The sick concept of Eternal hell suffering.

[AK4]

What big picture? Isaiah (45:7) says God created evil. The point is that in Scripture evil does not always mean wrongdoing.

Evil in Scripture is often associated with calamity. Although God did not want to use calamity as an evil on the wicked, His justice, wisdom and love for the upright causes His hand, so to speak, to act in behalf of the righteous.

.

There is a word for evil (Hebrew "ra") and a word for calamity (eyd). If God meant calamity, then thats the word He would have used.

 

[mickiel]

In Luke 22:31;" Simon, Simon, behold, satan has demanded permission to shift you like Wheat." Here we see satan needs permission from God to dismantle humans and their affairs. When we see a religion being dismantled, we can then know God has given his permission to allow satan to do it. We can use this scripture, look at Christianity, or any other religion who's doctrines are being distorted, and know that satan is behind it, but with Gods permission, or the devil couldnot touch them.

This is why Christianity has the sick doctrine of eternal hell suffering, because God wants Christianity dismantled.

Peace.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

According to Rev (17:17,2; 18:7) it is God that puts it into the heart of the political kings or rulers of the earth to dismantle or turn on all religion that has run afoul proving itself false to God.

The distortion in Christianity was mentioned at Acts (20:29,30) that there would be wolves in sheep's clothing doing the religious distortion after the end of the first century.
See also Matthew 24:24.

Jesus foretold distortion in his illustration of the wheat and the weeds. How wheat (true) and weed (false) would grow together over the centuries until the harvest time or the separation in our time frame- Matthew 25:32.

So, it isn't the Christianity of the first century that God wants dismantled, but the distorted form that developed in Christendom after the first century ended.

In the first century Jesus taught the dead sleep the deep sleep of death at John 11:11.
At Matthew (10:28) Jesus knew the soul can die or be destroyed as Ezekiel (18:4,20) says.
Eternal hellfire suffering developed through religious leaders from Plato or Platonism.

Since Satan is the god of this world of badness -2Cor 4:4- then he is behind the world's BIG religions; BIG politics; and BIG business. With God's backing (Rev 17:17) Satan will use his political world to turn on his religious world leaving the merchants to mourn the loss of revenue- Rev 18:11

Once that happens Jesus will deliver or save a great crowd of people (Rev 7:9,10,14) out of all nations that truly follow Jesus command of Christ-like love of John (13:34,35) to live on into his thousand-year rule as Prince of Peace over earth.
-Isaiah 9:7

 

[mickiel]

According to Rev (17:17,2; 18:7) it is God that puts it into the heart of the political kings or rulers of the earth to dismantle or turn on all religion that has run afoul proving itself false to God.

The distortion in Christianity was mentioned at Acts (20:29,30) that there would be wolves in sheep's clothing doing the religious distortion after the end of the first century.
See also Matthew 24:24.

Jesus foretold distortion in his illustration of the wheat and the weeds. How wheat (true) and weed (false) would grow together over the centuries until the harvest time or the separation in our time frame- Matthew 25:32.

So, it isn't the Christianity of the first century that God wants dismantled, but the distorted form that developed in Christendom after the first century ended.

In the first century Jesus taught the dead sleep the deep sleep of death at John 11:11.
At Matthew (10:28) Jesus knew the soul can die or be destroyed as Ezekiel (18:4,20) says.
Eternal hellfire suffering developed through religious leaders from Plato or Platonism.

Since Satan is the god of this world of badness -2Cor 4:4- then he is behind the world's BIG religions; BIG politics; and BIG business. With God's backing (Rev 17:17) Satan will use his political world to turn on his religious world leaving the merchants to mourn the loss of revenue- Rev 18:11

Once that happens Jesus will deliver or save a great crowd of people (Rev 7:9,10,14) out of all nations that truly follow Jesus command of Christ-like love of John (13:34,35) to live on into his thousand-year rule as Prince of Peace over earth.
-Isaiah 9:7

Now I can agree with this.

