Interesting question ^above^. What was in my mind was the literal cloud mentioned at Acts of the Apostles 1:9 B.
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The Second Coming of Christ
- Thread starter SalixIncendium
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- christ jesus second coming
Faithofchristian
Well-Known Member
Yeah, uh... no.
Wrong answer. Sorry, sorry.
Maybe to you, but not for me it isn't. Nice try
Faithofchristian
Well-Known Member
So you actually believe those were actual clouds that we see up floating around in the sky.
Now that's amazing.
Faithofchristian
Well-Known Member
The name Christian was first applied in Antioch, where it was given to Paul and Simon peter's ministry (Acts 11:25-26)...
Christ is a translation of messiah meaning an anointed one, and Christians meant a diminutive follower of the Christ.
Since the early church of Yeshua (Followers of the Way, Ebionites, James, etc) stood against Paul's Christianity as being Anti-Christ; then it is blatant what Christianity fulfills in detail.
In my opinion.
Seeing you can't even handle when the Tanakh even refutes what you say.
Those two men that were with Paul,
Being two witnesses and Christ being the third witness.
As it is written in the Tanakh that out of the mouth of two or three witnesses shall the matter be established.
Perhaps . . . but . . .
This may be one view of the universal, but a bit vague and nebulous, and would basically negate the claims of religions, which is possible. Religion just remains a human descriptive word for a belief system any particular belief, nothing more, and what you are describing is a 'belief system' of sorts..
From the Baha'i perspective no boundaries actually exist, and they are created by human tribalism. Baha'i simply translates as a follower of light. I believe that either the relationship between God and humanity is progressive Revelation without distinct boundaries, or no Gods exist and the natural explanation of the progressive evolution of humanity is without boundaries.
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I consider this the egocentric view of ones own religion common to all religion's that make such a claim, and is untenable from the universal view of God's relationship to Creation and humanity that extends beyond the narrow view of any one religion.
Given the many civilizations and cultures over thousands of years of history all over the earth it would be a contradiction of the nature of a Creator God to not reveal to these cultures and civilization God's message of salvation.
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This a stretch to far for any viable interpretation of the tanakh.
Faithofchristian
Well-Known Member
So you say, seeing the Tanakh is right along side the Christian bible in Agreement.
No, I do not accept the interpretation of Christians of the Tanakh.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
It is really too bad that you are going to continue to wait for Jesus to return, because Jesus is not coming back to earth, ever.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Thanks for sharing your views. It is a very different perspective from what I have heard from other Christians but given the Bible scriptures you cited, it makes a lot of sense. I tend to agree you that this is what lies ahead for humanity in the future. Thy Kingdom come, Thy will be done, on earth as it is in heaven.
The appearance of a Christ or Holy One is usually accompanied by great unmistakeable signs.
One of the unmistakeable signs of Christ’s return is that knowledge would be increased.
Every person alive today is witness to the skyrocketing of technology and science which has virtually united the planet into a single neighborhood almost overnight whereas tens of past centuries never witnessed the likes of today.
This is one of the signs that a Holy One from God has once again trod the planet and shed His blessings upon us all.
One of the unmistakeable signs of Christ’s return is that knowledge would be increased.
Every person alive today is witness to the skyrocketing of technology and science which has virtually united the planet into a single neighborhood almost overnight whereas tens of past centuries never witnessed the likes of today.
This is one of the signs that a Holy One from God has once again trod the planet and shed His blessings upon us all.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
I have always interpreted this verse below to mean that knowledge of the Bible will be increased at the time of the end but now I can see it in a different light. Knowledge in science and technology will also increase, but knowledge of God will also increase. Indeed, with the Revelation of Baha'u'llah we now have new knowledge about God and the soul and the afterlife such as the world has never known.
“The beginning of all things is the knowledge of God, and the end of all things is strict observance of whatsoever hath been sent down from the empyrean of the Divine Will that pervadeth all that is in the heavens and all that is on the earth.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 5
Daniel 12:4
KJ21
But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words and seal the book, even to the time of the end. Many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.”
ASV
But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.
AMP
But as for you, Daniel, conceal these words and seal up the scroll until the end of time. Many will go back and forth and search anxiously [through the scroll], and knowledge [of the purpose of God as revealed by His prophets] will [greatly] increase.”
AMPC
But you, O Daniel, shut up the words and seal the Book until the time of the end. [Then] many shall run to and fro and search anxiously [through the Book], and knowledge [of God’s purposes as revealed by His prophets] shall be increased and become great.
BRG
But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.
CSB
“But you, Daniel, keep these words secret and seal the book until the time of the end. Many will roam about, and knowledge will increase.”
CEB
But you, Daniel, must keep these words secret! Seal the scroll until the end time! Many will stray far, but knowledge will increase.”
CJB
“But you, Dani’el, keep these words secret, and seal up the book until the time of the end. Many will rush here and there as knowledge increases.”
CEV
Daniel, I now command you to keep the message of this book secret until the end of time, even though many people will go everywhere, searching for the knowledge to be found in it.
DARBY
And thou, Daniel, close the words, and seal the book, till the time of the end. Many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.
DRA
But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time appointed: many shall pass over, and knowledge shall be manifold.
ERV
“But you, Daniel, keep this message a secret. You must close the book and keep this secret until the time of the end. Many people will go here and there looking for true knowledge, and the true knowledge will increase.”
