The "something can't come from nothing" argument

[Thief]

Actually if it was really swift then it would be pretty easy to pinpoint

No...unfortunately.....
The petri dish of the garden was dismantled.
The specimens were released into the environment.
That rib was lost in the grave of Eve.

 

[Monk Of Reason]

No...unfortunately.....
The petri dish of the garden was dismantled.
The specimens were released into the environment.
That rib was lost in the grave of Eve.

I'm saying that if man did somehow leap into being quickly then we would see it in the DNA and in the fossil record. However both still show that it was a gradual process.

 

[Ouroboros]

I remember I was taught in Sunday school than men have a rib missing because of Genesis, and that it was evidence for creation.

The problem is... it's not true. The majority of men have the same number of ribs as women. A small number of men (and women?) are missing a rib, but that's possible a more recent mutation.

 

[Thief]

I remember I was taught in Sunday school than men have a rib missing because of Genesis, and that it was evidence for creation.

The problem is... it's not true. The majority of men have the same number of ribs as women. A small number of men (and women?) are missing a rib, but that's possible a more recent mutation.

Some say the entire event is metaphor.
I believe the event happened.
The metaphor is the terms.
How to say to Moses....dna...?
Easier to say....'rib'.

 

[FranklinMichaelV.3]

Some say the entire event is metaphor.
I believe the event happened.
The metaphor is the terms.
How to say to Moses....dna...?
Easier to say....'rib'.

Umm...by saying DNA?

So you're saying that God could not explain to Moses how DNA works, but could do so to Crick and Watson? We had to wait over 2000+ years to finally get an explanation of how it works?

You limit God too much, God says plenty of stuff in the bible that people at the time didn't understand...yet God still said them. Could have easily told Moses what it was, could have given him the blueprints to build a microscope, you know like the blueprints given to Noah.

Anyways

Neanderthals...where did they come from?

 

[Thief]

Umm...by saying DNA?

So you're saying that God could not explain to Moses how DNA works, but could do so to Crick and Watson? We had to wait over 2000+ years to finally get an explanation of how it works?

You limit God too much, God says plenty of stuff in the bible that people at the time didn't understand...yet God still said them. Could have easily told Moses what it was, could have given him the blueprints to build a microscope, you know like the blueprints given to Noah.

Anyways

Neanderthals...where did they come from?

You can't give Genesis to Neanderthals.
And you work with what you got.

At that moment it was an eighty year old man that came trespassing.
He went up on the mountain to meet his Maker.
He went there to die.

Send the man back down the mountain with a science text in hand?

If you read Chapter two as someone at a camp fire.....
taking a rib from a man would kill him....but he lived.
taking a rib from a man while he sleeps?.....as if stealing it?
and the man would die anyway.

The story was too fantastic as written.
I'm surprised it survived all of those centuries .....at all.

 

[Bunyip]

You can't give Genesis to Neanderthals.
And you work with what you got.

At that moment it was an eighty year old man that came trespassing.
He went up on the mountain to meet his Maker.
He went there to die.

Send the man back down the mountain with a science text in hand?

If you read Chapter two as someone at a camp fire.....
taking a rib from a man would kill him....but he lived.
taking a rib from a man while he sleeps?.....as if stealing it?
and the man would die anyway.

The story was too fantastic as written.
I'm surprised it survived all of those centuries .....at all.

You have said that before, but it does not explain why god would give Moses false information. You seem to place some very strict limits on god's ability to communicate. I find it strange that you believe a creator god to be incapable of communicating complex ideas without lying.

Anyway, if as you suggest the rib is a metaphor for dna, the dna clearly disproves Adam and Eve as a historical event.

 

[Bunyip]

Ok...we are flesh.

Call your fellow man an animal to his face.....see what happens.

Well assuming that 'fellow man' has at least a high school level education, I assume that they would nod.

Of course humans are animals, we are mammals, primates and homonidae. That is a simple fact.

We are animals Theif, we are more closely related to chimpanzees than they are to gorillas. We are animals, there is no shame or insult in accepting reality.

