There is more then enough evidence to prove God exists.

[Bunyip]

Ancient texts and peoples concluding there is a God.
No different than any academia papers today concluding theres not.

Sure. Ancient people also concluded that the sun orbits the earth, that mice were created by litter and slamanders were created by fire.

They also concluded that the earth was flat, what was your point?

 

[outhouse]

Hey everyone,

Hows it going.

And welcome to the forum.

I really dont think there is a shred of evidence to suggest the oldest cultures we know of from a religious and secular standpoint came up with these ideas out of thin air.

very true.

mythology wasnt really handed down, but carried down from one to another by oral traditions.

Whats funny is every description of god mirrors the culture decribing him, and defining him. Exactly as if they created him and evolved the concept to mirror thei rcultural wants needs and fears.

I would argue over the course of time God has been observed and tested,

something not proveable beyond mythology.

just read any religious text. Peoples individual experiences certainly give ground to evidences something greater exists.

mythology covers this.

To say religions all over the world in every part of the planet just sprang out of nowhere would be extremely inconsistent with history...

They did not spring out of nowhere, nor their beliefs.


If you study cultural anthropology it is easy to trace ancient belief structures.

Given the many experiences I have had with atheist it really seems to come down to not wanting to be held accountable outside the rule of man.

Waht rule of man may you be speaking of??

but it all always comes back to the question of how nothing came from something.

Maybe for you

many of us would rather claim we dont know, then continue ancient mens ,mistakes of attributing what they dont know to some god.

Lightning gods
Volcano gods
rain gods

ect ect ect are all examples of how gods are created.


You might want to study polytheism a little more before talking about gods

How do we know?

You dont.


You only what you were taught growing up.


You do understand man has a bad habit of creating deities???

Do you believe in the thousands of other gods created and defined by man???

NO? oh! so were just the same! we dont believe other cultures mythology. But somehow you want me to believe your mythology :sarcastic

 

[Awkward Fingers]

Given the many experiences I have had with atheist it really seems to come down to not wanting to be held accountable outside the rule of man.

I would quite like to hear more about these experiences in detail, and see how exactly you came to this conclusion.

 

[outhouse]

Would also add that because there has to be a finite begining there has to be an unknown force that started it all. Thats actually what the science says

gravity is an unknown force, should we say Odin did it? Yahweh? Jesus? Zues? El? Sun gods?

 

[Awkward Fingers]

Would also add that because there has to be a finite begining there has to be an unknown force that started it all. Thats actually what the science says

So, how exactly do you go from "unknown force" to anything other than " unknown force"

What information/data/evidence are you using to get past it simply being an undefined event?

 

[outhouse]

Ancient texts and peoples concluding there is a God.
No different than any academia papers today concluding theres not.

There is a huge difference.

You cannot pit observed facts of science in acedemia.

VS

ancient people who thought rain came from gods because they were ignorant of the natural world around them.

 

[adi2d]

Welcome to the forums. Hope you brought your thinking cap

 

[Fredcow9]

There is a huge difference.

You cannot pit observed facts of science in acedemia.

VS

ancient people who thought rain came from gods because they were ignorant of the natural world around them.

So the same people that built the pyramids and really made some great strides towards science in their culture are discredited because?
Their writings are observed facts. What evidence do you have to the contrary?
For example provide any evidence an observed event of religious significance did not take place from any advanced ancient civilization. Im not saying its all 100% true but neither are todays academia.
I dont recall any mainline religion believing gods made it rain because they felt like being nice that day...where are you getting that from?

 

[Fredcow9]

So, how exactly do you go from "unknown force" to anything other than " unknown force"

What information/data/evidence are you using to get past it simply being an undefined event?

What information/data/evidence are you using to suggest magically things appeared from nowhere? Where is that observed?

 

[outhouse]

So the same people that built the pyramids and really made some great strides towards science in their culture are discredited because?

Who is discrediting these ancient people?

Their writings are observed facts.

Only for how their culture evolved.

I dont recall any mainline religion believing gods made it rain because they felt like being nice that day...where are you getting that from?

Do you think rain was important to the Nazca culture in Peru? In one of the driest deserts around? Do you think a little water was important? HHmm?

One thing you will learn from polytheism, is all cultural needs for any civilization are tied to mythology and gods.

 

[Fredcow9]

Who is discrediting these ancient people?




Only for how their culture evolved.




Do you think rain was important to the Nazca culture in Peru? In one of the driest deserts around? Do you think a little water was important? HHmm?

One thing you will learn from polytheism, is all cultural needs for any civilization are tied to mythology and gods.

