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"There is nothing that atheism (on its own) claims is 'right.' "?

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
Out to be right is different than to be right. If one belongs to Atheism, it does not come automatically for him to right. There are no positive evidences for him to be "ought to be right", simply rejecting others does not make one right, one could be as wrong as are others.
Regards
This that you are saying, @paarsurrey , is inherently nonsensical.

You are confusing two very different matters with only tangential connection, and treating them as if they were one and the same thing.

One is the state of being an atheist, which is very simple and really ought not to confuse theists nearly as much as it apparently does. An atheist lacks belief in deities. It is really that simple. There are no claims, no need for support, no consequences. Nothing. You might perhaps decide for whatever reason to doubt one's sincerity, but even that is at the very least weird.

The second is whether there is, in fact, some deity. That is not atheism, nor is that even theism. It is instead a matter for theology to deal with. The presumed existence is not at all the same thing as the belief in existence - at least if it is a God such as that which Ibrahim declared that we are talking about.

It is really way too much, bordering into if not being abuse outright, to expect an atheist to feel any duty to justify, evidence or even "prove" his or her own atheism. One's word is plenty enough.

Frankly, this expectation from some theists that we should "embrace God" for apparently no sound reason is as puzzling as it is abusive. And it does not help that it usually comes from people who show quite patently to have little clue of the very nature of atheism.
 

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
Then why do they hold debates, join discussions, write essays and books ridicule the revealed religions so often actively. They may rest in peace in Atheism, no compulsions however, please .
Regards
Mainly because we exist in often abusively theistic societies that will restrain our rights on behalf of their theism and its worst consequences if we do not speak our minds.

In essence, we are victims acting in self-defense.
 

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
"It (Atheism) no more makes claims about morality"
Can then Atheism and people belonging to it be immoral? I don't believe that, please.

Regards
Of course there are immoral people who happen to be atheists.

IMO not nearly as often than among theists, but certainly some.

Why would we be guarded against immorality?
 

paarsurrey

Veteran Member
Of course there are immoral people who happen to be atheists.

IMO not nearly as often than among theists, but certainly some.

Why would we be guarded against immorality?

The world is to guard against dangerous as well as the immoral persons whether they belong to the Theists or the Atheists equitably, there should not be any preferential treatment to any group. Right, please?
Regards
 

paarsurrey

Veteran Member
Mainly because we exist in often abusively theistic societies that will restrain our rights on behalf of their theism and its worst consequences if we do not speak our minds.

In essence, we are victims acting in self-defense.
So, in self-defense, under persecution and when one's life is in danger one could speak out and raise an armed struggle against the oppressors. Right, please?
Regards
 

Darkstorn

This shows how unique i am.
So, in self-defense, under persecution and when one's life is in danger one could speak out and raise an armed struggle against the oppressors. Right, please?
Regards

Way to take the whole thing way overboard. What is it with your hyperbole and rhetoric? Do you get something out of it?

But yeah, i assume it's expected of humans in general to resist oppression. The worse the oppression, the worst the resisting.

I mean, duhhhhh.
 

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
The world is to guard against dangerous as well as the immoral persons whether they belong to the Theists or the Atheists equitably, there should not be any preferential treatment to any group. Right, please?
Regards
Of course. If I may ask, would you mind elaborating on what would an immoral person be like?

I have reason to suspect that you may be understanding the word "immoral" differently than I do.
 

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
So, in self-defense, under persecution and when one's life is in danger one could speak out and raise an armed struggle against the oppressors. Right, please?
Regards
No, that is not at all right.

There is a famous Muslim who knew that very well. You may have heard me mention Bacha / Badshah Khan some time or another. Quite the inspiring man.
 

ChristineM

"Be strong", I whispered to my coffee.
Premium Member
That's actually pretty interesting, i was under the impression that at that time most Neanderthals and even modern humans were actually nomadic.

But yeah, to me civilization began "differently" in different places. For one, there are cave drawings only around 6000 years old close to where i live.... Around the time when the first cities were already exercising their power on their neighbors.

Too me too, one of my hobbies the cro magnon era, cave paintings abound where i live. When i came across Roque Saint-Christophe it's easy to see why it was chosen as a permanent site. Its been in continuous use as a settlement/stronghold from Neanderthal times up to 1955.
 

ChristineM

"Be strong", I whispered to my coffee.
Premium Member
Interesting. Is this really a permanent Neanderthal site, or a seasonal camp?
Many sites like caves and rock shelters were temporary or seasonal habitations, even if they were used for centuries. Hunter-gatherers need to migrate as they exhaust local resources.
And what people didn't have burial rites?

Archeological digs examining bones and waste suggests permanent.
 

`mud

Just old
Premium Member
Back to the OP
The thought one is absolutely `right` on any subject, is totaly ignorant to start with.
Thinking that books of religious teaching are trustable, is somewhat foolish.
Hearing your parent's teachings about your `soul or spirit` could be true.
Thinking about your inner feelings of the cognizance within your `soul or spirit`,
could be a true indication of your destiny, with or without your `soul or spirit`.
Thinking that there is no proof that `gods` exist, is almost provably unprovable.
On the other hand, beliefs in `gods` can't do any harm, can they ?
When you get there, email me >[email protected]<,
No spam please !
The only claim I have on life is the stuff within it, nothing is absolutely `right`.
 

ChristineM

"Be strong", I whispered to my coffee.
Premium Member
Then why do they hold debates, join discussions, write essays and books ridicule the revealed religions so often actively. They may rest in peace in Atheism, no compulsions however, please .
Regards


As for debates etc, im sure you would agree that everyone is individual. As an atheist i can assure you that i have never written a book on the subjective... The only discussions and debates i have been involved in is on forums like this when (usually) a religious poster will make some insulating remark about atheism or misrepresent it.

As to ridiculing religions, you get what you pay for. Consider your own actions regarding the prolific anti atheist threads you have posted over the last couple of weeks.

Much that it is good fun pointing out your (and many others) errors, misrepresentations, hyperbole, ad hominem and outright lies, it never seems to make any difference to the deliberate ignorant some people show to about atheism
 

Shushersbedamned

Well-Known Member
In essence, we are victims acting in self-defense.
download-6.jpg
 

FlyingTeaPot

Irrational Rationalist. Educated Fool.
Then why do they hold debates, join discussions, write essays and books ridicule the revealed religions so often actively. They may rest in peace in Atheism, no compulsions however, please .
Regards
Maybe because you're confusing the denizens of this forum with the general public.
 
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