 

[Thief]

Well assuming that 'fellow man' has at least a high school level education, I assume that they would nod.

Of course humans are animals, we are mammals, primates and homonidae. That is a simple fact.

We are animals Theif, we are more closely related to chimpanzees than they are to gorillas. We are animals, there is no shame or insult in accepting reality.

See a topic thread....Divergence....

 

[Thief]

You have said that before, but it does not explain why god would give Moses false information. You seem to place some very strict limits on god's ability to communicate. I find it strange that you believe a creator god to be incapable of communicating complex ideas without lying.

Anyway, if as you suggest the rib is a metaphor for dna, the dna clearly disproves Adam and Eve as a historical event.

The limitation comes from Man's ability to understand.

Moses didn't know what stars really are.
He didn't know what blood really is.

You could say to him....you are dust....and prove it.
Cut him.
Let him bleed on a rock.
As the blood dries and blows away.......'proof'...........and truth.

 

[idav]

I remember I was taught in Sunday school than men have a rib missing because of Genesis, and that it was evidence for creation.

The problem is... it's not true. The majority of men have the same number of ribs as women. A small number of men (and women?) are missing a rib, but that's possible a more recent mutation.

Hey if your not missing a rib then your not a descendent of Adam but of Apes, that's how it works.

 

[Ouroboros]

Hey if your not missing a rib then your not a descendent of Adam but of Apes, that's how it works.

LOL!

Yeah. That would be one explanation.

 

[fantome profane]

Hey if your not missing a rib then your not a descendent of Adam but of Apes, that's how it works.

Painful conversion process. :run:

 

[Ouroboros]

Painful conversion process. :run:

Oh. That explains the scar! Waking up in a dirty bathtub in some old building... I thought it was the kidney they were after.

 

[fantome profane]

Oh. That explains the scar! Waking up in a dirty bathtub in some old building... I thought it was the kidney they were after.

Exactly. The bathtub was because they baptized you at the same time. A twofer.

 

[Ouroboros]

Exactly. The bathtub was because they baptized you at the same time. A twofer.

A twofer! That's a great word. Oh, it's the greatest word that we conceive so it must be the God-word.

 

[Thief]

I remember I was taught in Sunday school than men have a rib missing because of Genesis, and that it was evidence for creation.

The problem is... it's not true. The majority of men have the same number of ribs as women. A small number of men (and women?) are missing a rib, but that's possible a more recent mutation.

Actually...it doesn't have to be a metaphor.

It could be literal....no implied dna notation at all.

It could have been a rib extraction and cloning as I've been posting all these years.

As the rib that doesn't seem to be missing now.....
Cain had no choice other than the population at hand.
(all the others not involved in the garden event)
The extraction of a rib for the sake of cloning would not induce a genetic mutation.

 

[Bunyip]

The limitation comes from Man's ability to understand.

Moses didn't know what stars really are.
He didn't know what blood really is.

You could say to him....you are dust....and prove it.
Cut him.
Let him bleed on a rock.
As the blood dries and blows away.......'proof'...........and truth.

So what? Moses lack of knowledge does not in any way explain why god would lie to him. It does not in anyway justiify or explaint the incompatibilities between the story and historical fact.

You seem to repeat that same objection over and over again, I find it hard to believe that nobody has ever pointed out how useless an excuse it is before.

 

[McBell]

So what? Moses lack of knowledge does not in any way explain why god would lie to him. It does not in anyway justiify or explaint the incompatibilities between the story and historical fact.

You seem to repeat that same objection over and over again, I find it hard to believe that nobody has ever pointed out how useless an excuse it is before.

I have been telling him for years that he needs a new song and dance...

 

[Thief]

So what? Moses lack of knowledge does not in any way explain why god would lie to him. It does not in anyway justiify or explaint the incompatibilities between the story and historical fact.

You seem to repeat that same objection over and over again, I find it hard to believe that nobody has ever pointed out how useless an excuse it is before.

Specifically.....what lie are you inferring?