ESV
But you, Daniel, shut up the words and seal the book, until the time of the end. Many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall increase.”
But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words and seal the book, even to the time of the end. Many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.”
ASV
But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.
AMP
But as for you, Daniel, conceal these words and seal up the scroll until the end of time. Many will go back and forth and search anxiously [through the scroll], and knowledge [of the purpose of God as revealed by His prophets] will [greatly] increase.”
AMPC
But you, O Daniel, shut up the words and seal the Book until the time of the end. [Then] many shall run to and fro and search anxiously [through the Book], and knowledge [of God’s purposes as revealed by His prophets] shall be increased and become great.
BRG
But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.
CSB
“But you, Daniel, keep these words secret and seal the book until the time of the end. Many will roam about, and knowledge will increase.”
CEB
But you, Daniel, must keep these words secret! Seal the scroll until the end time! Many will stray far, but knowledge will increase.”
CJB
“But you, Dani’el, keep these words secret, and seal up the book until the time of the end. Many will rush here and there as knowledge increases.”
CEV
Daniel, I now command you to keep the message of this book secret until the end of time, even though many people will go everywhere, searching for the knowledge to be found in it.
DARBY
And thou, Daniel, close the words, and seal the book, till the time of the end. Many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.
DRA
But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time appointed: many shall pass over, and knowledge shall be manifold.
ERV
“But you, Daniel, keep this message a secret. You must close the book and keep this secret until the time of the end. Many people will go here and there looking for true knowledge, and the true knowledge will increase.”
ESV
But you, Daniel, shut up the words and seal the book, until the time of the end. Many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall increase.”
I have always interpreted this verse below to mean that knowledge of the Bible will be increased at the time of the end but now I can see it in a different light. Knowledge in science and technology will also increase, but knowledge of God will also increase. Indeed, with the Revelation of Baha'u'llah we now have new knowledge about God and the soul and the afterlife such as the world has never known.
“The beginning of all things is the knowledge of God, and the end of all things is strict observance of whatsoever hath been sent down from the empyrean of the Divine Will that pervadeth all that is in the heavens and all that is on the earth.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 5
Daniel 12:4
KJ21
But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words and seal the book, even to the time of the end. Many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.”
ASV
But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.
AMP
But as for you, Daniel, conceal these words and seal up the scroll until the end of time. Many will go back and forth and search anxiously [through the scroll], and knowledge [of the purpose of God as revealed by His prophets] will [greatly] increase.”
AMPC
But you, O Daniel, shut up the words and seal the Book until the time of the end. [Then] many shall run to and fro and search anxiously [through the Book], and knowledge [of God’s purposes as revealed by His prophets] shall be increased and become great.
BRG
But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.
CSB
“But you, Daniel, keep these words secret and seal the book until the time of the end. Many will roam about, and knowledge will increase.”
CEB
But you, Daniel, must keep these words secret! Seal the scroll until the end time! Many will stray far, but knowledge will increase.”
CJB
“But you, Dani’el, keep these words secret, and seal up the book until the time of the end. Many will rush here and there as knowledge increases.”
CEV
Daniel, I now command you to keep the message of this book secret until the end of time, even though many people will go everywhere, searching for the knowledge to be found in it.
DARBY
And thou, Daniel, close the words, and seal the book, till the time of the end. Many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.
DRA
But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time appointed: many shall pass over, and knowledge shall be manifold.
ERV
“But you, Daniel, keep this message a secret. You must close the book and keep this secret until the time of the end. Many people will go here and there looking for true knowledge, and the true knowledge will increase.”
ESV
But you, Daniel, shut up the words and seal the book, until the time of the end. Many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall increase.”
Those are some incredible quotes. Thanks for posting them.
Whenever a new Messenger appears the most difficult thing for followers of the previous religion to do is to break from tradition and accept it.
AdamRaja
Islamic Philosopher
I always thought that it might be tricky. Sure, if someone showed up with miraculous powers it would sway the masses but it could also be the false messiah(anti-christ), right?
However, that being said.. as a believer in the Quran (43:61) I do believe Jesus will come back and through that same faith I have to believe that when it is him then we all will just know.
Hello. You make some good points.
In the time of Jesus most of the people didn’t know Him. Why should His return be any different? Even when He said He was sent by God they still disbelieved.
So I think it is the same now. He could have already returned yet people like in Jesus time don’t know Him.
Only 12 disciples knew Jesus. Would you have been one of them at that time? So if He has already come again couldnt you have missed Him like all those of the past missed Him then?
AdamRaja
Islamic Philosopher
I definitely agree that back in the day a lot didn't believe Jesus was a great messenger but on the return in my beliefs it will be a huge event and the presence will be undeniable. I don't think it will be a thing that anyone will miss.
Maybe you’re right but why did Jesus tell us to watch and pray as He would come like a thief in the night?
Couldn’t ‘every eye shall see Him’ mean spiritual eyes or pure in heart?
There are other passages in the Bible that are symbolical not literal like ‘let the dead bury the dead’. In many Bibles now it says let the spiritually dead bury the physically dead so some terms are not all literal.
Couldn’t the signs of His Second coming be in the same vein?
Acts of the Apostles 1:9 was an 'actual cloud' that hid resurrected Jesus out of sight as he ascended to Heaven.