Mmmm nah, the same could be said of our culture. Easily things could turn out that we are looked at in the same way in terms of actually thinking animals transform into completely different species through evolution. The one consistent thing that has always remained is that a God is the origin of all things. Again even in todays academia its a view held by more than enough decorated scientists.
Im sure it was very important.

 

[outhouse]

Easily things could turn out that we are looked at in the same way in terms of actually thinking animals transform into completely different species through evolution.

You do understand evolution is fact?

It has been observed. So using something that is only observed on paper is not really in the same league.

The one consistent thing that has always remained is that a God is the origin of all things.

In mythology

 

[Awkward Fingers]

What information/data/evidence are you using to suggest magically things appeared from nowhere? Where is that observed?

Where did I suggest that?
And please answer the previous question.

 

[Fredcow9]

You do understand evolution is fact?

It has been observed. So using something that is only observed on paper is not really in the same league.




In mythology

False. No animal has been observed to change into a completely different animal before our own eyes. The evolution you are reffering to occurs in significantly less time than millions of years. Thats not enough to make the jump that everything works that way...
Hm so if our civilization collapsed and mankind was set back as so many other cultures were from barbarian takeovers for example, the writings of sir isaac newton, einstein, stephen hawking ect just loose their credibility overnight? Arent academia journals on paper so to speak?

 

[Fredcow9]

Where did I suggest that?
And please answer the previous question.

No Im asking you that. How do you deal with nothing and then something?
There is no unknown force, its God. How do we know? Observed and tested experinces that were written about by many of ancient brothers and sisters.
Now if I personally had to throw an idea out there it would be none other than that God is literally some energy being. Its really the only scientific explaination in that arena

 

[outhouse]

False. No animal has been observed to change into a completely different animal before our own eyes.

Please don't derail threads on topics you know little about.

Lets work with facts, not your biased opinion.

IAP - IAP Statement on the Teaching of Evolution

We agree that the following evidence-based facts about the origins and evolution of the Earth and of life on this planet have been established by numerous observations and independently derived experimental results from a multitude of scientific disciplines. Even if there are still many open questions about the precise details of evolutionary change, scientific evidence has never contradicted these results:
•In a universe that has evolved towards its present configuration for some 11 to 15 billion years, our Earth formed approximately 4.5 billion years ago.
•Since its formation, the Earth – its geology and its environments – has changed under the effect of numerous physical and chemical forces and continues to do so.
•Life appeared on Earth at least 2.5 billion years ago. The evolution, soon after, of photosynthetic organisms enabled, from at least 2 billion years ago, the slow transformation of the atmosphere to one containing substantial quantities of oxygen. In addition to the release of the oxygen that we breathe, the process of photosynthesis is the ultimate source of fixed energy and food upon which human life on the planet depends.
•Since its first appearance on Earth, life has taken many forms, all of which continue to evolve, in ways which palaeontology and the modern biological and biochemical sciences are describing and independently confirming with increasing precision. Commonalities in the structure of the genetic code of all organisms living today, including humans, clearly indicate their common primordial origin




Evolution is a Fact and a Theory

 

[Blackdog22]

False. No animal has been observed to change into a completely different animal before our own eyes.

You speak of evolution as if its some form of shape shifting power granted in fables. You really don't have any idea what evolution says do you? If you do shame on you for pushing forth such a false concept of it AKA lying. If you don't then it is best not to speak on things you don't know about. Either way, it looks bad on you.

 

[Bunyip]

False. No animal has been observed to change into a completely different animal before our own eyes. The evolution you are reffering to occurs in significantly less time than millions of years. Thats not enough to make the jump that everything works that way...
Hm so if our civilization collapsed and mankind was set back as so many other cultures were from barbarian takeovers for example, the writings of sir isaac newton, einstein, stephen hawking ect just loose their credibility overnight? Arent academia journals on paper so to speak?

An animal changing into a completely different animal before your eyes would be Harry Potter, not evolution. EVOLUTION happens to SPECIES, not individuals.

 

[Serenity7855]

False. No animal has been observed to change into a completely different animal before our own eyes. The evolution you are reffering to occurs in significantly less time than millions of years.

He has already been told, but he is so steeped in atheism that he ignores it as though you had never said it.

 

[Bunyip]

He has already been told, but he is so steeped in atheism that he ignores it as though you had never said it.

Being 'steeped in atheism' doesn't change the fact that an animal changing into another form would be contrary to evolutionary theory, not proof of it.

Do try to get past simply complaining about the nasty atheists all the time and see if you can actually engage on point.

Evolution happens to species, not individuals.