Theists, why did god create these plants/fungi?

[Magic Man]

Just FYI: not all theists believe that "everything was designed by a supreme intelligent being with a purpose in mind".... some questions are better left to scientists.

That's true, but no atheists think that, so it's fair to narrow it down to theists, and then those who don't believe it don't need to respon...well, they don't have to respond.

 

[Father Heathen]

Valid, perhaps, for 3-year old who didn't want to bring up the so-called problem of evil directly which has been done many time over in RF. Which is why most of the responding post from the same choir.

I'm forgive you for relying on childish insults to compensate for your intellectual inadequacies. I'm familiar with "the problem of evil", but not sure how that would relate to plants. If you can't handle the subject matter, best move along son and let the grown-ups talk.

 

[Magic Man]

Good. Maybe it will put an end to the stupidity.

It's funny, I'd say that you not posting would go a long way towards that goal. :yes:

 

[Father Heathen]

It's funny, I'd say that you not posting would go a long way towards that goal. :yes:

I almost feel bad for him. Evidently my posts turn his face beet red as he drenches his monitor in spittle. If he's not careful he might suffer an aneurysm or a heart attack. I hate to think that one of my posts could be the end of him.

 

[Scott1]

That's true, but no atheists think that, so it's fair to narrow it down to theists, and then those who don't believe it don't need to respon...well, they don't have to respond.

Ummm... some atheists do.... some of my best friends are atheists and they are valuable members here on the forum.

Peace

 

[Father Heathen]

Ummm... some atheists do.... some of my best friends are atheists and they are valuable members here on the forum.

Peace

If they believe a divine creator, how could they be atheists?

 

[Alex_G]

If everything was designed by a supreme intelligent being with a purpose in mind, what were the intentions behind cannabis, salvia, ayahuasca, psilocybin mushrooms, etc?
Just curious what people think.

Ah, purpose is a human observation, and thus things can be judged to have purpose or not in various specific scenarios depending on the criteria. Eg Cannabis to a junky has a purpose, but a different one to a terminally ill patient in distress. Seeing as i dont believe in God, the ability to asses purpose extends as far as us. To say that God is able to see purpose in things also, only strengthens my view that he is an anthropomorphism.

 

[Scott1]

If they believe a divine creator, how could they be atheists?

Oops.... not thinking... meant agnostics.

Carry on.

 

[Rolling_Stone]

I'm forgive you for relying on childish insults to compensate for your intellectual inadequacies. I'm familiar with "the problem of evil", but not sure how that would relate to plants. If you can't handle the subject matter, best move along son and let the grown-ups talk.

In this statement you illustrate why you might drown in a parking lot puddle.

The OP is used to question the existence of a purposeful designer through implication: the same tactic as the so-called problem of evil. It's impertinent at best, not meant to be part of dialog or even debate. It's argumentative. If you want answers to such questions, you must pursue them as a believer. Otherwise, the answer cannot possibly have any meaning for you.

(Actually, it's a very good example of why religion cannot be understood from the outside.)

 

[Tau]

The toxins in these plant and fungi life forms are originally the product of evolution, to deter animals from eating them, although in the case of humans and some other animals whom enjoy being wasted, encouraging them.

Magic mushrooms (liberty caps) originated, my mother used to tell me, from mead spilled from the beak of Odin when He flew across Britain and Eire (Ireland) in the form of some kind of bird, stork?

I am a theist but I agree with the scientific explanation for magic mushrooms, yet like the Pagan one better.

 

[Father Heathen]

Ah, purpose is a human observation, and thus things can be judged to have purpose or not in various specific scenarios depending on the criteria. Eg Cannabis to a junky has a purpose, but a different one to a terminally ill patient in distress. Seeing as i dont believe in God, the ability to asses purpose extends as far as us. To say that God is able to see purpose in things also, only strengthens my view that he is an anthropomorphism.

Besides recreational and medicinal use, many of these plants have a history of use in shamanistic religions.

 

[Father Heathen]

In this statement you illustrate why you might drown in a parking lot puddle.

The OP is used to question the existence of a purposeful designer through implication: the same tactic as the so-called problem of evil. It's impertinent at best, not meant to be part of dialog or even debate. It's argumentative. If you want answers to such questions, you must pursue them as a believer. Otherwise, the answer cannot possibly have any meaning for you.

(Actually, it's a very good example of why religion cannot be understood from the outside.)

