles and/or authors of the New Testament, since they must also be liars, madmen, or charlatans.

I can probably dredge up some more, but the list of people who would have to be liars, charlatans, etc., is now too long (and unsupported by any credible evidence on the part of skeptics) to be believable.

Nope.
The Bible tells that all the disciples legged it after the arrest apart from Peter who disappeared after he was challenged.

Only Magdalene and Salome stayed to witness the crucifixion, the taking down of Jesus and the placing in stock tomb.

After about 36 hours they went back and found Jesus gone.

Paul was no witness and knew nothing about Jesus or his mission because he never described anything that Jesus did before Jerusalem.

Luke didn't research too far...... He just copied other accounts.

John w apostle not the disciples, he didn't even know where to place incidents on an accurate timeline.

Josephus wrote about Jesus alright, but he put that account amongst other troublemakers of that time, and Christians just messed with account.

And scholars' opinions don't make evidence! Many other scholars are unbelievers.

You haven't got anything to offer, afraid.

 

[QuestioningMind]

If you want to know the answers to these questions then DO YOUR HOMEWORK. Read the Gospels, etc. like anyone well versed on the issues has had to do. Don't be lazy. You obviously haven't done any research on these issues.

ROFL... clearly YOU need to do YOUR homework, because you don't have answers to my questions either. The truth is that your book is filled with claims made by nameless people that it is impossible to verify the legitimacy of. Claiming that Christ rose from the dead has just as much evidence to back it up as the claim that Odin casts lighting bolts and Thor creates thunder. Both have books claiming such nonsense and both have or had gullible followers who actually believed it.

 

[Darkstorn]

Nope.
The Bible tells that all the disciples legged it after the arrest apart from Peter who disappeared after he was challenged.

Only Magdalene and Salome stayed to witness the crucifixion, the taking down of Jesus and the placing in stock tomb.

After about 36 hours they went back and found Jesus gone.

Paul was no witness and knew nothing about Jesus or his mission because he never described anything that Jesus did before Jerusalem.

Luke didn't research too far...... He just copied other accounts.

John w apostle not the disciples, he didn't even know where to place incidents on an accurate timeline.

Josephus wrote about Jesus alright, but he put that account amongst other troublemakers of that time, and Christians just messed with account.

And scholars' opinions don't make evidence! Many other scholars are unbelievers.

You haven't got anything to offer, afraid.

I think you should probably know this:

Some of the gospels were written in the second century. Long after the supposed events. So they are not even close to eyewitness accounts to begin with.

 

[Darkstorn]

ROFL... clearly YOU need to do YOUR homework, because you don't have answers to my questions either. The truth is that your book is filled with claims made by nameless people that it is impossible to verify the legitimacy of. Claiming that Christ rose from the dead has just as much evidence to back it up as the claim that Odin casts lighting bolts and Thor creates thunder. Both have books claiming such nonsense and both have or had gullible followers who actually believed it.

Well, Thor promised to get rid of all the ice giants.

As far as i can tell, there are none around.

 

[oldbadger]

Evidences for the Resurrection of Jesus Christ

Historical Evidence That Jesus Rose From the Dead

Plus:

"In The Case for the Real Jesus by Lee Strobel (p. 112), Mike Licona said, "[Gary] Habermas has compiled a list of more than 2,200 sources in French, German, and English in which experts have written on the resurrection from 1975 to the present. He has identified minimal facts that are strongly evidenced and which are regarded as historical by a large majority of scholars, including skeptics."

12 Historical Facts - Gary Habermas

Twelve Facts Most Scholars Agree on Concerning the Crucifixion and Resurrection

1. Jesus died by crucifixion.
2. He was buried.
3. His death caused the disciples to despair and lose hope.
4. The tomb was empty (the most contested).
5. The disciples had experiences which they believed were literal appearances of the risen Jesus (the most important proof).
6. The disciples were transformed from doubters to bold proclaimers.
7. The resurrection was the central message.
8. They preached the message of Jesus’ resurrection in Jerusalem.
9. The Church was born and grew.
10. Orthodox Jews who believed in Christ made Sunday their primary day of worship.
11. James was converted to the faith when he saw the resurrected Jesus (James was a family skeptic).
12. Paul was converted to the faith (Paul was an outsider skeptic and initially a persecutor of Christians).