Peace.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

There is a word for evil (Hebrew "ra") and a word for calamity (eyd). If God meant calamity, then thats the word He would have used.

Calamity and evil as posted are definitely two different words.
Calamity was used in Scripture as an evil used against the wicked.
Evil results in pain , sorrow, distress, etc.

Psalm 11:5 says the wicked and the one loving violence God hates.

Those violent people of Genesis God used calamity against them.
The calamity or evil of having to destroy such wicked ones.

Again calamity will be used against the wicked
(Psalm 92:7; Isaiah 11:4; Rev. 19:11,15)
An evil against them to protect the upright from the wicked.
(Proverbs 2:21,22; 10:30; Psalm 37:11,29, 38)

 

[AK4]

Calamity and evil as posted are definitely two different words.
Calamity was used in Scripture as an evil used against the wicked.
Evil results in pain , sorrow, distress, etc.

Psalm 11:5 says the wicked and the one loving violence God hates.

Those violent people of Genesis God used calamity against them.
The calamity or evil of having to destroy such wicked ones.

Again calamity will be used against the wicked
(Psalm 92:7; Isaiah 11:4; Rev. 19:11,15)
An evil against them to protect the upright from the wicked.
(Proverbs 2:21,22; 10:30; Psalm 37:11,29, 38)

God put humanity in a evil time. So even the righteous experience evil.

Ecc. 2:23—"For all his day, pains and vexation are his experience."

Ecc. 1:13—"It is an experience of evil God has given to the sons of humanity to humble them by it."

Ecc. 9:12—"For a man also knows not his time: as the fishes that are taken in an evil net, and as the birds that are caught in the snare; so are the sons of men [mankind] snared [trapped] in an evil time."

Read through Ecclesiatics and you will see all this. There are plenty other places for this too.

Oh and the most obvious of them one of all is that God create one tree not two seperate trees one with good and one with evil but one tree with the knowlege of good and evil

 

[URAVIP2ME]

God put humanity in a evil time. So even the righteous experience evil.

Ecc. 2:23—"For all his day, pains and vexation are his experience."

Ecc. 1:13—"It is an experience of evil God has given to the sons of humanity to humble them by it."

Ecc. 9:12—"For a man also knows not his time: as the fishes that are taken in an evil net, and as the birds that are caught in the snare; so are the sons of men [mankind] snared [trapped] in an evil time."

Read through Ecclesiatics and you will see all this. There are plenty other places for this too.

Oh and the most obvious of them one of all is that God create one tree not two seperate trees one with good and one with evil but one tree with the knowlege of good and evil

Absolutely the righteous experience evil, Job and Jesus especially.

Genesis puts God's creative works as 'very good!' So at the time of creation all of the paradise garden of Eden was 'very good' .

Why do you say God only created one tree and not two ?

Doesn't Genesis 2:9 mention the 'tree of life' first,
then followed by the word 'also' the tree of knowledge of good and evil?

At Genesis 3:22-24 they were barred from Not the tree of knowledge of good and evil, but were barred from the tree of life.

 

[mickiel]

Why do you say God only created one tree and not two ?

Doesn't Genesis 2:9 mention the 'tree of life' first,
then followed by the word 'also' the tree of knowledge of good and evil?

At Genesis 3:22-24 they were barred from Not the tree of knowledge of good and evil, but were barred from the tree of life.

Even more than two really, Gen. 2:9" And God caused to grow " Every Tree" that is pleasing to the eyes and good " For Food." Pleasing to the eye could mean paper birch, japenese maples, catalpa trees, weeping willow, all kinds of beautiful trees." Good for food "could include every fruit tree we know of, from Cherry trees to peach and orange.

Peace.

 

[AK4]

Absolutely the righteous experience evil, Job and Jesus especially.

Genesis puts God's creative works as 'very good!' So at the time of creation all of the paradise garden of Eden was 'very good' .

Why do you say God only created one tree and not two ?

Doesn't Genesis 2:9 mention the 'tree of life' first,
then followed by the word 'also' the tree of knowledge of good and evil?