It wasn't a rhetorical question. I was genuinely interested in what people thought. To be honest it was just something I pulled out of the air just to start a conversational topic. I'm sorry that it caused you so much emotional distress. Hug?

Oh, and this might come to a shock to you, but not all theistic beliefs are abrahamic, meaning a wide variation in viewpoints toward the question.

 

[Booko]

If everything was designed by a supreme intelligent being with a purpose in mind, what were the intentions behind cannabis, salvia, ayahuasca, psilocybin mushrooms, etc?
Just curious what people think.

Cannabis: a medicinal herb with many beneficial uses, from glaucoma to boosting the appetite of the frail and cancer patients to pain relief in those with severe pain from chronic and terminal illness.

Salvia: A very drought tolerant flowering plant that supports butterfly and bee populations. (And what, you don't like sage in your turkey stuffing? ) I'm thing from context you meant salvia divinorum, though, yes? Um, there is some weight of evidence that that particular cultivar of salvia is the result of human breeding intervention and is not naturally occuring on its own. If so, you can't ask God why he did that...just the original cultvators. At any rate, other than its psychoactive potential, it has some use as a pain reliever.

Ayahuasca: Hm, not so sure about this other than passiflora has similar uses, which implies it has medicinal value for depression. (Oh, I see ayahuasca is an MAOI inhibitor. Well that makes sense. Frankly I would rather use the naturally occurring plant source under the direction of a knowledgable herbalist or naturopath rather than the Pharma fake derivatives of the same, but that's just me. )

Psilocybin mushrooms: Hm, I'm least acquainted with these, other than the liver metabolizes it into psilocin which has some effect on seratonin levels, though I'm not sure exactly what. If memory serves, psilocybin has a problem in that tolerance builds up swiftly? And the side effects make it less useful for medicine. As for its ecological niche in its native habitat, I can't speak to that. What native animals or plants consume it for food?

Well, I guess if you ask someone studying naturopathy, this is the kind of answer you can expect.

 

[Alex_G]

Besides recreational and medicinal use, many of these plants have a history of use in shamanistic religions.

Yeah i can imagine, i just gave 2 examples out of many Never the less, its shows how purpose is a subjective viewpoit that varies between people.

 

[Booko]

What God sends a person to hell for recreational drug use?

Uh, and now that I actually read your first reply, why assume those things were just for recreational drug use?

Alcohol is regarded as a recreational drug as well, legal though it may be, but it also has medicinal uses, eh?

Thanks for the mention of ayahuasca in connection with elimination of parasites. I did not know that. I use a formulation with artemisia, oregano oil, garlic, black walnut bark, grapefruit seed extract, and pumpkin seed myself. The side effects of those are nil by comparison.

But you know, if you were living in that are in a time when humanity didn't get around so much, ayahuasca would be safer than the parasites.

 

[Ringer]

Uh, and now that I actually read your first reply, why assume those things were just for recreational drug use?

Based on the OP, I assumed that the motivation behind the thread was to question why God would create harmful plants/fungi. I firmly believe, and it seems that you may feel the same way, that most if not all plants on this earth has potential benefits in our lives. I was also questioning why Whereismynotecard believes that any God would send somebody to Hell even if they used these substances for recreational purposes only and not medicinal.

 

[Scuba Pete]

I was also questioning why Whereismynotecard believes that any God would send somebody to Hell even if they used these substances for recreational purposes only and not medicinal.

It's certainly NOT in the Bible, and in fact the exact opposite is! We are free from all that crap!

But hey, why mess with such a good misconception?

 

[Magic Man]

In this statement you illustrate why you might drown in a parking lot puddle.

The OP is used to question the existence of a purposeful designer through implication: the same tactic as the so-called problem of evil. It's impertinent at best, not meant to be part of dialog or even debate. It's argumentative. If you want answers to such questions, you must pursue them as a believer. Otherwise, the answer cannot possibly have any meaning for you.

(Actually, it's a very good example of why religion cannot be understood from the outside.)

You really are a funny guy! (to be read in a Ray Liotta voice)

 

[Ringer]

You really are a funny guy! (to be read in a Ray Liotta voice)

I would have said he really is a fungi! *drum roll*

 

[Father Heathen]

Based on the OP, I assumed that the motivation behind the thread was to question why God would create harmful plants/fungi.

I wasn't implying the plants/fungi were harmful, per se. In fact a lot of them are arguably less harmful and addictive than alcohol.