The Trinity

[Robert.Evans]

The cross and the trinity are both sort of entwined to come up with the trinity doctrine, which is of course, is made up.

haha.. Ok, right. Well I go with the two thirds of the planet that believes in intellignece rather than the smaller part that says its luck.. haha

 

[Muffled]

Childish reasonings will get you nowhere.

I beleive fallacious logic won't get you anywhere either. I am simply pointing out your fallacy.

 

[Muffled]

The Trinity doctrine is a clear example of how politics affected the creation of Christianity. It was the heavy handiness of the Roman Emperor Constantine that ended an important debate that pushed the Trinity doctrine as the prevailing belief of Christians. Constantine needed as many Pagans possible converted to Christianity as soon as possible. He intervened and silenced the Arius branch of Christianity, that believed Yeshua( Jesus ) was less than God and not the son, and went with the version that would appeal to Pagans, multi Gods.

I wasn't aware that Constantine wrote anything to that affect. I believe the Arians held a false belief so it comes out right in the end and there were plenty of representatives who held the Trinity position.

 

[Muffled]

I attempt to live an authentic life, and I avoid the toxicity of most organised religions. If that makes me uneducated and uninformed then I am doing something right!

The Bible is the word of Man.

I read the posts here for solely entertainment purposes!

Awomen

I believe deciding that something is toxic before reading it qualifies you as prejuidiced. I believe the Bible has life in it and toxicity is that which removes life so it makes no sense to me that one would view it that way.

I don't believe so. I believe it would be like not reading a math book because someone did a number on you. I believe math books are helpful in life.

I believe there is some of the word of man in it as in the Chronicles but even then it is isnpired by God. If you mean that it is just some man's concept, I would disagree and ask you to prove it.

I believe that is better than some who just wish to be perverse. Unfortuantely I don't have much of a sense of humor although I try. I suspect what appears funny to you will seem quite logical to me.

 

[BTROD]

I believe deciding that something is toxic before reading it qualifies you as prejuidiced. I believe the Bible has life in it and toxicity is that which removes life so it makes no sense to me that one would view it that way.

BTROD: I have read the Bible. It, I read and understand it allegorically, Am I prejudiced?! Nope!

I don't believe so. I believe it would be like not reading a math book because someone did a number on you. I believe math books are helpful in life.

BTROD: I like maths! Numbers are erotic!

I believe there is some of the word of man in it as in the Chronicles but even then it is isnpired by God. If you mean that it is just some man's concept, I would disagree and ask you to prove it.

BTROD: It is written by Man, therefore it is the word of Man.

I believe that is better than some who just wish to be perverse. Unfortuantely I don't have much of a sense of humor although I try. I suspect what appears funny to you will seem quite logical to me.

BTROD: Fair enough! Even when I was diagnosed with cancer I rolled with it and laughed at cancer, and hey, I'm still here after three encounters with cancer! The trick is not to fall for the drama which the System has attached to cancer!

 

[Nada]

I beleive fallacious logic won't get you anywhere either. I am simply pointing out your fallacy.

What you believe and what is true are two separate things.:yes:

 

[Jensen]

It took me hours to find this topic.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

In my teaching, I call the Trinity a "false monotheism." Meaning: you wouldn't be able to tell it was three gods unless someone told you that it was one.

 

[Jensen]

Are you saying that God is triune or not? I haven't seen enough of your posts to know what your view is on this.

 

[Muffled]

BTROD: Fair enough! Even when I was diagnosed with cancer I rolled with it and laughed at cancer, and hey, I'm still here after three encounters with cancer! The trick is not to fall for the drama which the System has attached to cancer!

I believe I should congratulate you because real belief is difficult to obtain and some who want to believe that Cancer will not take their lives will still have the doctor's death sentence rattling around in their psyche. I had an uncle who was a Chistian Scientisit who wanted to believe that Cancer wouldn't kill him but it did anyway.

 

[Muffled]

What you believe and what is true are two separate things.:yes:

I only say "believe" because the staff has informed me that no-one can categorically know anything and most particularly about religion. I believe that logic is better than imagination for proving that something is true. Logic has rules and when one breaks those rules the logic is called a fallacy.

 

[Muffled]

In my teaching, I call the Trinity a "false monotheism." Meaning: you wouldn't be able to tell it was three gods unless someone told you that it was one.

I believe that seems backwards to me. I call the Trinity a true monotheism because the evidence supports it. I believe if someone views the Trinity as three gods the person has a falacious understanding of scripture.