At Genesis 3:22-24 they were barred from Not the tree of knowledge of good and evil, but were barred from the tree of life.

I was meaning that in one tree He put the knowledge of good and evil, not seperating the two. Meaning God in His wisdom put them both in one tree not two. It shows a valuable lesson in contrast and really shows the absurdity of the teaching that Adam and Eve were perfect at their creation. To know good you have to know evil, hence the verses i quoted before.

 

[mickiel]

I was meaning that in one tree He put the knowledge of good and evil, not seperating the two. Meaning God in His wisdom put them both in one tree not two. It shows a valuable lesson in contrast and really shows the absurdity of the teaching that Adam and Eve were perfect at their creation. To know good you have to know evil, hence the verses i quoted before.

I agree with you here AK4.

Peace.

 

[AK4]

"A frail and narrow bridge swings across a gulf, fearful and fathom less. On this, as it rocks wildly in the winds, a father places his young child. Beyond, on the other side of the gulf, he has placed a prize beyond estimate, which he promises to the child if he passes the bridge safely, and then compels him to go, commanding him to look neither to the right nor left. * * * The boy, heedless and disobedient, hesitates, reels, the bridge quivers for a moment, swings from under him, and hurled into the gulf, he is caught and impaled on a sharp rock down the abyss. There he hangs for long and weary years, agonizing and writhing in torture, and crying to his father for help and deliverance. But his father turns a deaf ear to all his entreaties, wholly indifferent to the horrible sufferings of his child, and justifies himself by saying, 'The boy might have passed the bridge safely, he was warned, and he suffers justly.' Admitting the possibility of passing safely, yet all men would pronounce this father a monster and a fiend. And shall God place me on the frail and narrow bridge of life, stretched over the awful and flaming abyss of endless perdition, with the possibility of a heaven beyond, and then leave me there to cross it, swinging fearfully in the winds of temptation, knowing that as a matter of fact I shall, in crossing, be precipitated into the horrible pit, there to lie for ever in hopeless agony ?"

That was a excerpt from the book Christ Triumphant. Sadly this is the type of monster people worship. Disgusting.

 

[mickiel]

That was a excerpt from the book Christ Triumphant. Sadly this is the type of monster people worship. Disgusting.

The concept of eternal hell suffering is mainly sick because of the unworthy shadow it cast on God. If you notice, even here, there exist humans who will say and believe some awful things about God , just no respect for him at all. They don't know what they are doing. And these sick concepts that religions put out there, reinforce this kind of thinking in unbelievers. It tarnishes the true reputation of a very Loving Being, that is God.

We are already suffering enough as it is, but these sick concepts protend that we will be born in a living hell called this life on earth, then die and go to hell, and exist forever within a pain amphlifier. And unbelievers are accrediting this to God.

So we must fight these rubbish religious reputations that are being attached to our God and creator.

Peace.

 

[AK4]

And unbelievers are accrediting this to God.

So we must fight these rubbish religious reputations that are being attached to our God and creator.

Peace.

I think its more of the "believers" who are accrediting this to God. I have yet to meet an athiests who defends hell stronger a christian, muslim or jew.

Actually its ironic, athiest show more "love and respect" by denying God existance than these nuts stuck in some religion---especially christianity--- who place the most blasphemous attribute to God.

 

[mickiel]

I think its more of the "believers" who are accrediting this to God. I have yet to meet an athiests who defends hell stronger a christian, muslim or jew.

Actually its ironic, athiest show more "love and respect" by denying God existance than these nuts stuck in some religion---especially christianity--- who place the most blasphemous attribute to God.

Good points, so true.

Peace.

 

[mickiel]

The sick concept of eternal hell suffering has flooded into and seriously effects the media, especially our movie industry. Its sick theme has been used constantly in motion pictures, which further spreads its ignorance.

Peace.

 

[Muffled]

Spoken like a true self absorbed, close minded, arrogant Christian.[/quote]

If that were the case I wouldn't bother with what other people believe. The good Samaritan was the only one who bothered to stop and try to assist. I can just imagine the victim saying "go away I don't want any help from a Samaritan."

