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There are no eyewitness accounts of Jesus in the New Testament

YoursTrue

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
Trailblazer said:
You must have faith to think that the New Testament is the utterances of Jesus.
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@Trailblazer I guess this is where I thought you said that someone would believe the "New Testament" is the utterances of Jesus. Because I surely do not see that Jesus wrote any of the 4 gospel accounts. But he was quoted by some, and some were eye-witnesses. I'm guessing you don't believe that. The "New Testament" is written about Jesus. Take care and have a nice day/evening/ whatever it is now in your part of the world.
 
Trailblazer

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
YoursTrue said:
@Trailblazer I guess this is where I thought you said that someone would believe the "New Testament" is the utterances of Jesus. Because I surely do not see that Jesus wrote any of the 4 gospel accounts. But he was quoted by some, and some were eye-witnesses. I'm guessing you don't believe that. The "New Testament" is written about Jesus. Take care and have a nice day/evening/ whatever it is now in your part of the world.
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I believe that the "New Testament" is written about Jesus.
I do not believe that Jesus wrote any of the 4 gospel accounts. Jesus was quoted by some, and some were said to be eye-witnesses, but I do not believe that they were eye witnesses.
 
YoursTrue

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
Trailblazer said:
I believe that the "New Testament" is written about Jesus.
....Jesus was quoted by some, and some were said to be eye-witnesses, but I do not believe that they were eye witnesses.
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I obviously do not share your belief. But just so I understand what did the one you say is a messenger of God (Bahaullah) say about that, if anything?
 
YoursTrue

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
Subduction Zone said:
I have no idea. I am going to agree somewhat with almost everyone. Even if Stalin was next to me we might agree about the weather.

Please drop the "So what?" argument.
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You're the one that says "so what," not me. And how much of Bahalluah have you read? 30% -- 2% -- 95%?
 
YoursTrue

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
Subduction Zone said:
You are the one that uses arguments that can be refuted by a simple"So what?" How do you not understand that yet?
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what you are providing is a fallacious way of discussing. Really -- have a nice evening if it's evening where you're at. Or maybe it's not evening...where you're at. Wanna say so what now? Why not? or maybe you do...:)
 
Subduction Zone

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
YoursTrue said:
what you are providing is a fallacious way of discussing. Really -- have a nice evening if it's evening where you're at. Or maybe it's not evening...where you're at. Wanna say so what now? Why not?
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No, observing your failures and commenting on them is not a logical fallacy. If I tried to say "That means that you are always wrong" that would be one. But I did not do that.
 
shunyadragon

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
CG Didymus said:
But, even with the original writings of Baha'u'llah, Baha'is have the same problem... How do they "prove" that Baha'u'llah is a manifestation of God and that God is real?
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There is no proof that any claim in the history of humanity that any claim of a messianic or 'enlightened' person with a message from the 'Source' some call God(s) or that the "Source' exists.

The writings and history of the life of Baha'u'llah do not have the same problem as the more ancient scriptures, because there is abundant documentation, historical provenance and witnesses to the life and works written by Baha'u'llah.
CG Didymus said:
TB is the only Baha'i I know that just says that there is no proof, only evidence. But other Baha'is continue to say the "proof" is Baha'u'llah.. his writing, his character, and his mission.
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I do not and never have claimed any such proof. There is not for any subjective religious belief and belief in the "Source" some call God(s).
CG Didymus said:
For some of us, that's not good enough and complain to Baha'is that their proof and evidence isn't "tangible" proof.
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There is no tangible proof for any subjective religious belief nor that for the "Source" some call God(s),


CG Didymus said:
How do you handle that type of question when it comes to supporting the validity of the claims of Baha'u'llah?
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Primarily. I simply believe. I do not make outrageous egocentric claims of proof. I have gone into great detail in threads in the past concerning my beliefs. It does center around that IF the 'Source' some call God(s) exists it is a Universal "Source" far beyond the limited beliefs of any religion and the Baha'i Faith. The ancient religions are the most problematic, because they reflect an ancient cultural and tribal view of God, and claim their God is the only God.

The only certainty of the Divine from the human perspectiive is the humility that our beliefs beyond the nature of our physical existence are subjective and in reality we do not know.

Science is the only reliable source of information concerning the physical nature of our existence, and it is always open to change when there is new knowledge.
 
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