Howeveer the Doctrine of the Trinity does contain that fallacious view that would lead one to believe it means three gods contrary to scripture. I minght also point out that the Doctrine of the Trinity was rejected at the Council of Niocea.

 

[crazyrussian]

1+1+1=1? or 1+1+1=3 or 1+1+1= something else?

This is what Jesus had to say about the Trinity. Christianity made their own version as seen in current Christian Cannon.



"1. AGAIN Jesus taught them saying, God hath raised up witnesses to the truth in every
nation and every age, that all might know the will of the Eternal and do it, and after that,
enter into the kingdom, to be rulers and workers with the Eternal,
2. God is Power, Love and Wisdom, and these three are One. God is Truth, Goodness and
Beauty, and these three are One.
3. God is Justice, Knowledge and Purity, and these three are One. God is Splendor,
Compassion and Holiness, and these three are One.
4. And these four Trinities are One in the hidden Deity, the Perfect, the Infinite, the
only.
5. Likewise in every man who is perfected, there are three persons, that of the son, that of
the spouse. and that of the father, and these three are one.
6. So in every woman who is Perfected are there three persons, that of the daughter, that
of the bride, and that of the mother and these three are one; and the man and the woman
are one, even as God is One
7. Thus it is with God the Father-Mother, in Whom is neither male nor female and in
Whom is both, and each is threefold, and all are One in the hidden Unity.
8. Marvel not at this, for as it is above so it is below, and as it is below so it is above, and
that which is on earth is so, because it is so in Heaven.
9. Again I say unto you, I and My Bride are one, even as Maria Magdalena, whom I have
chosen and sanctified unto Myself as a type, is one with Me; I and My Church are One.
And the Church is the elect of humanity for the salvation of all.
10. The Church of the first born is the Maria of God. Thus saith the Eternal, She is My
Mother and she hath ever conceived Me, and brought Me forth as Her Son in every age
and clime. She is My Bride, ever one in Holy Union with Me her Spouse. She is My
Daughter, for she hath ever issued and proceeded from Me her Father, rejoicing in Me.
11. And these two Trinities are One in the Eternal, and are strewn forth in each man and
woman who are made perfect, ever being born of God, and rejoicing in light, ever being
lifted up and made one with God, ever conceiving and bringing forth God for the
salvation of the many.
12. This is the Mystery of the Trinity in Humanity, and moreover in every individual
child of man must be accomplished the mystery of God, ever witnessing to the light,
suffering for the truth, ascending into Heaven, and sending forth the Spirit of Truth And
this is the path of salvation, for the kingdom of God is within.
13. And one said unto him, Master, when shall the kingdom come? And he answered and
said, When that which is without shall be as that which is within, and that which is within
shall be as that which is without, and, the male with the female, neither male nor female,
but the two in One. They who have ears to hear, let them hear."

 

[sojourner]

This is what Jesus had to say about the Trinity. Christianity made their own version as seen in current Christian Cannon.



"1. AGAIN Jesus taught them saying, God hath raised up witnesses to the truth in every
nation and every age, that all might know the will of the Eternal and do it, and after that,
enter into the kingdom, to be rulers and workers with the Eternal,
2. God is Power, Love and Wisdom, and these three are One. God is Truth, Goodness and
Beauty, and these three are One.
3. God is Justice, Knowledge and Purity, and these three are One. God is Splendor,
Compassion and Holiness, and these three are One.
4. And these four Trinities are One in the hidden Deity, the Perfect, the Infinite, the
only.
5. Likewise in every man who is perfected, there are three persons, that of the son, that of
the spouse. and that of the father, and these three are one.
6. So in every woman who is Perfected are there three persons, that of the daughter, that
of the bride, and that of the mother and these three are one; and the man and the woman
are one, even as God is One
7. Thus it is with God the Father-Mother, in Whom is neither male nor female and in
Whom is both, and each is threefold, and all are One in the hidden Unity.
8. Marvel not at this, for as it is above so it is below, and as it is below so it is above, and
that which is on earth is so, because it is so in Heaven.
9. Again I say unto you, I and My Bride are one, even as Maria Magdalena, whom I have
chosen and sanctified unto Myself as a type, is one with Me; I and My Church are One.
And the Church is the elect of humanity for the salvation of all.
10. The Church of the first born is the Maria of God. Thus saith the Eternal, She is My
Mother and she hath ever conceived Me, and brought Me forth as Her Son in every age
and clime. She is My Bride, ever one in Holy Union with Me her Spouse. She is My
Daughter, for she hath ever issued and proceeded from Me her Father, rejoicing in Me.
11. And these two Trinities are One in the Eternal, and are strewn forth in each man and
woman who are made perfect, ever being born of God, and rejoicing in light, ever being
lifted up and made one with God, ever conceiving and bringing forth God for the
salvation of the many.
12. This is the Mystery of the Trinity in Humanity, and moreover in every individual
child of man must be accomplished the mystery of God, ever witnessing to the light,
suffering for the truth, ascending into Heaven, and sending forth the Spirit of Truth And
this is the path of salvation, for the kingdom of God is within.
13. And one said unto him, Master, when shall the kingdom come? And he answered and
said, When that which is without shall be as that which is within, and that which is within
shall be as that which is without, and, the male with the female, neither male nor female,
but the two in One. They who have ears to hear, let them hear."