Now you are professing to be a mind reader. I suppose you get your information from a crystal ball as well?

Well, as one flamboyant media person used to say, "If you got it; flaunt it." I like to think I can dance a little bit but my granddaughter doesn't think so. I know I can't tell a joke worth a darn. But I do know my Bible and I know God. Facts are facts. Black is black and white is white.

 

[Muffled]

How could they? God only told them what He wanted them to hear at the time. It is called the Theory of Prgressive Revelation.

[/quote]I believe it is referred to as The Theory Of Magic And Unsupported Stories For Children.[/quote]

Your concept is refderential. I was referring to what Biblical scholars call the theory. I don't doubt that other people theorize other things and I have seen theories propounded by scintists that religion was formed by men to explain the mysteries of the world. However I suspect that the theory you have mentioned is your own unless you can provide a reference for it.

All theories have to be proven but that doesn't mean they are easy to prove. The theory of evolution has not yet been proved and may never be because of a lack of evidence. Most history is like that. The only way you could be sure that something happened would be to go back in time and see it happen. For the Christian this is different because we have God who is an eyewitness to everything that happened.

 

[Muffled]

Don't miss this statement I made, there is so much in it. Christianity has exagerated itself, but it thinks the exgeration comes from God. God has never endorsed Christianity, show me that in the bible, you few Christians who dare to converse with me. The term " Christians", was actually developed by the Romans, they simply called the followers of Christ, " Christians", early Christians didnot create the term for themselves.

And I want to go into that seduction of " Labels that we uphold so high."

Peace.

We don't speak what we think but what we know.

Luke 2:10 And the angel said unto them, Be not afraid; for behold, I bring you good tidings of great joy which shall be to all the people: 11 for there is born to you this day in the city of David a Saviour, who is Christ the Lord.

You don't have your facts straight. The Bible does not attribute the acronym, "Christian" to any particular group. However some educated gueses would be the Jews because those were the people who were speaking out against those who believed that Jesus is the Christ. Romans and greeks had little or no concept of a Messiah.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Don't miss this statement I made, there is so much in it. Christianity has exagerated itself, but it thinks the exgeration comes from God. God has never endorsed Christianity, show me that in the bible, you few Christians who dare to converse with me. The term " Christians", was actually developed by the Romans, they simply called the followers of Christ, " Christians", early Christians didnot create the term for themselves.
Peace.

Doesn't Acts (11:26 B) say ...and the disciples were called "Christians" first in Antioch ?_____

 

[URAVIP2ME]

I think its more of the "believers" who are accrediting this to God. I have yet to meet an athiests who defends hell stronger a christian, muslim or jew.

Actually its ironic, athiest show more "love and respect" by denying God existance than these nuts stuck in some religion---especially christianity--- who place the most blasphemous attribute to God.

Christianity or Christendom?

After the first century ended there were wolves in sheep's clothing, so to speak, that would develop within what was the 'first-century Christianity' of the Bible. See Acts 20:29,30. Jesus also forewarned that in our time frame that would also be the case- Matthew 24:24.

Jesus illustration of the wheat and weeds (true and false Christians) would grow together until the separation at harvest time or our time frame has proved true.

So-called believers may credit torment in hellfire to God when Scriptures plainly states that the dead know nothing at Ecclesiastes 9:5,10.
When one knows nothing can one know either suffering or bliss ?
Being in an unconscious state is also shown true by Jesus words that liken death to being in a deep sleep. - John 11:11-14.

Even the Psalmist knew the dead sleep the sleep of death as we can see by their words at: Psalm 6:5; 13:3; 115:17; 146:4.

The prophet Daniel (12:2) believed the dead need to be awakened from death's sleep. This would be via resurrection on resurrection morning during Jesus thousand-year rule over earth. Acts 24:15.

The end for the wicked is not forever flames but the punishment of everlasting destruction. 2nd Thess. 1:9, 2:8; Matthew 12:32.