Thinking of religions and science as world views hides their light and makes them harmful

[Jim]

What I’m proposing is for people to never think of anything they say, or that others say, as “scientific” or “unscientific,” and never label anything they say, or that others say, with the name of a religion. Just try it and give it a test. Try it for three weeks. You might like it. If anyone tries it for three weeks and doesn’t like it, please tell me.

You may like it in a house.
You may like it with a mouse.
You may like it in a fog.
You may like it with a dog.
You may like it in a flood.
You may like it in the mud.
You may like it in a tree.
Try it, try it! You will see!

 

[PureX]

Ah yes, the grim chimera of scientism again
raises its phantasmagorical head.

If people "do it all the time", could'st give
one example?

Yes, it shows up regularly here on RF. But when you refuse to recognize it, it's very hard to see.

 

[Audie]

Yes, it shows up regularly here on RF. But when you refuse to recognize it, it's very hard to see.

Not that you could come up with an example, of course,
but anyway-

Im sure you'd say the same if Elves were your thing.

 

[Jim]

Not that you could come up with an example, of course,
but anyway-

Im sure you'd say the same if Elves were your thing.

Audie, you light up my life in these forums. Seriously.

I’d like to make you one of my gods, along with @Revoltingest and @PopeADope , so I can have a trinity. Is that okay with you? I’m not sure why I’m asking for your permission. I never asked them. @Revoltingest always answers my prayers though. I’m hoping that means it’s okay.

 

[Audie]

Audie, you light up my life in these forums. Seriously.

I’d like to make you one of my gods, along with @Revoltingest and @PopeADope , so I can have a trinity. Is that okay with you? I’m not sure why I’m asking for your permission. I never asked them. @Revoltingest always answers my prayers though. I’m hoping that means it’s okay.

Do as you please.

If mercilessly roasting you when your
oars is catrchin' crabs lights up your life,
great.

A rare attitude, for sure.

 

[PureX]

Not that you could come up with an example, of course,
but anyway-

Im sure you'd say the same if Elves were your thing.

You're free to be as sure as you like.

 

[Audie]

You're free to be as sure as you like.

And you are free to make up facts as it suits you.
Just dont feel you are free from occasionally being called
on it.

 

[Jim]

((In another thread I said that it grieves me to see people with so little respect for honest and responsible research, and for people who do it, using its name in such despicable ways, even if it is only a game. To be fair I also want to say that it grieves me to see people with so little respect for the stories, the scriptures and most of the followers of each religion, using its name in such despicable ways, even if it is only a game.))

 

[Jim]

((I appeal to the best in each person to spend some time reading the stories at the heart of whatever religion whose name you’re wearing, then do some soul-searching about the ways you’re using it’s name, even if all this is only a game for you.))

 

[charlie sc]

It looks to me like thinking of religions and science as belief systems and world views hides their light, makes them harmful and destructive, and is contrary to the purposes of the kind of religion and the kind of science that benefit people and society.

Umm, there seems to be a contraction in your OP. Let's, for arguments sake, say that science and religion are worldviews. I do tend to agree with this statement anyway.

How can you benefit society with religion and science if you are not thinking of it and using it as a belief system in the first place?

 

[Jim]

Umm, there seems to be a contraction in your OP. Let's, for arguments sake, say that science and religion are worldviews. I do tend to agree with this statement anyway.

How can you benefit society with religion and science if you are not thinking of it and using it as a belief system in the first place?

I looked at the OP and I couldn’t find any contractions.

I’m not saying that science and religion are world views. I’m saying not to think of them as world views. Not to think of religions as belief systems, and not to think of science as things that we know about the world.

Of all the things that people call “science,” what I think is beneficial is honest and responsible research, and reporting the results. Of all the things that people call “religion,” what I think is beneficial is honest and responsible learning, from religions stories and scriptures, how to live the best life we can.

 

[Spirit of Light]

I looked at the OP and I couldn’t find any contractions.

I’m not saying that science and religion are world views. I’m saying not to think of them as world views. Not to think of religions as belief systems, and not to think of science as things that we know about the world.

Of all the things that people call “science,” what I think is beneficial is honest and responsible research, and reporting the results. Of all the things that people call “religion,” what I think is beneficial is honest and responsible learning, from religions stories and scriptures, how to live the best life we can.

Isn't that what actually happens already? People, who are scientists study the chosen field within their science study?
And religious people study the scriptures and try to become better human beings.

 

[charlie sc]

world view in British
or world-view (wɜːld vjuː)
noun
the way that someone perceives the world
their Christian world view
Many artists express their world view in their work.

World view definition and meaning | Collins English Dictionary

from religions stories and scriptures, how to live the best life we can.

Umm, but this is a worldview.

what I think is beneficial is honest and responsible research, and reporting the results.

Though, the scientific method can be used in various ways to measure reality(E.G. analytical thinking or methods of thinking). So it can be used outside of academia.

 

[Jim]

@charlie sc @Amanaki If you want to understand what I’m saying, you might need some more context. I would like people to try not labeling views in their minds with the names of religions, not to think of any views as “Hindu views,” “Buddhist views,” “Christian views,” “Muslim views,” or views of any other religion. I would also like people to try not labeling views in their minds as “scientific” and “unscientific.” I want to make sure that’s clear, and answer any questions you might have about it, before I try to answer any other questions.

If anyone sees this who already does not label any views as “scientific” or “unscientific,” or with the names of religions, I would be very glad to see comments from you.

 

[Jim]

Isn't that what actually happens already? People, who are scientists study the chosen field within their science study?
And religious people study the scriptures and try to become better human beings.

Yes.

 

[Spirit of Light]

Yes.

So where is the problem then?
If someone follows a path that is called Christianity, Buddhism, Hinduism, Jewish or other they would make comments from their religious view, would they not?

Of course, you could call all Asian spiritual paths for Dharma but how would we know what part of dharma they talk about? Because the teachings are different in Hinduism and Buddhism and daoism as examples.

Or are you seeking one answer to everything within a religious path?

Or within science, someone who study geology and one who study genes are both scientists but they are in different field of it and have different education, so even both are scientists they are not same kind of scientists

 

[charlie sc]

@charlie sc @Amanaki If you want to understand what I’m saying, you might need some more context. I would like people to try not labeling views in their minds with the names of religions, not to think of any views as “Hindu views,” “Buddhist views,” “Christian views,” “Muslim views,” or views of any other religion. I would also like people to try not labeling views in their minds as “scientific” and “unscientific.” I want to make sure that’s clear, and answer any questions you might have about it, before I try to answer any other questions.

I don't understand why labelling views is a bad thing. Do you consider it a bad thing?

 

[charlie sc]

So where is the problem then?
If someone follows a path that is called Christianity, Buddhism, Hinduism, Jewish or other they would make comments from their religious view, would they not?

Of course, you could call all Asian spiritual paths for Dharma but how would we know what part of dharma they talk about? Because the teachings are different in Hinduism and Buddhism and daoism as examples.

Or are you seeking one answer to everything within a religious path?

Or within science, someone who study geology and one who study genes are both scientists but they are in different field of it and have different education, so even both are scientists they are not same kind of scientists

Lol I didn't even read your post but we're in sync

 

[Spirit of Light]

Lol I didn't even read your post but we're in sync

Did you read my mind

 

[charlie sc]

Did you read my mind

Maybe

You're views are fairly non-judgemental, so it makes sense why you'd take the inquisitive approach and why our views are similar. This is also why I like Buddhism.