...aaaand... this is from... ?

 

[neologist]

This is what Jesus had to say about the Trinity. Christianity made their own version as seen in current Christian Cannon. " . . . ."

Excuse me. But its very confusing to good old boys like me when you set something in quotes without giving the source.

I can't help It. I was born in New Jersey.

 

[Muffled]

This is what Jesus had to say about the Trinity. Christianity made their own version as seen in current Christian Cannon.



"1. AGAIN Jesus taught them saying, God hath raised up witnesses to the truth in every
nation and every age, that all might know the will of the Eternal and do it, and after that,
enter into the kingdom, to be rulers and workers with the Eternal,
2. God is Power, Love and Wisdom, and these three are One. God is Truth, Goodness and
Beauty, and these three are One.
3. God is Justice, Knowledge and Purity, and these three are One. God is Splendor,
Compassion and Holiness, and these three are One.
4. And these four Trinities are One in the hidden Deity, the Perfect, the Infinite, the
only.
5. Likewise in every man who is perfected, there are three persons, that of the son, that of
the spouse. and that of the father, and these three are one.
6. So in every woman who is Perfected are there three persons, that of the daughter, that
of the bride, and that of the mother and these three are one; and the man and the woman
are one, even as God is One
7. Thus it is with God the Father-Mother, in Whom is neither male nor female and in
Whom is both, and each is threefold, and all are One in the hidden Unity.
8. Marvel not at this, for as it is above so it is below, and as it is below so it is above, and
that which is on earth is so, because it is so in Heaven.
9. Again I say unto you, I and My Bride are one, even as Maria Magdalena, whom I have
chosen and sanctified unto Myself as a type, is one with Me; I and My Church are One.
And the Church is the elect of humanity for the salvation of all.
10. The Church of the first born is the Maria of God. Thus saith the Eternal, She is My
Mother and she hath ever conceived Me, and brought Me forth as Her Son in every age
and clime. She is My Bride, ever one in Holy Union with Me her Spouse. She is My
Daughter, for she hath ever issued and proceeded from Me her Father, rejoicing in Me.
11. And these two Trinities are One in the Eternal, and are strewn forth in each man and
woman who are made perfect, ever being born of God, and rejoicing in light, ever being
lifted up and made one with God, ever conceiving and bringing forth God for the
salvation of the many.
12. This is the Mystery of the Trinity in Humanity, and moreover in every individual
child of man must be accomplished the mystery of God, ever witnessing to the light,
suffering for the truth, ascending into Heaven, and sending forth the Spirit of Truth And
this is the path of salvation, for the kingdom of God is within.
13. And one said unto him, Master, when shall the kingdom come? And he answered and
said, When that which is without shall be as that which is within, and that which is within
shall be as that which is without, and, the male with the female, neither male nor female,
but the two in One. They who have ears to hear, let them hear."

I believe you should state what the correct version of the Trinity should be so we can see if it agrees with scripture.

 

[Im42nut2]

If one understands the way life actually works, one can understand the idea of the trinity. It just baffles me that the idea came from religion.

There is only an energy field living life. All life forms are but a continuation of that life. Mankind is only one of them. We started as a small portion of energy our mothers gave up for us. We grow outward into the energy field such that a full grown person's energy is about 99% from the field. We are spiritual beings, spiritually linked to the field, egg-shaped, about the size we can stretch in all directions. We manifest our whole spirit into physical energy, including our bodies, which creates the illusion of a three dimensional world.

Therefore we are all God. We are all 'sons' of God. And we are spiritual beings only.