Points like 'the tomb was empty' simply mean that Jesus was taken away, either alive or dead.

I can only answer one point at s time cos I'm on s s bile.

 

[oldbadger]

I think you should probably know this:

Some of the gospels were written in the second century. Long after the supposed events. So they are not even close to eyewitness accounts to begin with.

True, theyvgotveduted then,and and G-John was written circa 110CE. Cephas's account got meddled with.

 

[sooda]

ROFL... clearly YOU need to do YOUR homework, because you don't have answers to my questions either. The truth is that your book is filled with claims made by nameless people that it is impossible to verify the legitimacy of. Claiming that Christ rose from the dead has just as much evidence to back it up as the claim that Odin casts lighting bolts and Thor creates thunder. Both have books claiming such nonsense and both have or had gullible followers who actually believed it.

There's no evidence for anything supernatural. Never has been.

 

[oldbadger]

Very resurrected. That's the account by multiple NT authors.
You need evidence, not just an opinion.

None of the authors was anywhere near the events, and Jesus arriving in Galilee simply shows that he had survived, just as I feel sure that he did.

All Paul had was Faith, he kept saying so, so I'll stick to my opinion.

 

[oldbadger]

I know a lot more than you do. I've posted evidence for the resurrection (see Post # 98). If you had anything you'd present some evidence to back up your skepticism. But you don't have anything.

You post 98 offers no evidence, I'm afraid.

I'll answer every point tonight when on my computer.

 

[QuestioningMind]

OK, then I respectfully refer you to a great deal of evidences about Jesus, etc., in the following works.

"The Historical Jesus," by scholar Dr. Gary Habermas;

“The Historical Jesus of the Gospels,” by Dr. Craig Keener

"New Evidence that Demands a Verdict," by former skeptic Josh McDowell;

"The Case for Christ," by Lee Strobel," and

"The Case for the Resurrection of Jesus," by Dr. Gary Habermas.

“Miracles – The Credibility of the New Testament Accounts,” by Craig S. Keener

“The Case for Miracles,” by Lee Strobel

LOL

There you go again, just giving a long list of titles that you know no one is going to take several months to read just to answer your silly question.

As I suggested earlier, why don't you pick the one MOST CONVINCING piece of verifiable evidence for the resurrection that you think is found in that pile of books you mentioned. IF you have actually read the books THEN it should be REALLY easy for you to do. Go ahead... share with us what your argument is... otherwise it's easy for us to conclude that you haven't even read the books you're suggesting and mentioned them just because you liked what the titles said.

 

[Windwalker]

Tsk tsk... This should help you out on those alleged pagan "resurrections," none of which can be linked to Jesus. There's zero evidence for any linkage.

Do you think there is zero evidence to connect Jesus with Caesar? Such as the titles given to Jesus were the titles for Caesar? Or, that others of the day of Jesus also were claimed to have resurrected, such as Caesar? Do those exist? We're not talking about copycat stuff here, only that such mythologies existed. And that is factual, in case you are unaware.

 

[Regiomontanus]

Don't you believe God to be completely self sufficient thus needing and wanting nothing?

I would never be so presumptuous as to claim to know the true nature the Creator of the universe.

 

[Spartan]

LOL

There you go again, just giving a long list of titles that you know no one is going to take several months to read just to answer your silly question.

As I suggested earlier, why don't you pick the one MOST CONVINCING piece of verifiable evidence for the resurrection that you think is found in that pile of books you mentioned. IF you have actually read the books THEN it should be REALLY easy for you to do. Go ahead... share with us what your argument is... otherwise it's easy for us to conclude that you haven't even read the books you're suggesting and mentioned them just because you liked what the titles said.

Study up on the historicity of the Gospels. You haven't done that yet. So read the recommended books, read Post # 98 and hopefully your knowledge base will increase on that. Also, it's highly recommended your read the following:

Who Wrote the Gospels? Internal and External Arguments for Traditional Authorship