 

[Christ's Prophet]

I believe that he was saying that he, God, and us are one in unity. That is what those verses seem to say to me. I know that isn't quite what you believe but I think that is what those verses are saying in context and that is what Jesus meant. I think he is speaking in unity of purpose, will, righteousness, obedience, belief and acceptance of God, and not of substance, such as oneness or trinity, but more of being of like mindedness.

John 17

20 Neither for these only do I pray, but for them also that believe on me through their word;
21 that they may all be one; even as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be in us: that the world may believe that thou didst send me.
22 And the glory which thou hast given me I have given unto them; that they may be one, even as we are one;
23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be perfected into one; that the world may know that thou didst send me, and lovedst them, even as thou lovedst me.

I don’t think it has anything to do with just unity. It is much more than that. Notice the Scriptures that you have cited:- John 17:21-23 (KJV)
21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art IN me, and I IN thee, that they also may be one IN us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. 22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one: 23 I IN them, and thou IN me, that they may be made perfect IN one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
The oneness refers to fact that Jesus said that the Father is IN Me, and I am IN the Father, and they are IN the believers. What we are talking about here is something wonderful and marvellous. I will try to make it as simple as I can:-

1. There is no place where God is not there. Theoretically, If God was not in any place, that place and anything there, would not exist. Nothing exists without God. Therefore, the furthest stars and the nearest galaxies, your very next breath, your next heartbeat is there because of God’s Spirit and His mercy. He is the Creator of all things. Nothing happens unless He allows it to happen, or He makes it to happen. He is Sovereign over all.
2. When Christ said ‘as thou, Father, art IN me, and I in thee, that they also may be one IN us: We have to take it as read. God’s Spirit is IN all those who believe. Without God’s Spirit, you cannot be saved. Let me put it this way. God is one massive organic Being who fills the universe. The same Spirit that I pray is IN you, is the same Spirit that rose Jesus Christ our Lord from the dead; it is the same Spirit that seals us unto the day of redemption. We are all indeed a part of one another, literally. This is the mystery, and a wonderful mystery at that. Hope this helps. Christ’s Prophet. Certainty for eternity.

 

[Muffled]

If one understands the way life actually works, one can understand the idea of the trinity. It just baffles me that the idea came from religion.

There is only an energy field living life. All life forms are but a continuation of that life. Mankind is only one of them. We started as a small portion of energy our mothers gave up for us. We grow outward into the energy field such that a full grown person's energy is about 99% from the field. We are spiritual beings, spiritually linked to the field, egg-shaped, about the size we can stretch in all directions. We manifest our whole spirit into physical energy, including our bodies, which creates the illusion of a three dimensional world.

Therefore we are all God. We are all 'sons' of God. And we are spiritual beings only.

I believe your conclusion does not follow from the premises and I doubt you could prove the premises are true.

 

[Muffled]

I don’t think it has anything to do with just unity. It is much more than that. Notice the Scriptures that you have cited:- John 17:21-23 (KJV)
21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art IN me, and I IN thee, that they also may be one IN us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. 22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one: 23 I IN them, and thou IN me, that they may be made perfect IN one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
The oneness refers to fact that Jesus said that the Father is IN Me, and I am IN the Father, and they are IN the believers. What we are talking about here is something wonderful and marvellous. I will try to make it as simple as I can:-

1. There is no place where God is not there. Theoretically, If God was not in any place, that place and anything there, would not exist. Nothing exists without God. Therefore, the furthest stars and the nearest galaxies, your very next breath, your next heartbeat is there because of God’s Spirit and His mercy. He is the Creator of all things. Nothing happens unless He allows it to happen, or He makes it to happen. He is Sovereign over all.
2. When Christ said ‘as thou, Father, art IN me, and I in thee, that they also may be one IN us: We have to take it as read. God’s Spirit is IN all those who believe. Without God’s Spirit, you cannot be saved. Let me put it this way. God is one massive organic Being who fills the universe. The same Spirit that I pray is IN you, is the same Spirit that rose Jesus Christ our Lord from the dead; it is the same Spirit that seals us unto the day of redemption. We are all indeed a part of one another, literally. This is the mystery, and a wonderful mystery at that. Hope this helps. Christ’s Prophet. Certainty for eternity.

I believe this sounds nice but it does not satisfy what scripture says. in John 14:16 Jesus says He will send another comforter. If it were just a matter of God's spirit existing in all things then Jesus would not have to do any sending. However if the Spirit indwelling a person is a different state than just exsting in Him then only those who invite God to indwell them will have God present as Lord of the Body.